Poll

Who do you think will be sworn in as President on Jan. 21?

Biden
- 14 (66.7%)
Trump
- 7 (33.3%)

Total Members Voted: 21

Voting closed: November 02, 2020, 06:25:59 pm


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Author Topic: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)  (Read 268235 times)

faberryman

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2260 on: October 14, 2020, 04:58:23 pm »

Lindsey Graham, a Republican senator from South Carolina, made some quip about "the good old days of segregation". That's a bit like referring to the ante bellum period as "the good old days of slavery". He has a Black challenger, Jamie Harrison, and the race is neck and neck. Naturally, he got called out on it. He is invoking the sarcasm defense. That's the defense Trump used to explain his comment about injecting disinfectant into the lungs of COVID patients, so you know just how persuasive that is. Anyway, you don't have to be a genius to know that it is racially insensitive to make such a comment even if you are being sarcastic. You have to ask how the thought even entered his consciousness. That just may have tipped the race in the challenger's favor.

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/10/14/graham-clarifies-comments-segreation-429452

« Last Edit: October 14, 2020, 05:58:44 pm by faberryman »
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Alan Klein

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2261 on: October 14, 2020, 05:04:24 pm »

I get a little tired of hearing you say this, especially since Biden kicked Trump's ass in the debate, but all righty, maybe you have some special medical insight that ignores the fact that Biden is a stutterer (and that stuttering has no effect on the intellect) and goes straight to the non-fake fact that he really is a bit dim. Ronald Reagan was demonstrably senile and yet remains a Republican star, because he was surrounded by at least marginally competent administrators. The clowns, fools, grifters, thieves, sexual criminals and family members who surround Trump couldn't administrate a Band-Aid application. If Biden is a dimwit surrounded by able people, we'll be a hell of a lot better off than with any Trump.
I think you made the case for me.

Craig Lamson

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2262 on: October 14, 2020, 05:16:38 pm »

Dude.  You have to go back FOURTY ONE YEARS to find the last time that happened.  For many middle-aged voters, the Republicans have NEVER been the more fiscally responsible party.  Like ever.  In their whole lives. That's humiliating.

What's humiliating is that neither party is fiscally responsible.  When was the last time Congress actually passed a budget, as if that means anything to them anyway. We can't count on either side to do the right thing.
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BobShaw

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2263 on: October 14, 2020, 05:47:06 pm »

I was watching the news this morning in Australia and there was a political commentator from the US on. He described Trump as being "Unburdened by facts".
I like that description. It could be used often in this forum.
As has been said many times before, with a population of 300 million people, surely you can come up with two better candidates to save the planet.
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LesPalenik

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2264 on: October 14, 2020, 05:49:13 pm »

You may be right.  But Biden isn't equiped to be president.  People will have to decide.

Strange things can happen. Trump wasn't equipped to be president either, and he became one.
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Craig Lamson

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2265 on: October 14, 2020, 05:53:31 pm »

I was watching the news this morning in Australia and there was a political commentator from the US on. He described Trump as being "Unburdened by facts".
I like that description. It could be used often in this forum.
As has been said many times before, with a population of 300 million people, surely you can come up with two better candidates to save the planet.

Since when is it the responsibility of the US to "save the planet"
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faberryman

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2266 on: October 14, 2020, 06:01:42 pm »

Since when is it the responsibility of the US to "save the planet"

I don' think the responsibility falls solely on the United States. We should do our part and others should do their part. Maybe we could enter into an accord or something to coordinate our efforts.
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Craig Lamson

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2267 on: October 14, 2020, 06:04:20 pm »

I don' think the responsibility falls solely on the United States. We should do our part and others should do their part. Maybe we could enter into an accord or something to coordinate our efforts.

Yea thats the ticket. Its sure to work.
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MattBurt

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2268 on: October 14, 2020, 06:25:41 pm »

I don' think the responsibility falls solely on the United States. We should do our part and others should do their part. Maybe we could enter into an accord or something to coordinate our efforts.

Oui oui!
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TechTalk

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2269 on: October 14, 2020, 06:42:30 pm »

I get a little tired of hearing you say this, especially since Biden kicked Trump's ass in the debate, but all righty, maybe you have some special medical insight that ignores the fact that Biden is a stutterer (and that stuttering has no effect on the intellect) and goes straight to the non-fake fact that he really is a bit dim. Ronald Reagan was demonstrably senile and yet remains a Republican star, because he was surrounded by at least marginally competent administrators. The clowns, fools, grifters, thieves, sexual criminals and family members who surround Trump couldn't administrate a Band-Aid application. If Biden is a dimwit surrounded by able people, we'll be a hell of a lot better off than with any Trump.

While Biden is not an academic star like Bill Clinton (Rhodes Scholar) or Barack Obama (President Harvard Law Review), he did graduate with dual majors in history and political science, obtained a law degree, and won a U.S. Senate seat by the age of 29. That would be hard to achieve for most people and pretty much impossible for someone a bit dim. He was an average student in college, so it's only by comparison to brilliant academic careers, like the two that I mentioned, that there is any dimness in his achievements.

Academic achievement is only one measure by which to predict success for a President. To use Washington as an example, he was sorely lacking in education and intellectual brilliance in comparison to those he surrounded himself with both as a military leader and as President. What he lacked in formal education and innate intellect was more than compensated for by his exceptional judgement. He frequently elicited the advice of others with conflicting opinions (the first signal of good judgement) and then used his own judgement to chart a course. He persuaded Hamilton, his former chief staff aide during the war, and Jefferson to join his first cabinet as President. These two extremely intelligent men held opposing opinions on nearly everything and Washington sought both of their opinions on important matters in order to get a full airing of issues before making his own judgement. All-in-all, Washington was quite successful in his use of the brilliance with which he surrounded himself.

What Biden brings to the table is vast amounts of experience and the ability to see what is working or not working, admit mistakes, and make corrections. He also has a tremendous amount of what is often called "emotional intelligence" which has given him the ability to build relationships, friendships, and successful negotiating skills across party lines and ideological boundaries. Mitch McConnell has stated, on more than one occasion, that he considers Biden both a friend and a valued negotiating partner on difficult issues. He's not the only Republican, or Democrat for that matter, that holds that opinion of Biden. A major reason that Obama chose him as VP was observing those skills when they served together in the Senate and he utilized Biden as both a Congressional negotiator as well as a close advisor. As I mentioned in an earlier post, Obama would have been better served, at times, had he followed Biden's assessment and judgement rather than those of his military advisors.

In stark contrast to Trump, Biden is wise enough and humble enough to know that he's not a genius. But, he's also smart enough to recognize the qualities that he does bring to the table and has the ability to listen to and appreciate others with knowledge and experience that is different from his own. He is a moderate at a time when many are looking for moderation; is capable of humility at a time when many have grown weary of boasting; and empathetic at a time when empathy is a needed ingredient in many citizens personal lives and in the national discourse.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2020, 08:42:09 pm by TechTalk »
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John Camp

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2270 on: October 14, 2020, 06:59:41 pm »

I agree with all of the TechTalk post just above; I think people may be mis-reading my post that quoted Alan. I don't think Biden is dim, I was simply saying that even if you accept Alan's absurd assertion that he is, he'd be better than Trump.
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TechTalk

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2271 on: October 14, 2020, 07:06:10 pm »

I agree with all of the TechTalk post just above; I think people may be mis-reading my post that quoted Alan. I don't think Biden is dim, I was simply saying that even if you accept Alan's absurd assertion that he is, he'd be better than Trump.

I do realize the point that you were making and was just providing additional perspective and detail to it. Thanks.
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TechTalk

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2272 on: October 14, 2020, 07:31:54 pm »

I think you made the case for me.

You might try thinking again. I don't think that it could do you any harm.
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chez

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2273 on: October 14, 2020, 09:00:50 pm »

Strange things can happen. Trump wasn't equipped to be president either, and he became one.

Becoming the president and being equipped are two different things...Trump has proven that.
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Alan Klein

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2274 on: October 15, 2020, 09:19:01 am »

Biden's getting senile.  The other day he couldn't remember the name of Mitt Romney his opponent in the 2012 election.  He called him "that governor, the Mormon" as he struggled to remember the name.  At a speech a few days ago he told the crowd how he was running for the senate.  (He was one for decades before being VP).   

Arguing college is OK but it's not nearly as important as toughness, clarity, being sharp, and able to execute and work hard.  Common sense is an attribute other politicians don't' have having never worked in private industry.  Biden doesn't show any of these things.  He'll be a caretaker president, something America and the world doesn;t need with an expanding China and dangerous economic times. Trump has kept the peace, gotten us out of war, ran an effective economy until Covid, and still has at 74 the toughness, clarity, sharpness and ability to execute. 

Democrats are making it seem the election is about For Trump or Against TRump.  Well, there is no Against Trump check box on the ballot.  You have to vote for someone who will be president.  So checking off Biden has to be done.  So you have to make a affirmative choice between two people.

That's the decision.

« Last Edit: October 15, 2020, 09:22:20 am by Alan Klein »
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Manoli

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2275 on: October 15, 2020, 09:50:51 am »


Latest fx reports confirm that there has been a shift in investment patterns over recent weeks from US government bonds and tech stocks to buying shares in smaller companies. [ note: the S&P500 is up 9% since September. ]

Analyst reports indicating both moves are based on signs [in polling] of voters’ intentions and predictive markets that suggest Biden should win the presidency and his party wins control of both houses of Congress in a so-called “blue wave” victory on 3 November.

Jan Hatzius, the chief economist at Goldman Sachs, on record this month as saying  “ a blue wave would likely prompt us to upgrade our [US economic growth] forecasts. “
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PeterAit

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2276 on: October 15, 2020, 10:22:41 am »

I was watching the news this morning in Australia and there was a political commentator from the US on. He described Trump as being "Unburdened by facts".
I like that description. It could be used often in this forum.
As has been said many times before, with a population of 300 million people, surely you can come up with two better candidates to save the planet.

Fiction writers should be "unburdened by facts." Not presidents.
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Alan Klein

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2277 on: October 15, 2020, 10:24:59 am »

Latest fx reports confirm that there has been a shift in investment patterns over recent weeks from US government bonds and tech stocks to buying shares in smaller companies. [ note: the S&P500 is up 9% since September. ]

Analyst reports indicating both moves are based on signs [in polling] of voters’ intentions and predictive markets that suggest Biden should win the presidency and his party wins control of both houses of Congress in a so-called “blue wave” victory on 3 November.

Jan Hatzius, the chief economist at Goldman Sachs, on record this month as saying  “ a blue wave would likely prompt us to upgrade our [US economic growth] forecasts. “

What the stock market "experts" think is that Biden and a Democrat controlled Congress will print more so-called "stimulus" money than Trump and the Republicans.  That will help fill the stock market bubble and keep markets inflated.  That's an illusion.  It's a fake "high".

Inflation is going to raise the price of goods eventually making the dollar less valuable.  People will have less "real" money to buy things lowering corporate profits as sales collapse.  Also, the Democrats want to raise business taxes and will increase regulation.  Both moves will lower corporate earnings forcing stock prices even lower.  Gold as a hedge might be a better investment.  But I've been wrong before. 

PeterAit

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2278 on: October 15, 2020, 10:28:40 am »

Since when is it the responsibility of the US to "save the planet"

It's not our sole responsibility. But it is our responsibility to help. And to not, as has happened under Cheeto, to drag things backwards.
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Peter McLennan

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Re: US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)
« Reply #2279 on: October 15, 2020, 11:08:00 am »

Biden's getting senile.

I'd love to see your medical qualifications for that hyperbolic assertion.

A couple of years ago, in front of a dozen of my friends at my birthday party, I couldn't recall Bob Dylan's name.  I ain't senile.

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