Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa

[digitaldog]

Joe is the king of gibberish, non-sequiturs, and a complete lack of shame and awareness of how asinine he sounds. I have learned to ignore him. Trying to have an intelligent conversation with him is like trying to teach calculus to a fencepost. Don't waste your time.

+1
There's a saying in Italian that describes having such a conversation with him and Alan that goes: "A lavar la testa all'asino si perde tempo e sapone", which roughly translates to "If you try to shampoo a donkey's head, you are wasting both your time and your soap."

[Chris Kern]

"A lavar la testa all'asino si perde tempo e sapone" . . .

Mi piace!  (And I don't even speak Italian, but the nice thing about Romance languages is that if you know any of them, you can often appreciate idioms in the others.)

[JoeKitchen]

Joe is the king of gibberish, non-sequiturs, and a complete lack of shame and awareness of how asinine he sounds. I have learned to ignore him. Trying to have an intelligent conversation with him is like trying to teach calculus to a fencepost. Don't waste your time.

LOL! 

As I said before, you can not name a left wing conspiracy theocracy you, Peter, have not promoted here.  It really is sad how much nonsense you actually believe. 

[JoeKitchen]

Actually, it is not as much TDS as the fear of of GOP members of losing half of their constituents if they abandoned Trump. They are still clinging to the past and Trump's butt parotting shamelessly and endlessly his lie about the election steal. Instead of accepting the democratic principles they prefer to purge their party of any dissidents and thus eventually run it into the ground. Very shortsighted.

It is not shortsighted. 

Cheney can not stay on focus, and that is the truth of it.  No one cares what she said/voted in January; they care about what she does not say when interviewed buy the news.  If she would stay on point and talk about Biden, she would still be in her position.  But like so many otherTDS sufferers, she just cant move on past a politician that is longer in office, even though Co-President Biden is giving her so many things to talk about.  That is the story of it, nothing more. 

Many on the left, like conspiracy theorist Alt, want to keep Trump in the news because it benefits the Dems, but Cheney is not a Dem.  So if she cant stay on point, good bye! 

And I'd say good riddance.  She would be happy to get us in another war soon enough. 

[LesPalenik]

Trump kept us out of any new wars, lowered taxes, improved the economy, lowered unemployment for everyone including to the lowest ever for minorities.  He canceled the losing Iran agreement, Paris agreement, and started pressing China on their stealing IP from us.  HIs Operation Warp Speed has allowed America to have vaccinated more people than any other country.  I wished he would have cut government spending and printing more.  But Biden has quadrupled down on that and the inflation price increases are showing that it's going to get a lot worse. 

While Janet Yellen downplays the inflation, in the real world it is getting ridiculously high. In Toronto, an 8ft long piece of pressure treated 2'x4' at Home Depot costs now over $12Cdn plus 13% tax, and apparently, car rental agencies in Hawaii charge over $700 a day for a small car.

While the trucks are usually used for moving, tourists are now renting them because rental car prices have skyrocketed with the rebound of the tourism industry. Covid-19 brought tourism to a halt, but with states now easing restrictions, the industry has come bouncing back with force. The cheapest rental car in Maui in March ran for $722 a day, according to CNN affiliate KHNL-TV.
"This surge in demand is primarily for our smaller vehicles," said Kaleo Alau, U-Haul Company of Hawaii president, in an emailed statement to CNN. "We realize this demand is occurring when tourists are unable to secure a rental car, or they learn that our rental fleet options are more affordable."

https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/25/us/hawaii-u-haul-tourist-rental-trnd/index.html

[LesPalenik]

It is not shortsighted. 

Cheney can not stay on focus, and that is the truth of it.  No one cares what she said/voted in January; they care about what she does not say when interviewed buy the news.  If she would stay on point and talk about Biden, she would still be in her position.  But like so many otherTDS sufferers, she just cant move on past a politician that is longer in office, even though Co-President Biden is giving her so many things to talk about.  That is the story of it, nothing more. 

Many on the left, like conspiracy theorist Alt, want to keep Trump in the news because it benefits the Dems, but Cheney is not a Dem.  So if she cant stay on point, good bye! 

And I'd say good riddance.  She would be happy to get us in another war soon enough.

She has more courage than most GOP members.

Telling CNN's Jake Tapper on "The Lead" that there are "more members who believe in substance and policy and ideals than are willing to say so," Cheney cited the impeachment vote earlier this year, in which she was one of only 10 House Republicans who voted to hold Trump accountable for the Capitol riot.
"If you look at the vote to impeach, for example, there were members who told me that they were afraid for their own security -- afraid, in some instances, for their lives," she said. "And that tells you something about where we are as a country, that members of Congress aren't able to cast votes, or feel that they can't, because of their own security."

https://www.cnn.com/2021/05/14/politics/liz-cheney-republican-party-cnntv/index.html

[Alan Klein]

While Janet Yellen downplays the inflation, in the real world it is getting ridiculously high. In Toronto, an 8ft long piece of pressure treated 2'x4' at Home Depot costs now over $12Cdn plus 13% tax, and apparently, car rental agencies in Hawaii charge over $700 a day for a small car.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/25/us/hawaii-u-haul-tourist-rental-trnd/index.html

I checked rentals in Oahu for July 17-24 through AARP Avis and they have no cars available.  That's pretty cheap. 

[Alan Klein]

She has more courage than most GOP members.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/05/14/politics/liz-cheney-republican-party-cnntv/index.html

You're reading a CNN article which is biased on the face of it.  If those Republicans didn't vote for impeachment because of fear, why did those same congressmen vote against Cheney?  Maybe they were telling her they were fearful because they didn't want to tell her to her face that she was wrong.  As a leader of the party, you don't undermine it.  Are you telling me that 100% of the Demcorats agree with everything Biden is doing?  That they all agree with his policies at the border?  On the budget?  Is Sen Manchin the only one with guts?

[LesPalenik]

You're reading a CNN article which is biased on the face of it.  If those Republicans didn't vote for impeachment because of fear, why did those same congressmen vote against Cheney?  Maybe they were telling her they were fearful because they didn't want to tell her to her face that she was wrong.  As a leader of the party, you don't undermine it.  Are you telling me that 100% of the Demcorats agree with everything Biden is doing?  That they all agree with his policies at the border?  On the budget?  Is Sen Manchin the only one with guts?

Many questions. The only answer I can give is that Cheney is a decent person, whereas Trump and most of his disciples are not.

[James Clark]

You're reading a CNN article which is biased on the face of it.  If those Republicans didn't vote for impeachment because of fear, why did those same congressmen vote against Cheney?  Maybe they were telling her they were fearful because they didn't want to tell her to her face that she was wrong.  As a leader of the party, you don't undermine it.

If you care about representative democracy, you sure as hell do when the party in question actually tried to overrule the results of a fair election.  I know you think people should just "move on" etc., and I suspect more people would agree with you if we were talking about policy questions.  I get it - we're on to the next guy now, so let's talk about that.  But the problem is, we're really not.  The Republicans, who have a real chance of regaining some portion of power in 2 years, are still actively supporting the person who is still claiming that the election was stolen. 

Let me ask you this - in 2024, let's assume Trump runs again, and he loses the popular vote in states like AZ or PA, but let's also assume that Republicans have managed to retake and control those state legislatures/governments/house delegations.  Do you think those states honor the outcome of the election, or do you think those Republican legislatures, who have suddenly had an amazing case of amnesia about January 6th, or who are still actively pursuing the idea that the election of 2020 was rigged - refuse to send Biden electors to the EC vote (or cast a vote in the House for Trump even if he lost?) 

The reason Trump is still front and center is because Republicans are keeping him there. 

Oh - one more thing.  Short-term price volatility due to unforeseen events (like a major pipeline shutting down, or used car prices skyrocketing because new cars can't be produced due to chip shortages) isn't "inflation." 

[James Clark]

I checked rentals in Oahu for July 17-24 through AARP Avis and they have no cars available.  That's pretty cheap. 

Rental companies sold off much of their inventory due to travel being basically nonexistent.  Now they have 10% of the cars they did before, and can't keep up with demand.  Hence availability problems and crazy prices.  Also not inflation.

[James Clark]

Many questions. The only answer I can give is that Cheney is a decent person, whereas Trump and most of his disciples are not.

Well, she's a person that understands that trying to steal an election isn't ok if you want to actually have a functioning representative democracy, but that's sort of a bare minimum for decency in the political arena, isn't it?   

Here's a fun fact though - did you know that Ilhan Omar - part of "The Squad" and one of the prime targets of Trumper rage - actually has a higher rating from the Club for Growth (a hard right think tank) than Elise Stefanik (who was chosen to replace Cheney) does?   Omar literally grades out as more conservative than Stefanik, but refuses to parrot the Big Lie, and must thus be silenced.  What's the difference?  Stefanik is down the rabbit hole with Trumper lies, of course.

[Alan Klein]

Many questions. The only answer I can give is that Cheney is a decent person, whereas Trump and most of his disciples are not.

Democrats called Dick Cheney "Darth Vader", they hated him so much.  Now, because his daughter is opposed to Trump, he's a hero and so is she.  It's all politics. 

[Alan Klein]

If you care about representative democracy, you sure as hell do when the party in question actually tried to overrule the results of a fair election.  I know you think people should just "move on" etc., and I suspect more people would agree with you if we were talking about policy questions.  I get it - we're on to the next guy now, so let's talk about that.  But the problem is, we're really not.  The Republicans, who have a real chance of regaining some portion of power in 2 years, are still actively supporting the person who is still claiming that the election was stolen. 

Let me ask you this - in 2024, let's assume Trump runs again, and he loses the popular vote in states like AZ or PA, but let's also assume that Republicans have managed to retake and control those state legislatures/governments/house delegations.  Do you think those states honor the outcome of the election, or do you think those Republican legislatures, who have suddenly had an amazing case of amnesia about January 6th, or who are still actively pursuing the idea that the election of 2020 was rigged - refuse to send Biden electors to the EC vote (or cast a vote in the House for Trump even if he lost?) 

The reason Trump is still front and center is because Republicans are keeping him there. 

Oh - one more thing.  Short-term price volatility due to unforeseen events (like a major pipeline shutting down, or used car prices skyrocketing because new cars can't be produced due to chip shortages) isn't "inflation." 

Both parties have for years objected to the results of elections. That's a perfectly legitimate position. Have you forgotten about Gore in 2000?  There are many congressional and senatorial races where claims have been filed.  In fact, there were those in the 2016 election, I believe in two or three states. Objections are always raised about them and it's taken to court as the Republicans and Trump did.   There were objections about the electoral votes on Jan 6 2016. You take it up in the courts who then decide.  A party cannot "overrule" an election.  That's just hyperbole on your part.
https://foxbaltimore.com/news/nation-world/objections-to-a-presidential-certification-vote-is-not-rare-dems-did-the-same-to-trump
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2017/01/06/congress-certify-trumps-victory-friday-challengers-grasp-straws/96218660/
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/dec/01/donald-trump-michigan-recount-objection

[Alan Klein]

Rental companies sold off much of their inventory due to travel being basically nonexistent.  Now they have 10% of the cars they did before, and can't keep up with demand.  Hence availability problems and crazy prices.  Also not inflation.

Inflation is the expansion of the money supply as we have had under Trump and now Biden and before both as well.  Prices going up or down can occur because of inflation and/or other reasons.  Most experts predict that inflation is causing price increases.  I think the 4.2% and .9% just published is just the start of a period of higher prices caused by inflation. I hope the president and congress now see it coming and will lower their insistence on huge giveaway and infrastructure programs.  If you haven't lived through the 1970s and early 1980s as I did and experienced runaway prices and less economic productivity and jobs (called "stagflation"), you're in for a huge shock. 

[Alan Klein]

While Janet Yellen downplays the inflation, in the real world it is getting ridiculously high. In Toronto, an 8ft long piece of pressure treated 2'x4' at Home Depot costs now over $12Cdn plus 13% tax, and apparently, car rental agencies in Hawaii charge over $700 a day for a small car.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/25/us/hawaii-u-haul-tourist-rental-trnd/index.html

When my wife and I were in Oahu 7 years ago, we rented a hot red Camaro convertible for about $70 a day for three days.  They originally gave us a Ford Mustang, but I had a problem with getting the top down.  So they upgraded us for nothing. Those days are gone. 

[James Clark]

Both parties have for years objected to the results of elections. That's a perfectly legitimate position. Have you forgotten about Gore in 2000?  There are many congressional and senatorial races where claims have been filed.  In fact, there were those in the 2016 election, I believe in two or three states. Objections are always raised about them and it's taken to court as the Republicans and Trump did.   There were objections about the electoral votes on Jan 6 2016. You take it up in the courts who then decide.  A party cannot "overrule" an election.  That's just hyperbole on your part.
https://foxbaltimore.com/news/nation-world/objections-to-a-presidential-certification-vote-is-not-rare-dems-did-the-same-to-trump
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2017/01/06/congress-certify-trumps-victory-friday-challengers-grasp-straws/96218660/
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/dec/01/donald-trump-michigan-recount-objection

Specifically here, I'm referring to the Republican idea that legislatures should *ignore* the state's popular vote and send electors for Trump anyway, or the idea that Pence should have refused to certify and thrown it back to the House where Republicans have a state-number advantage.   

[James Clark]

Inflation is the expansion of the money supply as we have had under Trump and now Biden and before both as well.  Prices going up or down can occur because of inflation and/or other reasons.  Most experts predict that inflation is causing price increases.  I think the 4.2% and .9% just published is just the start of a period of higher prices caused by inflation. I hope the president and congress now see it coming and will lower their insistence on huge giveaway and infrastructure programs.  If you haven't lived through the 1970s and early 1980s as I did and experienced runaway prices and less economic productivity and jobs (called "stagflation"), you're in for a huge shock.

Sure, and in general I share your concern.  What we've seen for over a decade now though is that maybe those concerns are misplaced - I really don't know.  What I do know is that I'm more comfortable fixing the immediate problem and then fixing the fallout later.  Sort of like you don't hold off on radiation even though it'll cause cancer in 30 years, because it'll cure the cancer that you have today, today...

[LesPalenik]

Rental companies sold off much of their inventory due to travel being basically nonexistent.  Now they have 10% of the cars they did before, and can't keep up with demand.  Hence availability problems and crazy prices.  Also not inflation.

And they can't order more cars, because the car manfacturers were shortsighted as well and didn't order enough computer chips from chip foundries who need 2 years to ramp up their production. True, this is not an example of a classical inflation, but prices were raised excessively nevertheless and they will never return to the pre-pandemic levels.

[LesPalenik]

I checked rentals in Oahu for July 17-24 through AARP Avis and they have no cars available.  That's pretty cheap. 

Same thing in many other states. In Alaska, they are no rental cars available till the end of the summer.