Covid 19 Updates Part 2

[MattBurt]

Once again, you want to quaranteen 3 million travelers?  Really?

Desperate times call for desperate measures.

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

... really not enough data out there...

But there is always plenty of 100% scientifically confirmed data to blame Trump, right?

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

Some news for Slobodan, and others affected.

Russia sends medical aid to Serbia to fight coronavirus
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-russia-serbia/russia-sends-medical-aid-to-serbia-to-fight-coronavirus-idUSKBN21L17H

Thank, you Bart, and Russia.

From my perspective, this is much more welcome than the Chinese help, however useful that one might be in medical terms. With the Chinese help come Chinese totalitarian mentality and advice. Hence the military with machine guns on the streets of Belgrade, draconian Martial law, arrests of journalists, arrest of pensioners for daring to venture out to get food. The we-love-our-pensioners government allows them to go shopping between 4am and 7am.

[Alan Klein]

Again Alan, that didn't apply to US citizens or permanent residents, so they were free to bring the virus back with them.

Frank, we keep going over the same points.  Foreigners from China are not American citizens. They have no legal right to enter this country.   It's easier to impose a ban on them then on American citizens who want to go home. 

How would you feel if on returning from an overseas trip, the airport immigration officer said you would have to stay in detention in some makeshift prison for 14 days?  Especially then, when there wasn't an declared national emergency that was even being discussed by the press who was talking about impeachment.  You'd be really pissed and rightly so.  If Trump did that and locked you up for 14 days, you'd be the first person complaining how he really is a dictator.  Your change in attitude now about how he should act isn't credible.   You'll damn him if he does and damn him if he doesn't.

[Craig Lamson]

Desperate times call for desperate measures.

But we have that pesky constitution.  And a rabid court system.  Has the Congress statrd the process of passing any laws that would remove our constitutional freedoms?  Can you imagine the howl if Trump said I'm taking over all the country because of this virus?

I'm simply being realistic here.  Any action will find those who disagree and when it comes to laws or Executive orders its going to go to court. 

Lets tak the situation as it concerns Sanctuary states and cities.  They say screw the Feds, we are not following your laws.  Don't like it, take us to court and we will tie this up for a few months or even years.

Apply that now. 

[JoeKitchen]

But we have that pesky constitution.  And a rabid court system.  Has the Congress statrd the process of passing any laws that would remove our constitutional freedoms?  Can you imagine the howl if Trump said I'm taking over all the country because of this virus?

I'm simply being realistic here.  Any action will find those who disagree and when it comes to laws or Executive orders its going to go to court. 

Lets tak the situation as it concerns Sanctuary states and cities.  They say screw the Feds, we are not following your laws.  Don't like it, take us to court and we will tie this up for a few months or even years.

Apply that now.

Even on a state by state level, this would happen. 

CT tried to quarantine all travels from NY and possibly deny them access.  Cuomo threatened to sue CT over it.  This was long past the point where it was obvious how bad this was, and you would think Cuomo would have better things to do then try and sue his neighboring state, but ...

This was of course held up by the media as true leadership. 

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

Even on a state by state level, this would happen. 

CT tried to quarantine all travels from NY and possibly deny them access.  Cuomo threatened to sue CT over it.  This was long past the point where it was obvious how bad this was, and you would think Cuomo would have better things to do then try and sue his neighboring state, but ...

This was of course held up by the media as true leadership.

Well, the alternative might be to buid cages at the border and hold these people pending their court case. That would buy some (quarantine) time, or not?

[Alan Klein]

I think we should lock up posters who spread false rumors. 

[Craig Lamson]

Even on a state by state level, this would happen. 

CT tried to quarantine all travels from NY and possibly deny them access.  Cuomo threatened to sue CT over it.  This was long past the point where it was obvious how bad this was, and you would think Cuomo would have better things to do then try and sue his neighboring state, but ...

This was of course held up by the media as true leadership.

Here is what is happening as it pertains to the DOJ.  Expand this to Trump on a national level...


DOJ wants expanded powers amid crisis.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/21/doj-coronavirus-emergency-powers-140023

[JoeKitchen]

Well, the alternative might be to buid cages at the border and hold these people pending their court case. That would buy some (quarantine) time, or not?

To be honest, I don't why she caved.  All the courts are closed; no judge would hear the case any time soon. 

Similar thing happened in PA when our governor shut down all non-essential businesses and the courts state wide.  Law firms did not make the cut to remain open and one ambitious firm decided to file suit against the state.  Tom Wolf, our governor, pretty said go ahead and have fun filing, no judge is going to hear this for while. 

[Craig Lamson]

Well, the alternative might be to buid cages at the border and hold these people pending their court case. That would buy some (quarantine) time, or not?

That sounds like a great solution for those who are breaking the law and trying to come into the country illegally.

[Alan Klein]

Here is what is happening as it pertains to the DOJ.  Expand this to Trump on a national level...


DOJ wants expanded powers amid crisis.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/21/doj-coronavirus-emergency-powers-140023

I'm hesitant to give the DOJ more power to circumvent any constitutional protections.  That's how people like Maduro get around laws protecting citizen's liberties to impose their will.  Very bad precedent.  Let's stick with constitutional laws already available.  Of course, if government goes to far, the people still have the Second Amendment to take back their freedoms.  But we don't want to go there if we don't have too. 

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

That sounds like a great solution for those who are breaking the law and trying to come into the country illegally.

So, make it illegal to willingly endanger the health of others ...

[Alan Klein]

To be honest, I don't why she caved.  All the courts are closed; no judge would hear the case any time soon. 

Similar thing happened in PA when our governor shut down all non-essential businesses and the courts state wide.  Law firms did not make the cut to remain open and one ambitious firm decided to file suit against the state.  Tom Wolf, our governor, pretty said go ahead and have fun filing, no judge is going to hear this for while. 

I suspect if this goes on awhile, courts will make arrangement to use televised hearings where everyone can be protected from the virus.  That would seem to be a reasonable solution so people get their day in court whether civil or criminal.  I don;t believe there are any constitutional protections against televised hearings and trials.

[Alan Klein]

So, make it illegal to willingly endanger the health of others ...

Those laws are already on the books.  Men with AIDS have gone to jail for willingly knowing they were infected and having unprotected sex without letting the other person know. 

[armand]

Looks like someone was ahead of the curve here. 

After mocking Trump for promoting hydroxychloroquine, journalists acknowledge it might treat coronavirus

Some backtracking by the media.

Malaria Drug Helps Virus Patients Improve, in Small Study

Do I think Trump got everything right here, of course not.  Do I think anyone else, even a Democrat, would have done better, of course.  The abject failure of nearly every government in the world proves that, and those that did a little better only did so out of luck from having to deal with H1N1. 

But at least Trump was not dismissing ideas from the other side of the aisle just out of spite.

Wishful thinking in trying to prove Trump is something that he's not. This is a rash decision.

Could this be helpful? Yes. Is it clear? No.

The data is quite poor and has to be validated if it's good enough and for who. It does come with significant side effects and you can't just give it to everybody until you know they will benefit from it, because if they don't, more will die from the drug itself.
Some say Covid will kill you. Not that many actually will die, percentage wise, and you seem to be unaware of a basic principle in medicine: first do no harm. You don't risk killing people with a drug without clear evidence of the risk/benefit ratio. Currently I can see it only as a compassionate use for the very sick people.

[armand]

A common medicine ‘could be a COVID-19 wonder drug’ (hydroxychloroquine )

Sky News host Chris Kenny says “while there are no magic cures” for the deadly coronavirus, a common medicine used to treat malaria and rheumatoid arthritis is now “touted as a bit of a wonder drug for COVID-19”.

Mr Kenny said the drug hydroxychloroquine “has now been authorised for use on coronavirus in the US” and is being looked at in Australia too.

“It is cheap and easy to produce but is already running short, so production is ramping up”.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oj0GfXbEElc

See my previous post

[hogloff]

Yep, you Canadians are doing this so much better. 

Justin Trudeau issues stern warning to Canadians: 'Go home and stay home'

The blunt message on Monday came after images circulated online showing groups of people congregating in parks, along streets and on playing fields over the weekend.

“We’ve all seen the pictures online of people who seem to think they’re invincible,” the prime minister said. “Well, you’re not. Enough is enough.”

FYI, this was March 23rd.

Joe, yes there are some out there that aren't totally following the rules...but far different than the mobs at spring break, the 1000 people attending churches etc... Night and Day.

[JoeKitchen]

Wishful thinking in trying to prove Trump is something that he's not. This is a rash decision.

Could this be helpful? Yes. Is it clear? No.

The data is quite poor and has to be validated if it's good enough and for who. It does come with significant side effects and you can't just give it to everybody until you know they will benefit from it, because if they don't, more will die from the drug itself.
Some say Covid will kill you. Not that many actually will die, percentage wise, and you seem to be unaware of a basic principle in medicine: first do no harm. You don't risk killing people with a drug without clear evidence of the risk/benefit ratio. Currently I can see it only as a compassionate use for the very sick people.

Which is why we let doctors make the decisions.  Nowhere did I see Trump suggest we should give this everyone.  But many democratic governors stripped doctors' right to prescribe this drug just out of spite/hatred of Trump. 

[Alan Klein]

I suspect if this goes on awhile, courts will make arrangement to use televised hearings where everyone can be protected from the virus.  That would seem to be a reasonable solution so people get their day in court whether civil or criminal.  I don;t believe there are any constitutional protections against televised hearings and trials.

My son-in-law who's a lawyer and notary told me he can "sign" off on signatures on documents on the web. Contracts are signed all the time now via computer including for this forum web site and every APP you buy practically.  While eye-to-eye contact is best at a trial, such times call for the best you can do.  After all, timely justice is also required by the constitution.  People and corporate rights could be violated as well if cases sit forever.  So sometimes you have to just do the best you can under the circumstances.