Interesting debate about street Photography

[Ivo_B]

You have still not told me what there is about the Goldin picture that I missed.

If your reaction is : “Aids”, and then a personal take on the photographer: Or you missed everything , or you block what the picture shows, for one or another reason.

[Rob C]

If your reaction is : “Aids”, and then a personal take on the photographer: Or you missed everything , or you block what the picture shows, for one or another reason.

Ivo, that is still just your projection about what you think that I think; I asked you about what you thought about the image that I - or the rest of us - may be missing.

;-)

[Ivo_B]

Ivo, that is still just your projection about what you think that I think; I asked you about what you thought about the image that I - or the rest of us - may be missing.

;-)

No Rob, this was your answer, not what I think your answer was. 😉
It is not about what you or I may be missing, it’s about the think process behind the appreciation of an image.

Anyhow. I can tell you:

1: What I see as a viewer: a man kissing another very sick, maybe dying man.
2: What I feel as a viewer: I feel uncomfortable close, I have double feelings, I’m not sure why (is it context or the knowledge of Goldin’s body of work?) but I feel on one hand a bit aversion because I’m not into kissing men. And on the other hand I feel the tenderness how the one man approaches the other man. Strange enough, if it where two brothers, the emphatic element would not poke me the same way as the image does now, because I assume to look at a homosexual couple.
The tenderness of the scene makes me shameful for the pejorative feelings I have.
2: What I feel as photographer: TL lights, always difficult. But somehow it add’s to the discomfort of the image. I wish I was there, with my camera.

Is that a reply?

[RSL]

. . .it’s about the think process behind the appreciation of an image.

Is that a reply?

No, it isn't, Ivo. The "think process" has nothing to do with the appreciation of great art. You react to great art with a part of your soul that has nothing to do with thinking. I know you won't read it, or if you do, you won't understand it, but at least try "Touching the Seer."

[Rob C]

No Rob, this was your answer, not what I think your answer was. 😉
It is not about what you or I may be missing, it’s about the think process behind the appreciation of an image.

Anyhow. I can tell you:

1: What I see as a viewer: a man kissing another very sick, maybe dying man.
2: What I feel as a viewer: I feel uncomfortable close, I have double feelings, I’m not sure why (is it context or the knowledge of Goldin’s body of work?) but I feel on one hand a bit aversion because I’m not into kissing men. And on the other hand I feel the tenderness how the one man approaches the other man. Strange enough, if it where two brothers, the emphatic element would not poke me the same way as the image does now, because I assume to look at a homosexual couple.
The tenderness of the scene makes me shameful for the pejorative feelings I have.
2: What I feel as photographer: TL lights, always difficult. But somehow it add’s to the discomfort of the image. I wish I was there, with my camera.

Is that a reply?

It's the reply you give me, no argument about that. However, it doesn't reveal anything beyond what my Aids comment did in a single acronym. It just carries all the baggage straight people carry. It falls neatly into Goldin's bag: the downside of life and relationships, the more grim the better.

Rob

[Ivo_B]

It's the reply you give me, no argument about that. However, it doesn't reveal anything beyond what my Aids comment did in a single acronym. It just carries all the baggage straight people carry. It falls neatly into Goldin's bag: the downside of life and relationships, the more grim the better.

Rob

No problem Rob.

I think the bottom line lies in the bold text in your reply....
=> not all straight people carry that bagage. This is a generation formed bagage. I don’t carry the same bagage about the subject as other generations do. And probably, younger generation even don’t understand our debate about kissing men.




Question on the side, what does the following image do with your straight bagage? 

[Ivo_B]

It's the reply you give me, no argument about that. However, it doesn't reveal anything beyond what my Aids comment did in a single acronym. It just carries all the baggage straight people carry. It falls neatly into Goldin's bag: the downside of life and relationships, the more grim the better.

Rob

Yes, very true. But is this not one of the merits of here work? Reveal what was not seen? I met Nan Goldin in Rotterdam where she opened here exhibition. She didn’t search for this extravaganza, this was here life. And she documented it.
One of the Dutch speaker talked about how she documented the downside of society, it made here pissed off. She answered something like this: You don’t understand one single thing of my work. I did not search to document the downside of life. It was my life, my best friends, my loved ones, it is who I was.

....

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

... what does the following image do with your straight bagage? 

It tells me that the alphabet soup of freaks is going to get humanity extinct faster than the global warming 

[Ivo_B]

It tells me that the alphabet soup of freaks is going to get humanity extinct faster than the global warming 

Wow....

[Ivo_B]

No, it isn't, Ivo. The "think process" has nothing to do with the appreciation of great art. You react to great art with a part of your soul that has nothing to do with thinking. I know you won't read it, or if you do, you won't understand it, but at least try "Touching the Seer."

It is a mental thing, Russ. That is exact what it is. But don’t judge my mental state lesser than yours. That would be a mistake.

[Rob C]

It tells me that the alphabet soup of freaks is going to get humanity extinct faster than the global warming 

If AIDS and Coronavirus don't do it just before global warming does.

Well, the 60s ushered in some good things, but also the opposite. It sure didn't invent them, but before that they were broadly off the menu and not advertised, and you know why folks advertise: it works. That's why we have curry shops where there were none before: news spreads and people try... do you remember flypaper?

Rob

[Ivo_B]

If AIDS and Coronavirus don't do it just before global warming does.

Well, the 60s ushered in some good things, but also the opposite. It sure didn't invent them, but before that they were broadly off the menu and not advertised, and you know why folks advertise: it works. That's why we have curry shops where there were none before: news spreads and people try... do you remember flypaper?

Rob

Well, I know one generation that didn’t spare any effort to distinct humanity and this was not by kissing same sex. But i admit, there was something ‘gay’

[RSL]

It is a mental thing, Russ. That is exact what it is. But don’t judge my mental state lesser than yours. That would be a mistake.

I haven't a clue what you just said, Ivo, but you can be sure I won't even attempt to judge your mental state. I'm not a psychiatrist.

[Ivo_B]

I haven't a clue what you just said, Ivo, but you can be sure I won't even attempt to judge your mental state. I'm not a psychiatrist.

You are saying I’m a looney-tick, Russ? Is that what you are saying? Be a real hero, and just say it.

[RSL]

I wouldn't deign to answer a question like that, Ivo.

[Ivo_B]

I wouldn't deign to answer a question like that, Ivo.

Hero... 

[chez]

Unfortunately. That’s why America remains the only truly free country for photographers... and in general.

See how free you are pointing your camera into the faces of people in east LA.

[petermfiore]

See how free you are pointing your camera into the faces of people in east LA.

Your free to do it...But is it wise? In much of life, that is always the question.

Peter

[RSL]

See how free you are pointing your camera into the faces of people in east LA.

It's different in the United States, Chez.