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Author Topic: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS  (Read 86353 times)

Alan Klein

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1760 on: July 12, 2020, 11:40:53 pm »

New York City reports zero COVID-19 deaths for first time since pandemic hit
https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/506983-nyc-reports-zero-coronavirus-deaths-for-first-time-since-start-of

Alan Klein

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1761 on: July 13, 2020, 10:47:43 am »

Alan G.  I found an anti Covid products on a list from American Chemistry Council's (ACC) Center for Biocide Chemistries (CBC) http://www.afdo.org/resources/Documents/COVID19/COVID19List382020.pdf  The product I looked for is on this list but not on the EPA list https://www.epa.gov/pesticide-registration/list-n-disinfectants-use-against-sars-cov-2-covid-19

Here's the product. EPA Reg 6836-340-75399 Wipes Plus

Can we trust the ACC list?

degrub

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1762 on: July 13, 2020, 12:13:29 pm »

it is on the EPA list per the registration number. Follow the web page instructions to search.
10 minute wet contact time to kill adequately.
common for many non chlorine disinfectants.
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Alan Klein

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1763 on: July 13, 2020, 12:40:39 pm »

it is on the EPA list per the registration number. Follow the web page instructions to search.
10 minute wet contact time to kill adequately.
common for many non chlorine disinfectants.
The number came up but for a different product.  What was the link you used?

degrub

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1764 on: July 13, 2020, 12:54:10 pm »

the EPA registration number is for the solution and is registered by the manufacturer after testing. If the product, even with a different "vendor" uses that registration number, then it is supposed to be the same stuff and is just a re-branding of the solution from the manufacturer.

Here are the guidelines -
List N: Disinfectants for Use Against SARS-CoV-2 (COVID-19)
View List N's information in our new tool
List N Web App tool

All products on this list meet EPA’s criteria for use against SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19.
Finding a Product

To find a product, enter the first two sets of its EPA registration number into the search bar below. You can find this number by looking for the EPA Reg. No. on the product label.

For example, if EPA Reg. No. 12345-12 is on List N, you can buy EPA Reg. No. 12345-12-2567 and know you’re getting an equivalent product.

« Last Edit: July 13, 2020, 01:02:53 pm by degrub »
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faberryman

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1765 on: July 13, 2020, 02:44:04 pm »

Coronavirus immunity can start to fade away within weeks

https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-new-uk-study-shows-antibodies-fade-after-three-weeks-2020-7

This does not sound very promising.
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Robert Roaldi

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1766 on: July 13, 2020, 04:41:28 pm »

Coronavirus immunity can start to fade away within weeks

https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-new-uk-study-shows-antibodies-fade-after-three-weeks-2020-7

This does not sound very promising.

Are there other mechanisms besides anti-bodies that the body can use to fight off infection? On the face of it, this sounds like we might not be able to rely on herd immunity.
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PeterAit

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1767 on: July 13, 2020, 04:51:11 pm »

As Alan G says - unless you plan to lick it, don't worry.

Not so. Touch the cardboard, then touch your face, and you can get infected.
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Robert Roaldi

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1768 on: July 13, 2020, 06:21:55 pm »

Not so. Touch the cardboard, then touch your face, and you can get infected.

Yes, the physical possibility is there. But a lot of things have to happen, someone with a viral on their hands has to touch something and leave some virus behind on it, the surface has to be hospitable to the virus for some period of time, then someone has to come along and touch the still intact virus and then touch their face before washing their hands. It can happen of course, easy to imagine in a workplace, for example, where there is frequent traffic at some particular location (coffee machine?), but I can see that it's a much less probable form of transmission.
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BobShaw

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1769 on: July 13, 2020, 07:10:54 pm »

Yes, the physical possibility is there. ..... but I can see that it's a much less probable form of transmission.
Why?
To catch the virus off someone you have to at least be in the same place at the same time as the person with the virus.
To catch the virus off something they have touched the person with the virus can be long gone, perhaps by days.
You receive a parcel and anyone along the chain could have been infected or you go to a pub and use a coaster that someone else has touched. (That is why there are no coasters now.)
The answer is to wash your hands often, especially after touching something that you don't know where it has been.
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hogloff

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1770 on: July 13, 2020, 07:18:14 pm »

Why?
To catch the virus off someone you have to at least be in the same place at the same time as the person with the virus.
To catch the virus off something they have touched the person with the virus can be long gone, perhaps by days.
You receive a parcel and anyone along the chain could have been infected or you go to a pub and use a coaster that someone else has touched. (That is why there are no coasters now.)
The answer is to wash your hands often, especially after touching something that you don't know where it has been.

That's right...but you are in control. Don't touch your face and wash your hands whenever you can. Unlike when someone infected sneezes a foot away from you as they lean in to get that tomato at the grocery store. Now, wearing a mask should help you, but unless it's n95 caliber, there is no guarantees.
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BobShaw

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1771 on: July 13, 2020, 07:40:53 pm »

That's right...but you are in control. Don't touch your face and wash your hands whenever you can. Unlike when someone infected sneezes a foot away from you as they lean in to get that tomato at the grocery store. Now, wearing a mask should help you, but unless it's n95 caliber, there is no guarantees.
To some extent, but the person sneezing has to wear the mask. Masks don't protect the wearer really, as you can get infected through the eyes. Masks can become a source of infection themselves.
Doctors wear masks to protect the patient. If the patient is infected they wear full protection.
(I am reminded about wearing a full face helmet and sneezing when I used to ride a motorcycle.)
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Alan Klein

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1772 on: July 13, 2020, 11:54:23 pm »

Yes, the physical possibility is there. But a lot of things have to happen, someone with a viral on their hands has to touch something and leave some virus behind on it, the surface has to be hospitable to the virus for some period of time, then someone has to come along and touch the still intact virus and then touch their face before washing their hands. It can happen of course, easy to imagine in a workplace, for example, where there is frequent traffic at some particular location (coffee machine?), but I can see that it's a much less probable form of transmission.
No one really knows for sure just how dangerous it is.  If it has no danger, why are the experts talking about these things?  Frankly, you're just guessing.  But then again, most of the experts are guessing too.   

I was picking up food at a grocery.  The kid was dropping all the bags in the trunk of my car.  I could see in my rear view mirror that his mask was pulled down below his nose.  Her reached up and wiped it with the back of his hand and then continued to load the rest of the bags.  When I got home a few minutes later, and had to take the bags out of the car, I naturally was careful and sanitized my hands afterwards.  But who really knows just how often the virus is spread by this kind of touch.

When I checked into a building in Manhattan, I had to fill out a form that swore I wasn't in infected lands or had been recently infected.  They checked my temperature. They handed my a pen to sign the sworn form.  Right next to the form was disinfectant hand lotion because obviously, everyone had been using the same pen.  I used it too.  Would you lick your finger after using that pen before using the disinfectant?

LesPalenik

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1773 on: July 14, 2020, 03:41:52 am »

I was picking up food at a grocery.  The kid was dropping all the bags in the trunk of my car.  I could see in my rear view mirror that his mask was pulled down below his nose.  Her reached up and wiped it with the back of his hand and then continued to load the rest of the bags.

And that's only what you saw. Who knows what else are those employees doing when you don't see them?

I prefer to browse the isles, take time to look at the produce, and pick whatever looks fresh or is on special. For four months now, I've been taking advantage of the supermarket early senior hour. At that time, I can park close to the entrance door, in the whole store there are only 5-6 people, dispersed safely at great distances throughout the store, I'm the only one at the cash register, the cashier is behind a plexiglass barrier, so we don't even need the masks. OTOH, I put on the mask when in the dentist's waiting room.
     
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Robert Roaldi

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1774 on: July 14, 2020, 07:28:48 am »

No one really knows for sure just how dangerous it is.  If it has no danger, why are the experts talking about these things?  Frankly, you're just guessing.  But then again, most of the experts are guessing too.   


I was only responding to the reports that this seems to be the case, that it is a less frequent method of transmission. I'm not quite understanding why this is controversial.
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Alan Klein

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1775 on: July 14, 2020, 10:30:21 am »

I was only responding to the reports that this seems to be the case, that it is a less frequent method of transmission. I'm not quite understanding why this is controversial.

Too many experts; too many opinions.  They were going to open California.  Oops. 

hogloff

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1776 on: July 14, 2020, 11:47:34 am »

Too many experts; too many opinions.  They were going to open California.  Oops.

And guess who is pushing for these openings...you only have one guess. And if you guess right on the first question...you have a bonus question. Guess who is pushing to reopen schools without a plan. Bingo...the bozzo.
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Alan Klein

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1777 on: July 14, 2020, 12:25:31 pm »

And guess who is pushing for these openings...you only have one guess. And if you guess right on the first question...you have a bonus question. Guess who is pushing to reopen schools without a plan. Bingo...the bozzo.
Trump said: “In Germany, Denmark, Norway,  Sweden and many other countries, SCHOOLS ARE OPEN WITH NO PROBLEMS. The Dems think it would be bad for them politically if U.S. schools open before the November Election, but is important for the children & families. May cut off funding if not open!” he said.

Is it true about schools in those European countries? Obviously, America is a big country and there's a lot less cases now where I live in New Jersey.  So while we may be able to open here in NJ, California may have to wait until the cases go down. 

Jeremy Roussak

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1778 on: July 14, 2020, 01:07:40 pm »

And guess who is pushing for these openings...you only have one guess. And if you guess right on the first question...you have a bonus question. Guess who is pushing to reopen schools without a plan. Bingo...the bozzo.

Perilously close to politics. Warning. Don't force me to suspend you yet again.

Jeremy
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hogloff

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #1779 on: July 14, 2020, 01:27:51 pm »

Perilously close to politics. Warning. Don't force me to suspend you yet again.

Jeremy

I've seen the words dems and rep and even Trump posted here...which are directly political. Patrol things with an even keel.
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