US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)

Biden

14 (66.7%)

Trump

7 (33.3%)

Total Members Voted: 21

Voting closed: November 02, 2020, 06:25:59 pm

[Alan Goldhammer]

Regarding Trump getting tax write-offs, all real estate investors get the same write-offs.  It may not be good.  So Congress can change it.  I happen to agree they should not have special write-offs.  All businesses should be treated the same.

There is what's called the Alternative Minimum Tax to prevent abuse.  It prevents rich people for writing off everything and they have to pay something.  I don't know if Trump got involved with that.   It's possible his write offs occured before that tax was created and carried forward.  Maybe someone else knows the answer to this.

Trump was subject to AMT but because of his many failed business ventures he had huge amounts to write off that were carried forward.  The New York Times has a short article on how he only payed $750 in 2017:  https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/29/us/trump-750-taxes.html  A good portion of his income came from shares in Voranado Realty Trust who took over some of the valuable properties in exchange for equity.  They, and not Trump, manage the properties.  This includes a very high value property in San Francisco that has a 'ghost' office leased by the Sovereign Wealth Fund of Qatar that pays rent but there is nobody who works there.

You can see in the table of the NYT article how the tax bill got cancelled out.  It is pretty straight forward accounting.  I was surprised by how high his Screen Actors Guild pension was.

[PeterAit]

One does not want to wish illness on anyone, but I could not suppress a small internal smirk on hearing that Trump has covid. Talk about your just desserts!

[MattBurt]

Well at least “It affects virtually nobody”.

[chez]

One does not want to wish illness on anyone, but I could not suppress a small internal smirk on hearing that Trump has covid. Talk about your just desserts!

Yeh the three stooges, Trump, Bolsonaro and Johnson all down played the virus and has bit all of them in their respective butts...some butts bigger than others.

[faberryman]

Show us your tax returns test results.

[faberryman]

One does not want to wish illness on anyone...

I am still struggling with that. I bet there are a lot of Senate Republicans hoping he will take one for the team.

[chez]

Show us your tax returns test results.

Yes...unfortunately when one is a compulsive liar it's hard to know when the truth is spoken.

[faberryman]

I forgot to mention how thankful I am that Trump was able to bring back Big 10 football before catching the virus. Of all the things we have had to give up, I can't imagine how we would have coped without Big 10 football.

On another note, I wonder if there is a stock market play on hydrocloroquine. I am probably too late for that. Never mind.

[Alan Klein]

Sure. So anyway what was your point about Obama's ego and naming stuff again?
...

Well, all presidents have loads of ego. Certainly Obama had it in spades, his strutting around on stage with his chin up.  But you're comparing Trump publicity in civilian life which is his stock in trade.  He sells his name for others to put on their products and to advertise his products.  So him using it is as much a financial requirement  as well as his ego.  Obama as a government official got his name on a major legislation - Obamacare.  Sure, it's an informal name.  But no one calls it by its real name -The Affordable Care Act.  In fact, I had to look it up.  I couldn't even remember what it's real name is.

[Alan Klein]

because 'Klein Towers' are very small

Only my hands.

[Alan Klein]

One does not want to wish illness on anyone, but I could not suppress a small internal smirk on hearing that Trump has covid. Talk about your just desserts!

I saw plenty of smirking on CNN and MSNBC.  You're in good company.  So now we have one guy with the virus and another with the beginning of senility.  If VP Pence comes down with it, we might have Speaker Nancy Pelosi running the government before the election as she's next in line constitutionally after the president and VP.  I already voted by mail ln NJ.  I wonder if I can recall it? 

[faberryman]

Just to brighten your day, another commenter noted: "I like presidents who don't catch coronavirus". John McCain is smiling.

[PeterAit]

Obama as a government official got his name on a major legislation - Obamacare.  Sure, it's an informal name.

ObamaCare started as a derogatory name assigned by the Republicans to denigrate the act as they sought to repeal it. And now it's a mark of Obama's ego?

[Alan Klein]

ObamaCare started as a derogatory name assigned by the Republicans to denigrate the act as they sought to repeal it. And now it's a mark of Obama's ego?

I don't recall Obama telling anyone to stop using it.  Just think.  Social Security could have been called RooseveltCares.

[MattBurt]

I don't recall Obama telling anyone to stop using it.  Just think.  Social Security could have been called RooseveltCares.

Lol, can't you do better than that? How about tying in some birtherism or something?

[Alan Klein]

Trump was subject to AMT but because of his many failed business ventures he had huge amounts to write off that were carried forward.  The New York Times has a short article on how he only payed $750 in 2017:  https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/29/us/trump-750-taxes.html  A good portion of his income came from shares in Voranado Realty Trust who took over some of the valuable properties in exchange for equity.  They, and not Trump, manage the properties.  This includes a very high value property in San Francisco that has a 'ghost' office leased by the Sovereign Wealth Fund of Qatar that pays rent but there is nobody who works there.

You can see in the table of the NYT article how the tax bill got cancelled out.  It is pretty straight forward accounting.  I was surprised by how high his Screen Actors Guild pension was.

If it's straight forward accounting, and standard business deductions, why is the NY Times and the rest of the fake news press writing about it like he's a thief?  It's an obvious smear again before an election as the Times has done in the past with nominees for president they are opposed too. 

[Alan Goldhammer]

If it's straight forward accounting, and standard business deductions, why is the NY Times and the rest of the fake news press writing about it like he's a thief?  It's an obvious smear again before an election as the Times has done in the past with nominees for president they are opposed too.

The devil is in the details and we do not know what all the deductions were which is probably more concerning. You and I have no idea about the legitimacy of the deductions.  To cite but one example for which there is documentation, Ivanka Trump was pad $750K consulting fee despite the fact that she was a named officer of the LLC for the property in question and this was taken off as a business deduction.  This stinks and clearly is a way to transfer wealth outside of the normal tax situation.

What the Times reporting shows is that Trump is a pretty poor businessman and that had it not been for the income from 'The Apprentice' he would have really struggled.  He also pissed away a lot of that money buying golf courses.  Many have pointed to his great business acumen and that is exactly what the NY Times dispels.  the other key thing that I have noted ad nauseum is he campaigned in 2016 that he knew how to reform the tax code.  Maybe he did, but you certainly do not see anything that points out that he had any influence at all. 

[faberryman]

The devil is in the details and we do not know what all the deductions were which is probably more concerning. You and I have no idea about the legitimacy of the deductions.

Why would anyone give Donald Trump the benefit of the doubt about anything? I can just hear it now: Trump's business deductions weren't fraudulent, they were just exaggerations or merely aspirational.

[faberryman]

In the time it took my browser to refresh, The Daily Beast put up a story about the conspiracy theories that have arisen on Twitter in connection with Trump's positive test for coronavirus. I liked this one:

"Some posts, like WMM podcast and CNN political analyst Joe Lockhart, floated the idea that these cascading scandals somehow replace each other. “This is the world we live in. The Kimberly [Guilfoyle sexual harassment] story gave us a break from the Trump the racist story. The Melania tapes gave us a break from the Kimberly story. And the Covid diagnosis gave us a break from the Melania tape story. NUTS.”"

https://www.thedailybeast.com/conspiracy-theory-twitter-is-going-nuts-over-trumps-covid-diagnosis

In case you are not familiar with the Melania tapes story, here's a link. Apparently, she is not all that excited about Christmas decorations:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/melania-trump-spouts-off-in-secret-recording-who-gives-a-fk-about-christmas-stuff

The Kimberly Guilfoyle sexual harassment story can be found here:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/10/01/media/kimberly-guilfoyle-fox-allegations/index.html

The Trump's a racist story, just Google "Trump racist" and take your pick.

[Robert Roaldi]

Trump blames the decline of suburbia on the usual suspects, https://www.politico.com/news/2020/10/01/how-white-grievance-politics-informs-trumps-campaign-playbook-424590.

Have the suburbs declined?

But if they have, maybe all the people there can flee back to the cities from which they took flight decades ago.

Cringe-worthy bar talk again. It's embarrassing listening to this crap.