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Author Topic: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa  (Read 270317 times)

Manoli

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12040 on: October 27, 2021, 04:23:55 pm »

Excellent, TechTalk.  For the considerable amount of work to accumulate, curate and post all that evidence, thank you.

I’d very much wish to add my appreciation too, not just for ‘yet another debunking’ of Klein’s piffle but for TechTalk’s sustained and informative posts throughout.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2021, 04:31:09 pm by Manoli »
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josh.reichmann

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12041 on: October 27, 2021, 04:38:26 pm »

Has this thread exhausted itself?
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TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12042 on: October 27, 2021, 04:45:22 pm »

This thread has sometimes been exhausting, but whether it has exhausted itself is likely up to you. Otherwise, I suspect people will continue to post in it. Politics has rarely been a hotter topic than it is today.
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LesPalenik

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12043 on: October 27, 2021, 05:50:37 pm »

Has this thread exhausted itself?

In one year since the election, the Trump posts have almost exhausted themselves. We could use a different coffee topic.
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TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12044 on: October 27, 2021, 06:16:32 pm »

There are already several topics in the The Coffee Corner. You can always start a new topic yourself in The Coffee Corner or any of the other sections.

What topic would you like to discuss? Just start it and others will likely join in to post.
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TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12045 on: October 27, 2021, 06:19:42 pm »

I’d very much wish to add my appreciation too

Thanks. We all do our part. I enjoy reading your posts as well.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12046 on: October 27, 2021, 07:29:39 pm »

Don't worry! Janet Yellen says that this is just a transitory inflation. Everything should return to normal in a few months.
Great.  I think I'll lease a car from her. 

Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12047 on: October 27, 2021, 07:40:37 pm »

Do you mean Janet Yellen? That's doesn't appear to be a very accurate paraphrasing of her remarks.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/10/05/yellen-sees-inflation-staying-higher-for-the-next-several-months

Yellen told CNBC that the various issues that have colluded to push up prices likely will pass though she’s not sure how long that will take.

“Supply bottlenecks have developed that have caused inflation,” she said during a live “Squawk Box” interview. “I believe that they’re transitory, but that doesn’t mean they’ll go away over the next several months.”


Yellen is disembling.  She knows better as a former Fed chair and economic expert.  Bottlenecks don't create inflation. They may raise prices.  But that's not inflation.  This is Yellen and the Fed trying to blame others for their printing to avoid responsibility for rising prices. Since she now represents the Demcoratic administration, she's coming up with lame excuses to defend the inflation. 

Inflation is a monetary issue created by the Fed pushed by deficit spending of politicians.   It's adding too much money to the money supply to cover expenditures above tax revenue.  Inflation is the cause and prices changing are the effects. Of course, other things can raise and lower prices such as bottlenecks, war, droughts, labor strikes, etc.  These are economic effects of the market but do not generally affect the value of the currency. Their effects are usually local and short-lived.  Inflation, adding money, generally raises the prices of most things as the currency itself is devalued.   

Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12048 on: October 27, 2021, 07:52:48 pm »



That seems reasonable. The pandemic caused a sharp decrease in economic activity which has since resumed with some rapidity. That's caused a large economic shock wave that will take time to resolve, but there's no reason to anticipate that it's permanent.

From the CNN article that you linked...

US inflation levels are not expected to decrease to acceptable levels until the latter part of 2022, Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen said Sunday.

Yellen said she expects the bottlenecks to subside as progress is made on the coronavrius pandemic and she predicted that Americans will return to the workforce as conditions improve. Asked about the record number of Americans leaving jobs and what the Biden administration is doing to get people back to work, Yellen said, "We have a good, tight labor market."

"Firms are obviously having trouble hiring workers, but labor supply is depressed by the pandemic," she said. "That's because of health concerns, because of childcare, and as we get beyond the pandemic, I expect labor supply to increase."


But, she didn't say...

US inflation levels are not expected to decrease to acceptable levels until the latter part of 2022, Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen said Sunday.



If the Fed keeps printing to cover new infrastructure and social spending bills because a Democratic Congress and the president add them to an already high deficit spending budget, higher prices due to inflation will continue. Price increases are going to hurt the Democrats in the 2022 election. 

Of course, The Fed claims it's going to decrease printing to zero some time in 2022.  It was running $120 billion a month.   Once that happens they'll start raising interest rates which will dampen increases as well.  The point is they can't do those things if Congress is spending like crazy.  Voters aren't going to be happy.

TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12049 on: October 27, 2021, 08:09:57 pm »

An interesting article from NPR's All Things Considered program on decades of disinformation regarding fossil fuels and climate change.

https://www.npr.org/2021/10/27/1047583610/once-again-the-u-s-has-failed-to-take-sweeping-climate-action-heres-why

How decades of disinformation about fossil fuels halted U.S. climate policy

On Thursday, House Democrats will look into what they describe as the oil industry's decades of disinformation and misrepresentation to delay climate action. They have called executives from Exxon Mobil, BP America, Chevron Corp. and Shell Oil to testify. The meeting, Democrats say, is modeled on a historic hearing more than 25 years ago that held the tobacco industry to account for misleading the public about the harmful effects of smoking.

Two names likely to come up at the hearing are Charles and David Koch, the conservative petrochemical magnates. They have poured millions of dollars into efforts to discredit the science of climate change. The brothers have given over $145 million to climate-change-denying think tanks and advocacy groups between 1997 and 2018. The Kochs were joined in their efforts by Exxon, which has given nearly $37 million over the same time to spread climate misinformation.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12050 on: October 27, 2021, 08:22:16 pm »

An interesting article from NPR's All Things Considered program on decades of disinformation regarding fossil fuels and climate change.

https://www.npr.org/2021/10/27/1047583610/once-again-the-u-s-has-failed-to-take-sweeping-climate-action-heres-why

How decades of disinformation about fossil fuels halted U.S. climate policy

On Thursday, House Democrats will look into what they describe as the oil industry's decades of disinformation and misrepresentation to delay climate action. They have called executives from Exxon Mobil, BP America, Chevron Corp. and Shell Oil to testify. The meeting, Democrats say, is modeled on a historic hearing more than 25 years ago that held the tobacco industry to account for misleading the public about the harmful effects of smoking.

Two names likely to come up at the hearing are Charles and David Koch, the conservative petrochemical magnates. They have poured millions of dollars into efforts to discredit the science of climate change. The brothers have given over $145 million to climate-change-denying think tanks and advocacy groups between 1997 and 2018. The Kochs were joined in their efforts by Exxon, which has given nearly $37 million over the same time to spread climate misinformation.

Charles Koch is 86.  David is dead.  Maybe it was smog or too much CO2. 

In any case, how about the millions the liberal Soros gave to campaigns and organizations to push his left-wing ideas?  Do you want to eliminate information by people who have axes to grind?  Which side would you allow?   Isn;t that what's America is about - listening to all sides of issues?   Different people with different viewpoints trying to advertise their beliefs?  That's freedom of speech.  In any case, there are millions that were spent by people with opposing ideas on both sides of issues.  That's how Democracy works. Why do you want to shut down open debate?  You expound for that here on LuLa as well.  Why?  You seem to be a guy who likes to debate.  So shouldn't everyone have their right to argue their points?  What you have to do is just argue your points better. 

TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12051 on: October 27, 2021, 08:32:18 pm »

QAnon candidates running for Secretary of State offices.

https://www.vice.com/en/article/bvngwq/trump-backed-qanon-candidates-announce-coalition-at-conference

Trump-Backed QAnon Candidates Launch Group to ‘Control the Election System’

A Nevada secretary of state candidate announced at a QAnon conference he’s launched a new group with support from three Trump-endorsed candidates—and Mike Lindell.

Jim Caviezel’s QAnon Guru Wants to Control Elections

https://www.thedailybeast.com/jim-caviezels-qanon-guru-juan-savin-wants-to-control-elections

According to Marchant, Savin recruited him and several other secretary of state candidates, including Hamm, to run in 2022. While Hamm is unlikely to win in heavily Democratic California, one of Savin’s picks, Arizona state Rep. Mark Finchem (R), has been endorsed by Donald Trump and is shaping up to be a strong primary contender.

Marchant claimed that Savin’s coalition held a meeting with MAGA luminaries like MyPillow CEO Mike Lindell, former Overstock.com CEO Patrick Byrne, and The Gateway Pundit blogger Jim Hoft to plot out the secretary of state bids. In his speech, Marchant made clear the goal of Savin’s push for new candidates: controlling elections in 2024.

“I can’t stress enough how important the secretary of state offices are,” Marchant said. “I think they are the most important election in our country in 2022. And why is that? We control the election system.”

Savin’s name came up again at another panel at the convention, with members of his secretary of state slate praising his claims that top members of the “deep state” will face justice in Guantanamo Bay military tribunals, a key QAnon tenet.
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Robert Roaldi

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12052 on: October 27, 2021, 09:57:48 pm »

QAnon candidates running for Secretary of State offices.

https://www.vice.com/en/article/bvngwq/trump-backed-qanon-candidates-announce-coalition-at-conference

Trump-Backed QAnon Candidates Launch Group to ‘Control the Election System’

A Nevada secretary of state candidate announced at a QAnon conference he’s launched a new group with support from three Trump-endorsed candidates—and Mike Lindell.

Jim Caviezel’s QAnon Guru Wants to Control Elections

https://www.thedailybeast.com/jim-caviezels-qanon-guru-juan-savin-wants-to-control-elections

According to Marchant, Savin recruited him and several other secretary of state candidates, including Hamm, to run in 2022. While Hamm is unlikely to win in heavily Democratic California, one of Savin’s picks, Arizona state Rep. Mark Finchem (R), has been endorsed by Donald Trump and is shaping up to be a strong primary contender.

Marchant claimed that Savin’s coalition held a meeting with MAGA luminaries like MyPillow CEO Mike Lindell, former Overstock.com CEO Patrick Byrne, and The Gateway Pundit blogger Jim Hoft to plot out the secretary of state bids. In his speech, Marchant made clear the goal of Savin’s push for new candidates: controlling elections in 2024.

“I can’t stress enough how important the secretary of state offices are,” Marchant said. “I think they are the most important election in our country in 2022. And why is that? We control the election system.”

Savin’s name came up again at another panel at the convention, with members of his secretary of state slate praising his claims that top members of the “deep state” will face justice in Guantanamo Bay military tribunals, a key QAnon tenet.



Remember the good ole days when people would make fun of the corrupt governments in shit hole countries.  :)


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Peter McLennan

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12053 on: October 27, 2021, 11:58:45 pm »

Different people with different viewpoints trying to advertise their beliefs?  That's freedom of speech.  In any case, there are millions that were spent by people with opposing ideas on both sides of issues.

Please show us *data that compares the monies spent trying to "advertise their beliefs" by both the petrochemical industries and the climate activists over the last few decades. 

*Data = proven,validated facts, not estimates or opinions.

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LesPalenik

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12054 on: October 28, 2021, 03:35:00 am »

The "transitory inflation" reminds me of the introduction of US federal income tax in 1913. They called it also a temporary tax.

Quote
America's first citizens enjoyed very few taxes. But as time went on, more levies were added—federal income tax, the alternative minimum tax, corporate tax, estate tax, the Federal Insurance Contributions Act (FICA), and so on. Some were increased, while others were repealed—only to be added again.

https://www.investopedia.com/articles/tax/10/history-taxes.asp
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PeterAit

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12055 on: October 28, 2021, 10:16:50 am »

If the Fed keeps printing to cover new infrastructure and social spending bills because a Democratic Congress and the president add them to an already high deficit spending budget, higher prices due to inflation will continue. Price increases are going to hurt the Democrats in the 2022 election. 

Of course, The Fed claims it's going to decrease printing to zero some time in 2022.  It was running $120 billion a month.   Once that happens they'll start raising interest rates which will dampen increases as well.  The point is they can't do those things if Congress is spending like crazy.  Voters aren't going to be happy.

You want to prevent the dreaded "printing" to cover infrastructure and social spending bills? Then tell the GOP to support increased taxes on the wealthy and increased IRS funding to catch more tax cheats.
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TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12056 on: October 28, 2021, 10:22:17 am »

The "transitory inflation" reminds me of the introduction of US federal income tax in 1913. They called it also a temporary tax.

Driving your Tesla wouldn't have been nearly as much fun on the roads available in 1913. Then again, 1913 was itself transitory being followed by 1914 which introduced us to a new term, World War. But, then came 1915.

I guess to be fair, a lot of things changed in the 108-years that have followed since 1913. Then again, a lot had changed during the 108-years that preceded 1913. In 1805 Jefferson was president and Lewis and Clark were trying to discover what lay in the wilderness west of the Mississippi River.

I guess a great many things change over time.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12057 on: October 28, 2021, 10:27:53 am »

Please show us *data that compares the monies spent trying to "advertise their beliefs" by both the petrochemical industries and the climate activists over the last few decades. 

*Data = proven,validated facts, not estimates or opinions.


Quick questions.  How many ads and articles describing "good" oil have you seen vs ads, articles and documentaries showing how bad oil is? The airwaves are so overwhelmed with climate change caused by fossil fuels. 

The fact is we're not getting enough of the other side of the issue.  How CO2 has increased the greening of the earth by 30% and extended populations of all species.  Sure, there's been some flooding and burning that might be ascribed to warming.  But a little warming is good especially for Canadians who might not have to travel anymore to Florida in the winter.  :)

TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12058 on: October 28, 2021, 10:30:00 am »

Please show us *data that compares the monies spent trying to "advertise their beliefs" by both the petrochemical industries and the climate activists over the last few decades. 

*Data = proven,validated facts, not estimates or opinions.

Enjoy the ride.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #12059 on: October 28, 2021, 10:38:15 am »

The "transitory inflation" reminds me of the introduction of US federal income tax in 1913. They called it also a temporary tax.

https://www.investopedia.com/articles/tax/10/history-taxes.asp
The big concern about taxing unearned income suggested now for billionaires, is that similarly, it's a slippery slope.  Pretty soon they'll tax millionaires, then all the rest of the country so our 401K retirement plans will be taxed even before we use them.  Investments in stock will be taxed every year if the value goes up even before you sell it.  It's all just another way to get more taxes out of us.

Of course, that creates economic imbalances and maladjusted investments.  If they only tax liquid investments like stocks, everyone will shift to real estate causing that market to get priced out of sight.  Start-up companies and existing corporations won't be able to find investors hurting business growth and jobs.   This creates winners and losers (Real estate vs. stock) and malinvestments all caused by the government.  The negative effect with hurt the whole economy.

The right way to do it is to stop spending beyond our means.  Of course, that's too simple for all the socialists and big spenders in Washington.
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