Nikon has its Mark III

[Hans Kruse]

The D810 lighting is slightly harsher than the D800E lighting (look at the shadow on the background between the two bottles on the right) - that would help the labels look sharper on the D810. The only way to compare the two cameras is under identical lighting - these setups aren't identical.

I converted the D810 NEF file to DNG using the beta DNG converter. Comparing the ISO 64 shot from the D810 and the ISO 100 from the D800E are very very close in my opinion. But the D810 is slightly clearer and detailed. That's what I see. I used the same sharpening on both which is my default sharpening parameters: Amount=50, radius=0.8, detail=70 and masking=30 (set to 0 in my comparison). But I agree the lighting is different and the white balance is different too. Even balancing WB through the second grey patch on the color checker the colors don't match.

[Lupin]

I converted the D810 NEF file to DNG using the beta DNG converter. Comparing the ISO 64 shot from the D810 and the ISO 100 from the D800E are very very close in my opinion. But the D810 is slightly clearer and detailed.

I agree Hans - I can see little or no increase in sharpness. The D810 is a bit brighter and the D800E needs a slight boost to equal it - I think it's about +12 on the slider in Photoshop.

Here's what I did to match them (using the two 100 ISO shots from here http://photographylife.com/nikon-d810-vs-d800e-iso-comparison#comment-115810):

1. Load the D810 100 ISO file & the D800E ISO 100 file into the same Photoshop document (as two layers - 810 above, 800E underneath).

2. Line up the two layers vertically using a DVD spine as a reference point.

3. Add a layer mask to the 810 layer and erase a slim vertical strip using the rectangular marquee tool. (I placed the strip midway horizontally along the DVD spines).

4. Add a brightness/contrast adjustment layer above the D800E layer (and below the D810 layer).

5. Adjust the brightness slider until the vertical strip disappears.

The strip becomes more or less invisible when the brightness slider is at +12 (out of 150). So to match the two cameras, the D800E would need a brightness boost equivalent to +12 in PS. This probably translates to something like +1 brightness in the camera’s picture control settings (perhaps less).

(PS. I’m using a hardware calibrated monitor – the +12 figure could vary slightly on other monitors that are calibrated differently).

[BernardLanguillier]

I am just back from a 3 days family trip during which I had the opportunity to shoot the D810,

In short, I am impressed. I was shooting with the Sigma 35mm f1.4 and Nikon 85mm f1.4. What struck me:
- the colors are clearly richer and better differentiated compared to the D800,
- the auto white balance seems much better,
- the ability to shoot hand held with live and EFC activated increases the ratio of critically focused and tack sharp hand held images,
- operations are very significantly smoother, it feels like a totally different camera. Live view is one aspect, but it is true from pretty much everything I tried (handling, sound,...),
- AF in AF-C mode is much more reliable, especially when using group mode,
- detail is simply amazing, and I didn't have the Otus that is still under repair. It is very clearly sharper than the D800 (non E),

All in all it feels that Nikon could have called this a D900 without over selling the progress.

Cheers,
Bernard

[Theodoros]

I am just back from a 3 days family trip during which I had the opportunity to shoot the D810,

In short, I am impressed. I was shooting with the Sigma 35mm f1.4 and Nikon 85mm f1.4. What struck me:
- the colors are clearly richer and better differentiated compared to the D800,
- operations are very significantly smoother, it feels like a totally different camera. Live view is one aspect, but it is true from pretty much everything I tried (handling, sound,...),
- AF in AF-C mode is much more reliable, especially when using group mode,
- detail is simply amazing, and I didn't have the Otus that is still under repair. It is very clearly sharper than the D800 (non E),

All in all it feels that Nikon could have called this a D900 without over selling the progress.

Cheers,
Bernard

Nikon has no intension of calling any FF model a D900... It is a clear naming policy (after D3000 was first introduced and the new naming policy was applied) of them that DX products have four digits and odd starting number, while FX products have three digits and even starting number and special products (like DF or top of the line series) have their own naming... There will never be an FF D900 and (off course) D400 -if it will ever be introduced- will be an entry product to the FX line of products... The replacement of D810 will obviously be D820...

Never the less, I would like to hear your impressions on the DR of the new camera and how it compares (IYO) with D800's DR... particularly in its ability to "protect" HLs for the same exposure...

[Lupin]

Nikon has no intension of calling any FF model a D900...

Who told you that?

[aragdog]

Ok used the new nikon Raw beta file on a new Macpro 6 core with 64 gig of memory.  The new Nikon Raw beta kept crashing.  So used the new ACR beta on the 810 files and they were very impressive in areas in New Orleans shot in the Quarter in shadow areas.  But not THAT IMPRESSIVE over the 800E.  Will have to play around more with settings and all.  Forgot how heavy the darn 800E was since using the Olympus EM1 a lot.  For just street shooting I think I will stay with, dare I say it, the Olympus.  If I do go some great areas to take photos then out will come the 800E or the 810.  Just some opinions of an old man.

[Theodoros]

Who told you that?

15 consecutive models over 6 years... Who told you different?

[BernardLanguillier]

Nikon has no intension of calling any FF model a D900... It is a clear naming policy (after D3000 was first introduced and the new naming policy was applied) of them that DX products have four digits and odd starting number, while FX products have three digits and even starting number and special products (like DF or top of the line series) have their own naming... There will never be an FF D900 and (off course) D400 -if it will ever be introduced- will be an entry product to the FX line of products... The replacement of D810 will obviously be D820...

I agree with you, but they have started this new numbering scheme the worst possible way with the D610 that was basically a non upgrade compared to the D600.

Since, in typical Nikon marketing disaster way, they have not communicated about their new numbering scheme, they have generated a perception that the D810 may be a minor upgrade, while facts show it to be very significant.

Calling the D600s a D610 may prove to be a very expensive mistake for Nikon. Knowing what was coming a few months down the road with the D810, I am simply puzzled by the incompetence of the guys who took the decision to give the same naming to 2 upgrades with such different natures.

Never the less, I would like to hear your impressions on the DR of the new camera and how it compares (IYO) with D800's DR... particularly in its ability to "protect" HLs for the same exposure...

The D800 had zero highlight recovery capability, like all digital capturing devices (including digital backs). The D810 is the same.

If your question is about DR, then we will have to look at how clean the shadows are. On that one, there is impact from the raw developer, but let's say for now that 64 ISO looks extremely clean. To my eyes, it seems cleaner than ISO100 on the D800, but I'll trust DxOMarkon that one.

If your question is about the accuracy of the exposure, then it seems pretty accurate in standard mode. I have not tried yet the new highlight protection exposure mode.

Cheers,
Bernard

[barryfitzgerald]

The D610 fixed problems which eventually Nikon were forced to admit to (being honest they did themselves huge damage by taking so long to do that)
I've no experience of the D800 series though I see some incremental updates on paper like smaller raw and faster fps few bits like that.

I did have a few friends who tortured themselves with Nikon's AF problems on the D800 (early models) I've personally never been that impressed with the consistency of Nikon's AF so my brief encounter with Nikon was ruined purely on that basis. Nice flash system though..but AF is important and should be mature.
That's just my own take..regarding the "recent updates" on cameras I think the question is.."what did you expect"? Bar new sensor technology there wasn't a lot of room for beefy upgrades. Same applies to the Mark III, mostly the AF got souped up on that model (to be fair by a good bit), but then so did the price (it remains somewhat overpriced if we're honest)

Cameras are like cars you can re-paint them and put a few power bulges on the body work, new set of rims but under the bonnet the stuff is pretty much the same.

[BernardLanguillier]

I've no experience of the D800 series though I see some incremental updates on paper like smaller raw and faster fps few bits like that.

Cameras are like cars you can re-paint them and put a few power bulges on the body work, new set of rims but under the bonnet the stuff is pretty much the same.

True, but the again from that standpoint a 40,000 US$ IQ280 is pretty much identical to its predecessors and awfully similar to a D800.

Having used Nikon bodies for years, my current impression after a few hours of usage is that I find the improvements from D800 to D810 to be more significant that the jump from D3x to D800 for example.

Btw, the 2 points you mention are, relative to my needs, the least relevant of the improvements I see in the D810.

Cheers,
Bernard

[Lupin]

15 consecutive models over 6 years... Who told you different?

You said that "Nikon has no intension of calling any FF model a D900."  You don't what their intentions are unless you work for them, you've seen an official statement, or they told you themselves.

[BernardLanguillier]

A couple of images captured with the D810.











A few more after the link: https://www.flickr.com/photos/bernardlanguillier/sets/72157645832791611/

Captured with the Sigma 35mm f1.4 and Nikon 85mm f1.4 AF-S. First 3 are small pano stitches.

Cheers,
Bernard

[Theodoros]

You said that "Nikon has no intension of calling any FF model a D900."  You don't what their intentions are unless you work for them, you've seen an official statement, or they told you themselves.

Not unless they change their naming policy... which isn't any where near... It seems to work great for them, definitely the best naming policy out of all makers.... 

[Hans Kruse]

A couple of images captured with the D810.

A few more after the link: https://www.flickr.com/photos/bernardlanguillier/sets/72157645832791611/

Captured with the Sigma 35mm f1.4 and Nikon 85mm f1.4 AF-S. First 3 are small pano stitches.

Cheers,
Bernard

I'm glad to hear that you like the camera, but quite frankly these pictures could have come from the D800 with no visible difference, especially at the size they can be seen here. Your pictures are generally quite oversharpened in my view. E.g. this one https://www.flickr.com/photos/bernardlanguillier/14736801243/in/set-72157645832791611/lightbox/ and several others. The best is this one https://www.flickr.com/photos/bernardlanguillier/14736803513/in/set-72157645832791611/lightbox/ but still oversharpened. They look a bit harsh which is a pity. I'm still waiting for my D810 

[BernardLanguillier]

I'm glad to hear that you like the camera, but quite frankly these pictures could have come from the D800 with no visible difference, especially at the size they can be seen here. Your pictures are generally quite oversharpened in my view. E.g. this one https://www.flickr.com/photos/bernardlanguillier/14736801243/in/set-72157645832791611/lightbox/ and several others. The best is this one https://www.flickr.com/photos/bernardlanguillier/14736803513/in/set-72157645832791611/lightbox/ but still oversharpened. They look a bit harsh which is a pity. I'm still waiting for my D810  

Hans,

I guess we have different taste in terms of the amount of sharpening required for web sized images.

These images were shot with the D810, but my intention has never been to use them to prove the superiority of the D810 over the D800.

I frankly don't care whether people share my views or not. Good for those who will, too bad for those who won't, their loss.

If I were to do some comparisons, I would do them with the Otus. My copy is coming back tomorrow from a trip to Cosina for repair btw. But then again, life is too short to waste time doing that. The only thing that is relevant for me is to optimize the usage of the D810 with my set of lenses.

Cheers,
Bernard

[Hans Kruse]

Hans,

I guess we have different taste in terms of the amount of sharpening required for web sized images.

These images were shot with the D810, but my intention has never been to use them to prove the superiority of the D810 over the D800.

I frankly don't care whether people share my views or not. Good for those who will, too bad for those who won't, their loss.

If I were to do some comparisons, I would do them with the Otus. My copy is coming back tomorrow from a trip to Cosina for repair btw. But then again, life is too short to waste time doing that. The only thing that is relevant for me is to optimize the usage of the D810 with my set of lenses.

Cheers,
Bernard

Then it wasn't clear to me why you posted the pictures in this thread. If you don't agree with me on the sharpening, no problem, your choice, but I do hope you value feedback.

And I don't see a reason for you to do a comparison. There are plenty out there already. But congratulations with the new camera which I'm sure you will be happy with and most importantly, enjoy on your photo trips.

[BernardLanguillier]

Then it wasn't clear to me why you posted the pictures in this thread. If you don't agree with me on the sharpening, no problem, your choice, but I do hope you value feedback.

Yes, sure.

This thread is about the D810, it seems reasonable to post here images shot with the camera?

Cheers,
Bernard

[mjrichardson]

You can't please all the people all the time Bernard! I like the shots, nice and rich and it's obvious to me you are just showing some images, not offering any comparisons and thanks for doing so, we all know that a web jpeg is unlikely to have any real meaning. Hans, pretty much any camera you can buy now will provide a nice jpeg at this size so pointing out that they could have been taken with the D800 is sort of a mute point.

I'm looking forward to seeing what the Otus does, I am saving for one as I really love the Zeiss 135 f2 and would like the same image qualities in a standard focal length. I'm not swapping to a D810 from the D800/E but will buy as a natural upgrade when I need to replace.

[Hans Kruse]

Hans, pretty much any camera you can buy now will provide a nice jpeg at this size so pointing out that they could have been taken with the D800 is sort of a mute point.

Well, that was my point! Basically what I meant to say was that the images provided no value in the discussion although I didn't express it quite like that 

[mjrichardson]

No you didn't Hans but if that were the case there'd be no point for images on any thread discussing cameras! I just appreciate the effort and nice images and make my own mind up on equipment based on how it suits me.