Pages: 1 ... 43 44 [45] 46 47 ... 153   Go Down

Author Topic: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine  (Read 107030 times)

faberryman

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4851
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #880 on: April 07, 2021, 03:24:09 pm »

In any case, how do you get medical advice about Covid?

My physicians.
Logged

Alan Klein

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 15850
    • Flicker photos
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #881 on: April 07, 2021, 03:29:10 pm »

Science has nothing to do with faith. Understanding that would go a long way toward your first steps in understanding science.
You're right. But as Slobodan was alluding to, many people do put their faith in science thinking that with natural knowledge in hand, they can adjust the universe to their understanding and be protected from harm.  Then science pulls a jujitsu, and you're back to square one. 

Alan Klein

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 15850
    • Flicker photos
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #882 on: April 07, 2021, 03:34:32 pm »

Are you kidding or what?

Your doctor, your public health office, CDC, Mayo Clinic web site, those would be good starts.


Doctors?  Which one?  I always get second opinions.

Most people get their advice from family and friends, headlines, and 20-second newscasts on TV.  They don't get advice from the Mayo, the CDC or LuLa.   :)

Alan Klein

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 15850
    • Flicker photos
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #883 on: April 07, 2021, 03:36:19 pm »

Well in that case, in the future I'll come to you for medical advice, since you seem to be on top of things.
Don't ask me.  I'm just as confused as everyone else. 

faberryman

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4851
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #884 on: April 07, 2021, 03:37:20 pm »

You're right. But as Slobodan was alluding to, many people do put their faith in science thinking that with natural knowledge in hand, they can adjust the universe to their understanding and be protected from harm.  Then science pulls a jujitsu, and you're back to square one.

What sort of adjustments to the universe are these people making?
Logged

faberryman

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4851
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #885 on: April 07, 2021, 03:45:47 pm »

Don't ask me.  I'm just as confused as everyone else.

Who exactly is confused other than you?
Logged

TechTalk

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3612
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #886 on: April 07, 2021, 03:47:19 pm »

What sort of adjustments to the universe are these people making?

None. It's empty rhetoric trying to pose as meaningful in some way. To whom, I can't imagine, other than its author.
Logged
Respice, adspice, prospice - Look to the past, the present, the future

TechTalk

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3612
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #887 on: April 07, 2021, 03:49:38 pm »

Don't ask me.  I'm just as confused as everyone else.

You're overestimating the confusion of "everyone else" and underestimating your own.
Logged
Respice, adspice, prospice - Look to the past, the present, the future

Robert Roaldi

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4763
    • Robert's Photos
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #888 on: April 07, 2021, 04:05:57 pm »

You're right. But as Slobodan was alluding to, many people do put their faith in science thinking that with natural knowledge in hand, they can adjust the universe to their understanding and be protected from harm.  Then science pulls a jujitsu, and you're back to square one.

Hogwash.
Logged
--
Robert

Robert Roaldi

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4763
    • Robert's Photos
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #889 on: April 07, 2021, 04:07:03 pm »

Doctors?  Which one?  I always get second opinions.

You're all set then.


Most people get their advice from family and friends, headlines, and 20-second newscasts on TV.  They don't get advice from the Mayo, the CDC or LuLa.   :)

That might be a mistake.
Logged
--
Robert

Chris Kern

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2034
    • Chris Kern's Eponymous Website
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #890 on: April 07, 2021, 07:11:58 pm »

Can I buy you a drink?

Here's an interesting initial report of what happened after a bar reopened in a rural county in the U.S. state of Illinois.

Quote
Forty-six cases of COVID-19 were linked to an indoor bar opening event that occurred during February 2021 in a rural Illinois county.  Event patrons were linked to secondary cases among household, long-term care facility, and school contacts, resulting in one hospitalization and one school closure affecting 650 students.

I suspect we're going to see many more events like this until the vaccination effort reaches a much larger proportion of the population than it has so far.

Slobodan Blagojevic

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 18090
  • When everyone thinks the same, nobody thinks
    • My website
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #891 on: April 07, 2021, 07:57:49 pm »

Can I buy you a drink...

46 cases dubiously connected to a bar and one hospitalization!? What's the big deal? That seems like a more pleasurable way to get Covid immunity. The more people infected, the better.
« Last Edit: April 08, 2021, 05:24:36 am by Slobodan Blagojevic »
Logged

TechTalk

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3612
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #892 on: April 07, 2021, 08:16:21 pm »

The more people infected, the better.

Antiscience porn.
Logged
Respice, adspice, prospice - Look to the past, the present, the future

LesPalenik

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5339
    • advantica blog
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #893 on: April 07, 2021, 08:23:35 pm »

46 cases dubiously connected to a bar and one hospitalization!? What's the big deal? That seems like a more pleasurable way to get Covid mmunity. The more people infected, the better.

Zeroing on the death portion of the virus stats, you could say - the more dead, the better.
Logged

dreed

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1715
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #894 on: April 07, 2021, 08:24:32 pm »

Robert, the science religious fanatic, thinks that science is always right. Never mind that scientists flip-flop worse than John Kerry.

Until there is an answer with precision, that's normal because discoveries change thinking and conclusions.
Logged

dreed

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1715
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #895 on: April 07, 2021, 08:25:48 pm »

;D ;D ;D

No, but it is adopted by the woke as the new religion, because, apparently, humanity can not survive without some form of religion.

That's not as crazy as it sounds but this thread is not that topic.
Logged

dreed

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1715
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #896 on: April 07, 2021, 08:32:15 pm »

46 cases dubiously connected to a bar and one hospitalization!? What's the big deal? That seems like a more pleasurable way to get Covid mmunity. The more people infected, the better.

How did that work out for England?
Or what was the Nordic country that tried that approach?

The point here is that there's an unknown: how will your body respond to the virus.

Every time there's a small outbreak it is "oh 1 in 40 needed to go to hospital." It's only 1 in 40 because most other people are trying hard to stop its spread. It is highly contagious. Not as bad as measles, but more contagious than influenza. This plus the high hospitalisation rate means that the 1 in 40 might become 1000 in 40000 in your town in short time and, oh, does your local hospital have 1000 beds because recovery time can be very long?

The hard part for many people to understand is that this virus expands exponentially amongst the population if it is not checked.
Logged

Chris Kern

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2034
    • Chris Kern's Eponymous Website
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #897 on: April 07, 2021, 08:52:07 pm »

46 cases dubiously connected to a bar and one hospitalization!? What's the big deal?

Every time there's a small outbreak it is "oh 1 in 40 needed to go to hospital. . . . "  It is highly contagious. . . .

The hard part for many people to understand is that this virus expands exponentially amongst the population if it is not checked.

Yes, of course.  But Slobodan makes a valid point, even if he states it in an unnecessarily (and characteristically) provocative way.  If I were to reformulate it less tendentiously, it would be something like this:

"To what extent is it appropriate to extrapolate to a large population a small-N study, however rigorously conducted, in the absence of similarly rigorous corroborating studies?"

It's a fair question.  The answer, as always, is that science is a process, not an end result, and that one of the reasons for publication is to encourage further research that can replicate or challenge the initial finding.

TechTalk

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3612
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #898 on: April 07, 2021, 09:23:18 pm »

An international group that gets relatively little notice is the Coalition for Epidemic Preparedness Innovations (CEPI), a group established at the start of 2017 with both public and private funding and partnerships. Their mission from the beginning has been vaccine development and distribution assistance and funding. As an example of their COVID-19 efforts, on January 23, 2020 they agreed to provide funding for Moderna's mRNA vaccine development. This is not new for CEPI as they have been funding mRNA vaccine research before anyone had ever heard of COVID-19.

They have now allocated $200 million to funding for development of broadly protective coronavirus vaccines.

https://cepi.net/news_cepi/cepi-launches-funding-call-to-advance-development-of-broadly-protective-coronavirus-vaccines

CEPI launches funding call to advance development of broadly protective coronavirus vaccines

OSLO, Norway, March 31, 2021: CEPI, the Coalition for Epidemic Preparedness Innovations, today launched a call for proposals to develop broadly protective SARS-CoV-2 vaccines and broadly protective Betacoronavirus vaccines. CEPI plans to invest up to US$200 million in promising vaccine candidates up to clinical proof of concept.

Betacoronaviruses are types of coronavirus that cause Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome (SARS) and Middle East Respiratory Syndrome (MERS), which have been responsible for major epidemics in Asia and the Middle East in recent years, and also SARS-CoV-2, the virus responsible for the ongoing COVID-19 pandemic.

The main focus of this call for proposals is to support the research and development of novel immunogens (ie, antigens that elicit an adaptive immune response) for use in vaccines that can elicit durable, broadly protective immune responses.

This opportunity will be open, worldwide, to research and development organisations with expertise in vaccine development.


This is part of a $3.5 billion effort announced earlier in March to develop vaccines for future viruses with a goal of cutting development time down to 100 days.

https://cepi.net/news_cepi/cepi-launches-plan-to-tackle-risk-of-future-pandemics-and-epidemics

Logged
Respice, adspice, prospice - Look to the past, the present, the future

dreed

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1715
Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #899 on: April 07, 2021, 09:33:28 pm »

Yes, of course.  But Slobodan makes a valid point, even if he states it in an unnecessarily (and characteristically) provocative way.  If I were to reformulate it less tendentiously, it would be something like this:

"To what extent is it appropriate to extrapolate to a large population a small-N study, however rigorously conducted, in the absence of similarly rigorous corroborating studies?"

It's a fair question.  The answer, as always, is that science is a process, not an end result, and that one of the reasons for publication is to encourage further research that can replicate or challenge the initial finding.

Ask the people of Wuhan that needed make shift hospitals created or the doctors from the Lombardy region of Italy or the people of NYC last year.

The question of how do we make assertions is driven by observations of large populations (which have already happened), not by small-N studies. We say that based on large populations X% need hospitalisation, Y% will die so that 1 in N for small studies is extrapolated using already established data for larger groups of people.
Logged
Pages: 1 ... 43 44 [45] 46 47 ... 153   Go Up