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Author Topic: Extreme weather  (Read 49750 times)

Bart_van_der_Wolf

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1540 on: February 12, 2020, 10:11:16 am »

The question is how do others rate them?  Perhaps like the Columbia Jounalism Review for example?

Depends on who those 'others' are.
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RSL

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1541 on: February 12, 2020, 10:13:35 am »

Exactly, and I'm always suspicious of any outfit with enough chutzpah to call itself a "rating" company.
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Bart_van_der_Wolf

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1542 on: February 12, 2020, 10:21:22 am »

Exactly, and I'm always suspicious of any outfit with enough chutzpah to call itself a "rating" company.

Suspicious is good, paranoid isn't.

If you take the time to peruse their website, you'll see that they actually do a good job, and their rating of "Skeptical Science" overall looks to be pretty damn close to reality.

What's reality, one might ask? But then we get into philosopy, which is something for another thread.
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RSL

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1543 on: February 12, 2020, 10:25:02 am »

Not really, Bart. I think it's been rampant in this thread.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1544 on: February 12, 2020, 10:26:03 am »

Exactly, and I'm always suspicious of any outfit with enough chutzpah to call itself a "rating" company.
Wasn't it the rating companies like Moody's and S&P and Fitch and others that overrated the worthless stock that caused the 2008 recession when the real estate market collapsed?  They didn't want to lose their clients, the banks that hired them to rate their worthless real estate stock as something AAA valuable when it was worth Ddd-, or slightly higher than dog poop. 

Craig Lamson

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1545 on: February 12, 2020, 10:31:09 am »

Depends on who those 'others' are.

Why are you deflecting so much here Bart?  Do you have a problem with say, the Columbia Jounalism Review?
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Alan Klein

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1546 on: February 12, 2020, 10:44:54 am »

When I want to know what's really going on with a global warming study,  I check with my nearest art gallery who's owner let's me know its real value.  Or a pawn shop. 

Bart_van_der_Wolf

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1547 on: February 12, 2020, 11:11:10 am »

Why are you deflecting so much here Bart?  Do you have a problem with say, the Columbia Jounalism Review?

I haven't studied their reporting, but Media Bias/Fact Check has (not that Russ trusts their judgement based on ???):
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/columbia-journalism-review/

MBFC has them labeled as: "Overall, we rate Columbia Journalism Review Left-Center Biased based on editorial positions that moderately favor the left. We also rate them High for factual reporting due to proper sourcing and a clean fact check record."

So who am I to disagree, before you show me something specific to judge for myself?
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Craig Lamson

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1548 on: February 12, 2020, 12:09:21 pm »

I haven't studied their reporting, but Media Bias/Fact Check has (not that Russ trusts their judgement based on ???):
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/columbia-journalism-review/

MBFC has them labeled as: "Overall, we rate Columbia Journalism Review Left-Center Biased based on editorial positions that moderately favor the left. We also rate them High for factual reporting due to proper sourcing and a clean fact check record."

So who am I to disagree, before you show me something specific to judge for myself?

Why dont you look at what they say?  Its your source, have you at least done the research to see if its a quality source and the principals are qualified?
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1549 on: February 12, 2020, 12:23:11 pm »

Yes, "Skeptical Science" is very highly rated for its factual reporting on Science.
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/skeptical-science/

Forbes is more of a mixed bag in general, with a 3 steps lower rating.
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/forbes/

That is a quite skillful ad hominem deflection from the main point: aggressive blacklisting of reputable climate scientists who do not fall in line.

Bart_van_der_Wolf

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1550 on: February 12, 2020, 12:28:25 pm »

That is a quite skillful ad hominem deflection from the main point: aggressive blacklisting of reputable climate scientists who do not fall in line.

It's your assumption that the Forbes contributor is unbiased, and that Skeptical Science website is wrong.
I do not see it as my task to correct everything that people believe ... , although I may at times.
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1551 on: February 12, 2020, 12:49:50 pm »

It's your assumption that the Forbes contributor is unbiased, and that Skeptical Science website is wrong.
I do not see it as my task to correct everything that people believe ... , although I may at times.

We are not talking about assumptions or who believes what, but about facts presented in the article, emails, interviews etc. Which show a pattern of aggressive lobbying to blacklist scientists that dare to veer off the prescribed path, losing jobs and academic positions, in spite of stellar careers up to that point. Certainly one way to achieve a "scientific consensus."

Bart_van_der_Wolf

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1552 on: February 12, 2020, 01:13:23 pm »

We are not talking about assumptions or who believes what, but about facts presented in the article, emails, interviews etc. Which show a pattern of aggressive lobbying to blacklist scientists that dare to veer off the prescribed path, losing jobs and academic positions, in spite of stellar careers up to that point. Certainly one way to achieve a "scientific consensus."

You almost make it sound like what Trump does, but that's for another thread.

If what I've read is correct, then the person mentioned did claim a number of strange things, for a person of science. Maybe listing her is justified. What others may or may not do with that is not my responsibility. It seems a bit overreacted, but then I've not read everything she has published. Have you?
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LesPalenik

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1553 on: February 12, 2020, 07:50:52 pm »

This year’s winter in France has, so far, been the mildest in more than a century, and that has had a direct impact on the ski resort of Le Mourtis, in the Pyrenees mountains.

Quote
The last time France experienced a December and January as mild as this year was in 1900, according to Christelle Robert, a forecaster with Meteo-France, the national meteorological service. Weather has always fluctuated from year to year, but Robert said a clear pattern was emerging - of mild winters and less snow - that was in line with global warming. If the trend continues, ski resorts around 1,600 meters above sea level will be so warm they cannot even spray artificial snow on their pistes. It will melt.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-climate-change-france-skiing/the-ski-resort-with-no-snow-contemplates-a-warmer-future-idUSKBN2061H4

Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1554 on: February 12, 2020, 08:31:57 pm »

So, what was the cause in the year 1900?

Bart_van_der_Wolf

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1555 on: February 12, 2020, 08:59:59 pm »

I've mentioned it before, in another thread, but it might be useful to repeat it here (since there still seem to be folks in denial about the trend of rising (global) temperatures).

In the Netherlands we have a winter-tradition called the "Elf steden tocht" (the eleven cities tour):
   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elfstedentocht .

It is a 200 km long tour with ice skates on natural ice (frozen canals and waterways), leading past 11 cities in one single day, in the Northern province of Friesland. It has been officially organized since 1909, although there are reports of it being done since 1760.

The event only takes place once a year, provided that the ice is thick enough (at least 15 centimeters thick along the entire course).

Here are the years that is was possible to do the run:
1909
1912
1917
1929
1933
1940
1941
1942
1947
1954
1956
1963
1985
1986
1997

So, this event is not linked to a specific date, but it just has to be cold enough during the winter to grow ice that's going to be thick enough, and then it's a go within 48 hours (and care is taken to reduce the flow of water, as part of our water-management). The frequency of being able to organize the event has gradually been going down.

Yet another demonstration of the effects of Global warming as witnessed in a local venue.
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Craig Lamson

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1556 on: February 12, 2020, 10:25:13 pm »

I've mentioned it before, in another thread, but it might be useful to repeat it here (since there still seem to be folks in denial about the trend of rising (global) temperatures).

In the Netherlands we have a winter-tradition called the "Elf steden tocht" (the eleven cities tour):
   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elfstedentocht .

It is a 200 km long tour with ice skates on natural ice (frozen canals and waterways), leading past 11 cities in one single day, in the Northern province of Friesland. It has been officially organized since 1909, although there are reports of it being done since 1760.

The event only takes place once a year, provided that the ice is thick enough (at least 15 centimeters thick along the entire course).

Here are the years that is was possible to do the run:
1909
1912
1917
1929
1933
1940
1941
1942
1947
1954
1956
1963
1985
1986
1997

So, this event is not linked to a specific date, but it just has to be cold enough during the winter to grow ice that's going to be thick enough, and then it's a go within 48 hours (and care is taken to reduce the flow of water, as part of our water-management). The frequency of being able to organize the event has gradually been going down.

Yet another demonstration of the effects of Global warming as witnessed in a local venue.

What caused the problem from 63 to 85?
« Last Edit: February 12, 2020, 10:58:01 pm by Craig Lamson »
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Alan Klein

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1557 on: February 12, 2020, 10:28:17 pm »

Bart_van_der_Wolf

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1558 on: February 12, 2020, 11:00:25 pm »

Some caused the problem from 63 to 85?

Yes, the intervals are getting larger due to rising temperatures. The average temperature in the Netherlands has been rising some 1.5-2.0 degrees Celsius since official systematic recording around the 1900's. It's been 23 years since the latest 11 cities event (with one close call in 2019), and it's getting less likely (although theoretically still possible) that it will happen this year.
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LesPalenik

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Re: Extreme weather
« Reply #1559 on: February 12, 2020, 11:08:17 pm »

So, what was the cause in the year 1900?

Possibly a faulty thermometer.
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