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Author Topic: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa  (Read 204545 times)

Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8480 on: March 04, 2021, 10:16:22 am »

The reason we never can see eye to eye on some of these issues is that we're not really discussing their inherent values.  We all ignore those things and use them as symbols to fight politically.  That's a shame.  Because these are important issues by themselves.  We see the same thing in issues such as relations with Russia, trade policy, Iran deal, etc.  Our arguments for and against are based on political positioning rather than their inherent issue.  We all deceive ourselves into thinking we're really discussing the pros and cons when it's all about positioning for political power. 

Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8481 on: March 04, 2021, 10:23:05 am »

Perhaps for some. Certainly not for all. Sweeping generalizations are rarely helpful.
Of course, for many people, their inherent issue is the issue.  Unfortunately, they are quickly politicisxed publicly.  So it's hard to take scientific or economic positions without drifting into politics.  Groupthink takes over and we're fighting for political advantage.  Happens all the time.  Can you really say there are no politics in discussions about Covid? 

digitaldog

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8482 on: March 04, 2021, 10:27:48 am »

Of course, for many people, their inherent issue is the issue.  Unfortunately, they are quickly politicisxed publicly.
More Hypocrisye... :P
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faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8483 on: March 04, 2021, 10:33:32 am »

The reason we never can see eye to eye on some of these issues is that we're not really discussing their inherent values.  We all ignore those things and use them as symbols to fight politically.  That's a shame.  Because these are important issues by themselves.  We see the same thing in issues such as relations with Russia, trade policy, Iran deal, etc.  Our arguments for and against are based on political positioning rather than their inherent issue.  We all deceive ourselves into thinking we're really discussing the pros and cons when it's all about positioning for political power.

I disagree with your analysis, and ask you to kindly leave me out of all those sweeping generalizations.
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faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8484 on: March 04, 2021, 10:36:57 am »

Of course, for many people, their inherent issue is the issue.  Unfortunately, they are quickly politicisxed publicly.  So it's hard to take scientific or economic positions without drifting into politics.  Groupthink takes over and we're fighting for political advantage.  Happens all the time.  Can you really say there are no politics in discussions about Covid?

I disagree with your analysis. Since no one said that there was no politics about COVID, that would be a straw man. Did I mention more sweeping generalizations.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8485 on: March 04, 2021, 10:38:35 am »

I disagree with your analysis, and ask you to kindly leave me out of all those sweeping generalizations.
I disagree with your viewpoint and think many of your conclusions are politically based, not scientific or economic.  So I'll continue to include you. 

faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8486 on: March 04, 2021, 10:40:18 am »

I disagree with your viewpoint and think many of your conclusions are politically based, not scientific or economic.  So I'll continue to include you.

Certainly your prerogative. I can only ask nicely.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8487 on: March 04, 2021, 10:43:17 am »

Certainly your prerogative. I can only ask nicely.
Nothing to fight about.  Many of my conclusions are politically based as well.  After all, we're all human.  Well, that is if my being a Neanderthal is considered human.  :)

faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8488 on: March 04, 2021, 10:52:50 am »

The stock market goes up today as unemployment claims continue at a brutal pace.  That's crazy.

Depends on how you view the stock market. There are any number of reasons the stock market might go up as unemployment continues to be an issue. I won't bore you with them. I know there are others here who are more knowledgeable than I am on the subject.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2021, 10:59:41 am by faberryman »
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8489 on: March 04, 2021, 10:55:50 am »

Under pressure by fellow Democrats who want to take away his COvid powers due to the nursing home scandal and his sex scandal, NY Gov Cuomo is lowering restrictions mainly based on political considerations, not science.  That's my opinion, for the Truth Brigade here.

Cuomo is loosening capacity limits on New York gatherings.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/03/world/new-york-gathering-sizes.html

Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8490 on: March 04, 2021, 10:58:59 am »

Depends on how you view the stock market. There are any number of reasons the stock market might go up as unemployment continues to be an issue. I won't bore you with them.
Well sure.  Congress's $1.9 trillion spending package is close to passing.  That ought to goose the market.  Meanwhile, another 3/4 of a million people lost their jobs, 3 1/2 times the usual number.  So how is the economy good?

faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8491 on: March 04, 2021, 11:07:18 am »

Well sure.  Congress's $1.9 trillion spending package is close to passing.  That ought to goose the market.  Meanwhile, another 3/4 of a million people lost their jobs, 3 1/2 times the usual number.  So how is the economy good?

No one said the economy was good, so that is a straw man.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8492 on: March 04, 2021, 11:10:25 am »

No one said the economy was good, so that is a straw man.
I didn't say you did.  The point I was making is the market usually goes up when the economy is good, not bad.  Before Covid, could you imagine how much it would sink if we had unemployment statistics like this?  But we're living in unusual times. 

faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8493 on: March 04, 2021, 11:12:43 am »

Under pressure by fellow Democrats who want to take away his COvid powers due to the nursing home scandal and his sex scandal, NY Gov Cuomo is lowering restrictions mainly based on political considerations, not science.  That's my opinion, for the Truth Brigade here.

Cuomo is loosening capacity limits on New York gatherings.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/03/world/new-york-gathering-sizes.html

Lowering capacity limitations is occurring in a number of jurisdictions where the political leaders are not embroiled in a nursing home and sex scandal. Post hoc ergo propter hoc.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8494 on: March 04, 2021, 11:20:53 am »

Lowering capacity limitations is occurring in a number of jurisdictions where the political leaders are not embroiled in a nursing home and sex scandal. Post hoc ergo propter hoc.
I'm sure Cuomo is thinking more about politics at this time than science. 

digitaldog

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8495 on: March 04, 2021, 11:51:58 am »

I'm sure Cuomo is thinking more about politics at this time than science.
At least he sometimes thinks about science; give it a try.
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TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8496 on: March 04, 2021, 11:56:55 am »

"The U.S. government will facilitate this partnership in several key ways, including invoking the Defense Production Act to equip two Merck facilities to the standards necessary to safety manufacture the vaccine and asking the Department of Defense to provide daily logistical support to strengthen Johnson & Johnson's efforts," Psaki said during Tuesday afternoon's press briefing.

Thanks Joe!

Merck to Help Produce Johnson & Johnson’s COVID-19 Vaccine; BARDA to Provide Merck With Funding to Expand Merck’s Manufacturing Capacity for COVID-19 Vaccines and Medicines

https://www.merck.com/news/merck-to-help-produce-johnson-barda-to-provide-merck-with-funding-to-expand-mercks-manufacturing-capacity-for-covid-19-vaccines-and-medicines/

Merck (NYSE:MRK), known as MSD outside the United States and Canada, announced today it has entered into multiple agreements to support efforts to expand manufacturing capacity and supply of SARS-CoV-2/COVID-19 medicines and vaccines. The Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority (BARDA), a division of the Office of the Assistant Secretary for Preparedness and Response (ASPR) within the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services (HHS), will provide Merck with funding of up to $268.8 million to adapt and make available a number of existing manufacturing facilities for the production of SARS-CoV-2/COVID-19 vaccines and medicines. Merck has also entered into agreements with Janssen Pharmaceuticals, Inc., one of the Janssen Pharmaceutical Companies of Johnson & Johnson, to support the manufacturing and supply of Johnson & Johnson’s SARS-CoV-2/COVID-19 vaccine. Merck will use its facilities in the United States to produce drug substance, formulate and fill vials of Johnson & Johnson’s vaccine.

“We are steadfast in our commitment to contribute to the global response to the pandemic as part of the remarkable efforts of the entire medical and scientific community,” said Mike Nally, executive vice president, Human Health at Merck. “This funding from BARDA will allow us to accelerate our efforts to scale up our manufacturing capacity to enable timely delivery of much needed medicines and vaccines for the pandemic.”

Under the terms of the BARDA agreement, Merck will adapt and make available some of the company’s existing manufacturing sites to accelerate manufacturing efforts for SARS-CoV-2/COVID-19 vaccines and medicines. This funding is in addition to Merck’s continued investment in its global vaccines manufacturing network as part of its planned capital investments of more than $20 billion from 2020 through the end of 2024.

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faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8497 on: March 04, 2021, 12:04:15 pm »

I'm sure Cuomo is thinking more about politics at this time than science.

I am sure that you are sure. I don't think you have ever met an ulterior motive that you didn't like. From my perspective, Cuomo seems like a guy who can walk and chew gum at the same time. But, maybe not.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2021, 12:58:15 pm by faberryman »
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LesPalenik

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8498 on: March 04, 2021, 12:06:06 pm »

Well sure.  Congress's $1.9 trillion spending package is close to passing.  That ought to goose the market.  Meanwhile, another 3/4 of a million people lost their jobs, 3 1/2 times the usual number.  So how is the economy good?

With 750K new unemployed, the Fed is not going to raise the interest rates. And that is a good thing.
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TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #8499 on: March 04, 2021, 01:09:14 pm »

The reason Biden can promise May, is because of Trump.

False. The Biden administration has taken a very aggressive all-of-government approach in procuring more vaccine; speeding up production and delivery; and assisting states in getting vaccines administered to people. There is even a National Strategic COVID-19 Response Plan for the public to read which was published the day after taking office.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/National-Strategy-for-the-COVID-19-Response-and-Pandemic-Preparedness.pdf

It's the reason over 70 million Americans have already been vaccinated

False. The number as of yesterday was 53 million Americans vaccinated with their first dose. Included within that 53 million, a subset of 27 million have also received their second dose.

27 million Americans that have received two doses = 54 million doses administered to 27 million Americans. Add the additional 26 million Americans that have received only their first dose and you get a total of 80 million doses given to 53 million Americans.

Giving one American two doses of vaccine does not add up to two Americans vaccinated. We are currently vaccinating at a rate of just over 2 million doses per day (First and Second Doses), so it is a constantly growing number.

While your PM was sitting on his duff

If you read the FEMA Community Vaccination Centers Playbook published last month, you'll find the reference conceptual plan for facility layout and procedural flow chart was borrowed from Canada Public Health (Page 25). Of course, each facility will require its own unique floor plan which is drawn up by the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers; but the reference conceptual layouts and procedural flow methodology come from our friends in Canada. Thanks Canada!

https://www.fema.gov/sites/default/files/documents/fema_community-vaccination-centers_playbook_02-18-2021.pdf
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