US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)

Biden

14 (66.7%)

Trump

7 (33.3%)

Total Members Voted: 21

Voting closed: November 02, 2020, 06:25:59 pm

[jeremyrh]

Well they claim Bush handled the controls before landing.  But anyway, it was risky thing to do.  Planes crash often on carrier decks. He could have taken a safer helicopter or made the speech from land.  But he wanted the glory and photo op.

The press praised Obama for being brave and going to the dangerous Middle East to thank the troops. So Trump got out of his sick bed to thank his supporters and show America he's still doing his job.  In Washington; not dangerous Iraq. The fact is the anti Trump press turns everything he does into a negative.  Just the way it is.

Americans killed in carrier landing accidents in the last 10 years - i have no idea, maybe ... a dozen?
Americans killed by Covid-19 in the last 10 years - over 200,000

So, yeah - more or less the same.

[Alan Goldhammer]

It worked exactly like it was suppose to particularly in those elections - giving smaller states a larger edge in votes.  Our founders decided that the popular vote was not as good as the electoral system.

No, they were not.  It was to protect slavery along with the 3/5 person count for owned slaves.  Just because a decision was correct for 13 distinct states does not a priori mean that it is correct for today.  Do you think the framers of the Constitution foresaw a country that stretched three times beyond their boundaries?  Statehood decisions were constantly being made to protect slavery up to the Civil War.  West Virginia only became a state because of the war.  Why are their two Dakotas.  Why are Alaska and Hawaii states and not Puerto Rico? 

[Alan Goldhammer]

I would never go to a VA hospital even though I'm a vet. It's not safe.

What makes you think your local community hospital is any safer?

[Alan Goldhammer]

His supporters were camped out for days in front of the hospital.  He went there to show his appreciation and let them know he's getting better.  This is election season and he's trying to show that unlike Biden, he doesn't hide and despite the virus and his age, he's a vibrant, active, and effective leader not asleep at the switch.  He's working for America all the time even if he's not 100% healthy.

I happen to know something about this since I live a mile from Walter Reed. There is no room to camp out in front of the hospital at all.  There is a sidewalk and then a perimeter fence.  there were very few people there on Saturday.  A larger crowd was there on Sunday and the out of state people drove down early that morning.  He was signing blank pieces of paper when he was at a table that was supposed to show how hard he was working for America.

I also like how hard he has worked for all the coal miners which was one of his big ideas in 2016.  145 coal burning units have been shut down and another 5000 mining jobs have been lost since his inauguration.  I'm glad we have such a good businessman who makes promises in the White House.  Numbers, on the other hand, don't lie.

[faberryman]

I happen to know something about this since I live a mile from Walter Reed. There is no room to camp out in front of the hospital at all.  There is a sidewalk and then a perimeter fence.  there were very few people there on Saturday.  A larger crowd was there on Sunday and the out of state people drove down early that morning.

I heard that it was larger than Woodstock.

[unexplained link removed]

[Peter McLennan]

Well they claim Bush handled the controls before landing.  But anyway, it was risky thing to do.  Planes crash often on carrier decks. He could have taken a safer helicopter or made the speech from land.  But he wanted the glory and photo op.   In Washington; not dangerous Iraq.

I’ve “handled the controls”, too.  That doesn’t mean I can land an aircraft.

He ostentatiously carried his helmet under his arm as he walked away from the jet.  Doesn’t he have people for that?

The “Mission Accomplished” event was produced off the coast of California.  Last time I looked at a map, nowhere near Iraq.

The sign itself required significant production expertise and expense.  Designed, produced, transported and installed prior to Bush’s arrival.

And all that risk, effort and expense proved to be a lie.  Sound familiar, Alan?

.

[faberryman]

I’ve “handled the controls”, too.  That doesn’t mean I can land an aircraft. And all that risk, effort and expense proved to be a lie.  Sound familiar, Alan?

My memory is that everyone, Republicans included, thought it was an idiotic stunt at the time. It is easily in the top ten dumbest things Bush did while in office, and there is a lot of competition. Maybe there is one guy on the internet who thinks it was heroic and Bush became a media darling.

Bush was a pilot in the Texas Air National Guard after college. He flew an F-102. Apparently, he was able to take off, fly, and land his plane solo at least once. It was his way of avoiding the draft and being sent to Vietnam. Sometimes he showed up for his weekend duty; sometimes he didn't. At least he wasn't hobbling around Studio 54 on his bone spurs.

[RSL]

I'm sure glad this is "informed debate." I'd hate to see what "ignorant debate" looks like. 

[Manoli]

I'm sure glad this is "informed debate." I'd hate to see what "ignorant debate" looks like. 

If you’re looking for a balanced analysis try
https://www.economist.com/us-election-2020

[Robert Roaldi]

I would never go to a VA hospital even though I'm a vet. It's not safe.

I thought the US honoured its soldiers.

[Craig Lamson]

My memory is that everyone, Republicans included, thought it was an idiotic stunt at the time. It is easily in the top ten dumbest things Bush did while in office, and there is a lot of competition. Maybe there is one guy on the internet who thinks it was heroic and Bush became a media darling.

Bush was a pilot in the Texas Air National Guard after college. He flew an F-102. Apparently, he was able to take off, fly, and land his plane solo at least once. It was his way of avoiding the draft and being sent to Vietnam. Sometimes he showed up for his weekend duty; sometimes he didn't. At least he wasn't hobbling around Studio 54 on his bone spurs.

Could you please help me out?  I'm looking for the US military service records of Joe Biden, Barack Obama and Bill Clinton.  I'm having trouble finding them.  Do you know where they might be found?

[faberryman]

Could you please help me out?  I'm looking for the US military service records of Joe Biden, Barack Obama and Bill Clinton.  I'm having trouble finding them.  Do you know where they might be found?

I would search for them using Google. No idea what you will find, if anything.

[Robert Roaldi]

Could you please help me out?  I'm looking for the US military service records of Joe Biden, Barack Obama and Bill Clinton.  I'm having trouble finding them.  Do you know where they might be found?

I wonder if they ever insulted McCain for being captured. I wonder if they ever insulted soldiers' graves, calling them suckers.

Normally, I stay away from "what aboutism" but I did it this time, reluctantly.

[Craig Lamson]

I wonder if they ever insulted McCain for being captured. I wonder if they ever insulted soldiers' graves, calling them suckers.

Normally, I stay away from "what aboutism" but I did it this time, reluctantly.

Well we know Biden call soliders "stupid bastards". 

[Craig Lamson]

I would search for them using Google. No idea what you will find, if anything.

Well I did find that star high school athlete Joe Biden got a draft deferment after he graduated collage for asthma.

Can't find anything about him dancing.

[faberryman]

Well I did find that star high school athlete Joe Biden got a draft deferment after he graduated collage for asthma.

Can't find anything about him dancing.

Biden doesn't really seem like the dancing type. As President, I think you only have to dance the first dance at the first inauguration party you attend. It is like a wedding; you just shuffle around for a minute and you are done. I think Trump did an acceptable job. I mean it was obvious that he didn't know how to dance, but expectations are pretty low. As long as Biden doesn't let the guy who designed Sean Spicer's outfit for Dancing with the Stars dress him, I think he will be able to pull it off too. It is not exactly a Broadway show. Not that anyone will be watching inauguration party coverage anyway.

[Alan Klein]

No, they were not.  It was to protect slavery along with the 3/5 person count for owned slaves.  Just because a decision was correct for 13 distinct states does not a priori mean that it is correct for today.  Do you think the framers of the Constitution foresaw a country that stretched three times beyond their boundaries?  Statehood decisions were constantly being made to protect slavery up to the Civil War.  West Virginia only became a state because of the war.  Why are their two Dakotas.  Why are Alaska and Hawaii states and not Puerto Rico? 

The 3/5 issue was a minor part of any reasoning as settled by the Connecticut Compromise that assigned two extra seats to the upper house as the Senate became.  This protected smaller states at a time when the South with its slaves were actually growing faster the the northern states.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connecticut_Compromise

[Alan Klein]

No, they were not.  It was to protect slavery along with the 3/5 person count for owned slaves.  Just because a decision was correct for 13 distinct states does not a priori mean that it is correct for today.  Do you think the framers of the Constitution foresaw a country that stretched three times beyond their boundaries?  Statehood decisions were constantly being made to protect slavery up to the Civil War.  West Virginia only became a state because of the war.  Why are their two Dakotas.  Why are Alaska and Hawaii states and not Puerto Rico? 

If the constitution should be changed, then it can be by amendments as it has many many times.  YOu want a popular vote only.  Be careful what you wish for.  You may get it.

I don't understand your point about the various states.The one I'm familiar with, Puerto Rico, has not become a state because the people there have voted to not become one. Of course, we know that you want them too so you can get two additional Democrat senators.  But I think we should leave it up to Puerto Ricans to decide by popular vote what they wish to do as they have for decades.  Democrats do believe in Democracy, don't they?  Or will Democrats force it down their throats for political advantage?

[Alan Klein]

I’ve “handled the controls”, too.  That doesn’t mean I can land an aircraft.

He ostentatiously carried his helmet under his arm as he walked away from the jet.  Doesn’t he have people for that?

The “Mission Accomplished” event was produced off the coast of California.  Last time I looked at a map, nowhere near Iraq.

The sign itself required significant production expertise and expense.  Designed, produced, transported and installed prior to Bush’s arrival.

And all that risk, effort and expense proved to be a lie.  Sound familiar, Alan?

.

Non-sequitur.  You respond like CNN.

[Alan Klein]

My memory is that everyone, Republicans included, thought it was an idiotic stunt at the time. It is easily in the top ten dumbest things Bush did while in office, and there is a lot of competition. Maybe there is one guy on the internet who thinks it was heroic and Bush became a media darling.

Bush was a pilot in the Texas Air National Guard after college. He flew an F-102. Apparently, he was able to take off, fly, and land his plane solo at least once. It was his way of avoiding the draft and being sent to Vietnam. Sometimes he showed up for his weekend duty; sometimes he didn't. At least he wasn't hobbling around Studio 54 on his bone spurs.

Your memory is very faulty.  Landing on a carrier in an aviator's leather jacket to be with the troops was pure political braggadocio and Republicans loved it.  I don't recall if Bush had aviator sunglasses on too?