Nikon has its Mark III

[fdisilvestro]

Just got my D810.

I am glad to report that with 2 fast media in back up mode the black out time shooting raw in live view is now very short (perhaps 1/2 sec), which will make it possible to shoot stitches while staying in live view.

Cheers,
Bernard

Congratulations, How is Live view? Has it improved (less line skipping) compared to the D800?

[BernardLanguillier]

Congratulations, How is Live view? Has it improved (less line skipping) compared to the D800?

I was always of the opinion that live view on the D800 was usable enough, but yes it has improved on the D810:
- sharp at 200%
- delay after exposure is much shorter when using fast media (around 1/2s when writing raw in back up mode).

I have not shot enough to form an opinion about the amount of noise.

Cheers,
Bernard

[langier]

+1

sRaw, nothing more than a check-box feature IMO.

[Hans Kruse]

I have been shooting a D800E for a little over a year and it works ok in live view. It is nice that it automatically stops down to the f-stop you will shoot at without pushing a button as on the Canons. But it is annoying that you cannont go into LV or out until all images has been written to the card(s). So I'm certainly curious if this has gone away. It seems to me such a trivial thing to do! The EFC nice but I have found that the D800 is pretty eell damped when shooting in LV which I always do when MUP otherwise would be needed. I sometimes use MUP with LV for long focal lengths to make sure there is no vibrations coming from the double movement of the shutter when starting the exposure. It has become less of an issue though after I got the RRS BH55 head for my RRS tripod.

[Paul2660]

I received my D810 yesterday and after comparing it to my D800e in a few side by sides, I came away with these thoughts:

1.  Live View at max, not sure if the view is now 200% or just 100%, Unlike the D800e, when you max out the LiveView all the way, you can still see the image to  determine critical focus.  However the view to me seems more like a 100% view, not the 200% view the D800e has when maxed.

2.  Noise, up through 6400 iso, the D810 and D800e are so close, I really couldn't see any difference.  This did surprise me a bit. 

3.  Noise at base iso 64 on the D810 and base iso 100 on the D800e are pretty much identical

4.  Shutter noise is different and considerably quieter, I assume this is due the Electronic First Curtain on the D810

5.  Layout of buttons and menus is pretty much the same, so no problem in transfer to the newer body

6.  In very low light, live view is a bit better than the D800e, (not as much noise on the screen) and easier to get critical focus but still not as clean as say a
     Canon 6D in low light.

7.  AF pretty much the same characteristics.  D810 has a bit of trouble in low light locking subjects. 


Net, to me not as big a upgrade as I had hoped, and does show I guess just how good the first generation of this camera was, as the new one doesn't seem to improve on image quality very much.   May return mine, but will shoot it a bit more.

Paul

[Hans Kruse]

I downloaded the manual for the D810 and the only reference to EFC was using it with MUP. In other words no mention if EFC is effective shooting in LV. Can somebody shed any light on this?

It is easy to check: Take off the lens and set the camera on e.g. 5 seconds shutter speed in manual mode and see if the front curtain moves in live view mode. Doing this on a Canon 5D mkIII one sees only a movement of the shutter at the end of the exposure. I had hoped the D810 had implemented the same in LV. Also I'd be grateful if somebody could test the following: Shoot a sequence of shots e.g. 10 in a row and then try to activate LV while the images are still being written to the card(s). Is this possible or not? On the D800(E) it is not possible as LV is locked while the emptying of the buffer is going on.

Notice also that EFC only works if it is enabled via d5 enabled.

[Hans Kruse]

4.  Shutter noise is different and considerably quieter, I assume this is due the Electronic First Curtain on the D810

Did you remember to enable EFC?

[Theodoros]

I received my D810 yesterday and after comparing it to my D800e in a few side by sides, I came away with these thoughts:

1.  Live View at max, not sure if the view is now 200% or just 100%, Unlike the D800e, when you max out the LiveView all the way, you can still see the image to  determine critical focus.  However the view to me seems more like a 100% view, not the 200% view the D800e has when maxed.

2.  Noise, up through 6400 iso, the D810 and D800e are so close, I really couldn't see any difference.  This did surprise me a bit. 

3.  Noise at base iso 64 on the D810 and base iso 100 on the D800e are pretty much identical

4.  Shutter noise is different and considerably quieter, I assume this is due the Electronic First Curtain on the D810

5.  Layout of buttons and menus is pretty much the same, so no problem in transfer to the newer body

6.  In very low light, live view is a bit better than the D800e, (not as much noise on the screen) and easier to get critical focus but still not as clean as say a
     Canon 6D in low light.

7.  AF pretty much the same characteristics.  D810 has a bit of trouble in low light locking subjects. 


Net, to me not as big a upgrade as I had hoped, and does show I guess just how good the first generation of this camera was, as the new one doesn't seem to improve on image quality very much.   May return mine, but will shoot it a bit more.

Paul

Any DR difference observations Paul?

[BernardLanguillier]

A few comments:
- it is possible to select either 100% or 200% zoom both in live view and in replay,
- the AF seems to be a very different beast than the D800 and it will take some time to learn it. My very early findings shooting with the 85mm f1.4 AF-S outdoors and in pretty dark rooms at f1.4 are:
  - AF-S mode seems much more dicerning when deciding whether the subject is in focus or not,
  - the accuracy of AF-C on subjects not moving much seems much better,
  - group AF seems like a huge improvement with a success ratio close to 100% in those early tests.
- I have the feeling that colors may be richer and better differentiated than on the D800.
- the body feels better in my hand with the re-designed grip.

Cheers,
Bernard

[Hans Kruse]

A few comments:
- it is possible to select either 100% or 200% zoom both in live view and in replay,
- the AF seems to be a very different beast than the D800 and it will take some time to learn it. My very early findings shooting with the 85mm f1.4 AF-S outdoors and in pretty dark rooms at f1.4 are:
  - AF-S mode seems much more dicerning when deciding whether the subject is in focus or not,
  - the accuracy of AF-C on subjects not moving much seems much better,
  - group AF seems like a huge improvement with a success ratio close to 100% in those early tests.
- I have the feeling that colors may be richer and better differentiated than on the D800.
- the body feels better in my hand with the re-designed grip.

Cheers,
Bernard

Any comments on my questions in previous post?

[BernardLanguillier]

Any comments on my questions in previous post?

Hi Hans,

I think that I may have already clarified this in a previous post, but the black out time in live view when shooting in raw back up mode to 2 fast media is around 1/2 sec, so much shorter than on my D800.

Cheers,
Bernard

[Hans Kruse]

Hi Hans,

I think that I may have already clarified this in a previous post, but the black out time in live view when shooting in raw back up mode to 2 fast media is around 1/2 sec, so much shorter than on my D800.

Cheers,
Bernard

The questions were if the camera will allow you to go into or out of LV while still writing to the cards or not. Not a question about how fast. The second was if the EFC works with LV.

Both are easy to test. I would appreciate if you did do that. Thanks.

[BernardLanguillier]

The questions were if the camera will allow you to go into or out of LV while still writing to the cards or not. Not a question about how fast. The second was if the EFC works with LV.

Both are easy to test. I would appreciate if you did do that. Thanks.

The first one appears to be yes. When in live view, clicking on the live view button when the card led is still blinking enables you to exit live view.

For the second one, my very quick test seems to indicate that the behavior differs in live view depending on whether MLU is activated or not. When MLU is activated in live view the first shutter click results in live view going black, the second shutter click generates a lot less noise than when MLU is not active. So I would say that the answer is yes too.

Does that answer you question?

Cheers,
Bernard

[fdisilvestro]

A few comments:
- it is possible to select either 100% or 200% zoom both in live view and in replay,
- the AF seems to be a very different beast than the D800 and it will take some time to learn it. My very early findings shooting with the 85mm f1.4 AF-S outdoors and in pretty dark rooms at f1.4 are:
  - AF-S mode seems much more dicerning when deciding whether the subject is in focus or not,
  - the accuracy of AF-C on subjects not moving much seems much better,
  - group AF seems like a huge improvement with a success ratio close to 100% in those early tests.
- I have the feeling that colors may be richer and better differentiated than on the D800.
- the body feels better in my hand with the re-designed grip.

Cheers,
Bernard

Thanks for the updates. Besides the improvements in the AF, it is very likely that the D810 uses a different CFA, based on the changes observables in the Raw files. It might actually be the case why the base ISO is 64 and not 100. Could it be that Nikon favoured color response in this camera? If this is the case, it may be the end of the argument of CCD vs CMOS.

[Hans Kruse]

The first one appears to be yes. When in live view, clicking on the live view button when the card led is still blinking enables you to exit live view.

For the second one, my very quick test seems to indicate that the behavior differs in live view depending on whether MLU is activated or not. When MLU is activated in live view the first shutter click results in live view going black, the second shutter click generates a lot less noise than when MLU is not active. So I would say that the answer is yes too.

Does that answer you question?

Cheers,
Bernard

For the first one it indicates that the problem has been fixed.

For the second one. Did you have EFC enabled in d4? The behavior you describe is the same as on the D800(E). Try and do the test I suggested. Take off the lens and set the shutter speed to 5 seconds and then see what happens. Just look at the shutter.

[BernardLanguillier]

For the first one it indicates that the problem has been fixed.

For the second one. Did you have EFC enabled in d4? The behavior you describe is the same as on the D800(E). Try and do the test I suggested. Take off the lens and set the shutter speed to 5 seconds and then see what happens. Just look at the shutter.

Hans,

I have just performed your test, the shutter only moves at the end of the exposure.

Cheers,
Bernard

[Hans Kruse]

Hans,

I have just performed your test, the shutter only moves at the end of the exposure.

Cheers,
Bernard

Great and thanks, that's what I had hoped for, but the manual and all info I have seen has been more than unclear about this.

[Lupin]

http://www.imaging-resource.com/IMCOMP/COMPS01.HTM

The D810 seems visbily sharper than both the D800E and D800 on these comparisons.

The lighting has changed between the two shoots (May 2012 & July 2014) - therefore it's not a valid comparison. 

[Hans Kruse]

The lighting has changed between the two shoots (May 2012 & July 2014) - therefore it's not a valid comparison. 

I checked also and I see the D810 image as slightly sharper, but not by much. As if a fine haze has been removed. I think the difference is so small that it does not really matter.

[Lupin]

I checked also and I see the D810 image as slightly sharper, but not by much. As if a fine haze has been removed. I think the difference is so small that it does not really matter.

The D810 lighting is slightly harsher than the D800E lighting (look at the shadow on the background between the two bottles on the right) - that would help the labels look sharper on the D810. The only way to compare the two cameras is under identical lighting - these setups aren't identical.