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Author Topic: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued  (Read 10897 times)

Eric Brody

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Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« on: February 06, 2019, 11:14:22 am »

I just read on Lloyd Chambers' blog that the Hasselblad X1D-50c is discontinued. I then checked the B&H website and it's listed there as discontinued! https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1260272-REG/hasselblad_h_3013901_x1d_50c_medium_format_mirrorless.html
Clearly the question is whether there's a 100MP version in the pipeline, as has been rumored for some time, but this is pretty interesting.
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rastas

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #1 on: February 06, 2019, 12:46:25 pm »

There's a whole thread about the X1D version 2 camera over at get dpi.... most are speculating that it will just be a firmware type upgrade and not a 100MG sensor, but who knows.

Fuji, please make a tilt shift lens.
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marc aurel

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #2 on: February 06, 2019, 01:43:28 pm »

There's a whole thread about the X1D version 2 camera over at get dpi.... most are speculating that it will just be a firmware type upgrade and not a 100MG sensor, but who knows.

Fuji, please make a tilt shift lens.

Hi rastas,
your "Fuji, please make a tilt shift lens" reminds me of Cato the elder who finished every speech with the sentence "Furthermore, I consider that Carthage must be destroyed".
I am on your side concerning this  ;)
Marc
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Ghaag

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2019, 02:45:51 pm »

There's a whole thread about the X1D version 2 camera over at get dpi.... most are speculating that it will just be a firmware type upgrade and not a 100MG sensor, but who knows.

Fuji, please make a tilt shift lens.

Hello Rastas, would this be an option with the Fuji?  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7XJkNkyohU
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eronald

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2019, 03:20:06 pm »

Hello Rastas, would this be an option with the Fuji?  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7XJkNkyohU

This article on dpreview will not be helpful to the Fuji 50 or Hassy 50

https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/fujifilm-gfx-50r-first-impressions-review/4?utm_source=self-desktop&utm_medium=marquee&utm_campaign=traffic_source

Apparently the disparity in image quality between a modern Nikon and a Fuji with a 6 year old crop-MF sensor is not immediately visible. Which is not unexpected, when you think about it. The Phase 150 probably is about the level of what we can expect to see in 35mm cameras in 6 or 7 years :)

Edmund

Edmund
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rastas

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2019, 05:07:33 pm »

Ghaag: I know all about that solution, thanks, but its a band-aide solution and isn't perfect. Need a native tilt shift lens for gfx.
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2019, 06:04:00 pm »

This article on dpreview will not be helpful to the Fuji 50 or Hassy 50

https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/fujifilm-gfx-50r-first-impressions-review/4?utm_source=self-desktop&utm_medium=marquee&utm_campaign=traffic_source

Apparently the disparity in image quality between a modern Nikon and a Fuji with a 6 year old crop-MF sensor is not immediately visible. Which is not unexpected, when you think about it. The Phase 150 probably is about the level of what we can expect to see in 35mm cameras in 6 or 7 years :)

Yes, I have always thought that all the things you loose with small MF are far from compensating the very tiny image quality advantage. Considering how good the f1.8 Z lenses are, especially the 50mm, it doesn't take much to figure out that the pro lenses due to be released in the coming months will switch the advantage in favor of the Z.

Now, the 100mp sensor will of course be superior on the Fuji once it is released, but investing today in the 50mp MF sensor doesn't seem reasonable to say the least.

But... if the Nikon at 45mp is almost as good as the Fuji at 50... we already know that the Nikon at 90mp will be almost as good as the Fuji at 100mp don't we? There is zero reason why the sensor would behave differently. The only question is whether Nikon will come up with a 90mp sensor or not.

In the end most of the appeal of the Fuji is in the "MF" naming. This feeling of owning something that is on top of mere 35mm cameras.  ;D The power of marketing never ceases to amaze me.

Cheers,
Bernard
« Last Edit: February 06, 2019, 06:08:05 pm by BernardLanguillier »
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BobShaw

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2019, 06:17:28 pm »

Fuji, please make a tilt shift lens.
Why don't you make a post about this?
Oh, hang on, you already have done several.

Rumour has it that this post was about the X1D being discontinued.
If anyone has any information on this it would be useful.
It has disappeared off the distributor website in Australia also.
I guess that an announcement is coming.
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faberryman

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2019, 06:47:23 pm »

Apparently the disparity in image quality between a modern Nikon and a Fuji with a 6 year old crop-MF sensor is not immediately visible.
If there wasn't an image quality difference, the wouldn't be a market for the Fuji GFX and Hassleblad X1D. There appears to be a market for them.

BernardLanguillier

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2019, 06:55:14 pm »

If there wasn't an image quality difference, the wouldn't be a market for the Fuji GFX and Hassleblad X1D. There appears to be a market for them.

Because we all know that photographers are rational animals making their purchasing decisions based on facts.  ;D

Cheers,
Bernard

BJL

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c — and old 44x33 v new 36x24 sensors
« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2019, 08:21:04 pm »

Yes, I have always thought that all the things you loose with small MF are far from compensating the very tiny image quality advantage. ...

Now, the 100mp sensor will of course be superior on the Fuji once it is released, but investing today in the 50mp MF sensor doesn't seem reasonable to say the least.
Of course the sensor age gap is a major factor, so let use see how the 100MP 44x33mm sensors perform — with comparisons perhaps now including the multi-shot super-resolution modes of some Pentax, Panasonic L and even Olympus bodies!

As far as sensor size, here is a fun fact: the sensor area ratio from 36x24mm to 44x33mm is about 1.68x, more than the 1.5x from 4/3" to Canon's version of APS-C; a hair less than the 1.7x from 4/3" to the 24x16mm of the Sony-Nikon-Pentax-Fujifilm version of APS-C. So is the 1.5x to 1.7x gap too small to offer an IQ advantage to 44x33mm over 35mm or for APS-C over 4/3", or is it big enough for those larger formats in each case to have worthwhile intrinsic IQ advantages?

P. S. The DPReview argument about lower usable ISO speed on the F850 is rather bogus; they look at the lowest ("normal") exposure index settings of 100 vs 64, ignoring the that these are not (and should not be!) the same as the base-ISO speed: as has been discussed numerous times, different makers simply choose to have different amounts of highlight headroom at their minimum normal ISO speed setting.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2019, 08:52:25 pm by BJL »
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Christopher

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2019, 02:16:46 am »

The next generation from Sony and Nikon will use more or less the same technology the new Fuji 100Mp uses. Perhaps a little refind, but nothing much different. It also won’t be even close to 90Mp or 80Mp it will be around 60Mp. Here there will be quite a difference between 60MP and 100Mp from the Fuji. My wild guess is we won’t see FF a both 80Mp for the next 5 years.

I mean people have been saying we would be at 60Mp in FF years ago.... nothing happened.


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eronald

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c — and old 44x33 v new 36x24 sensors
« Reply #12 on: February 07, 2019, 02:30:30 am »

Of course the sensor age gap is a major factor, so let use see how the 100MP 44x33mm sensors perform — with comparisons perhaps now including the multi-shot super-resolution modes of some Pentax, Panasonic L and even Olympus bodies!

As far as sensor size, here is a fun fact: the sensor area ratio from 36x24mm to 44x33mm is about 1.68x, more than the 1.5x from 4/3" to Canon's version of APS-C; a hair less than the 1.7x from 4/3" to the 24x16mm of the Sony-Nikon-Pentax-Fujifilm version of APS-C. So is the 1.5x to 1.7x gap too small to offer an IQ advantage to 44x33mm over 35mm or for APS-C over 4/3", or is it big enough for those larger formats in each case to have worthwhile intrinsic IQ advantages?

P. S. The DPReview argument about lower usable ISO speed on the F850 is rather bogus; they look at the lowest ("normal") exposure index settings of 100 vs 64, ignoring the that these are not (and should not be!) the same as the base-ISO speed: as has been discussed numerous times, different makers simply choose to have different amounts of highlight headroom at their minimum normal ISO speed setting.

BJL - do have a look at the dpreview article. In my opinion the two cameras tested cannot have become so similar purely by"accident".

Edmund
« Last Edit: February 07, 2019, 02:34:24 am by eronald »
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c — and old 44x33 v new 36x24 sensors
« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2019, 04:46:34 am »

P. S. The DPReview argument about lower usable ISO speed on the F850 is rather bogus; they look at the lowest ("normal") exposure index settings of 100 vs 64, ignoring the that these are not (and should not be!) the same as the base-ISO speed: as has been discussed numerous times, different makers simply choose to have different amounts of highlight headroom at their minimum normal ISO speed setting.

I don't think it is. The D810/D850/Z7 are well documented as having more DR as ISO 64 than other cameras at ISO100.

This isn't simply an exposure index issue related to where the exposure is set within the available DR.

But I do agree that the Fuji 100mp is the camera we'll have to benchmark.

Cheers,
Bernard

BernardLanguillier

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2019, 04:48:50 am »

The next generation from Sony and Nikon will use more or less the same technology the new Fuji 100Mp uses. Perhaps a little refind, but nothing much different. It also won’t be even close to 90Mp or 80Mp it will be around 60Mp. Here there will be quite a difference between 60MP and 100Mp from the Fuji. My wild guess is we won’t see FF a both 80Mp for the next 5 years.

I mean people have been saying we would be at 60Mp in FF years ago.... nothing happened.

Sony's roadmap seems to indicate 60mp as the next step. I have personally no information about what Nikon is planning to do.

If I were them I would try to drop another D800, meaning to go 1.5x times the competition in terms of resolution. And that happens to mean 90mp.

Cheers,
Bernard

eronald

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #15 on: February 09, 2019, 05:08:14 am »

My rumormongering feeling is the Sony 100MP chip is now coming out of embargo, and official sample images will be published by March 30. Fuji may be able to start delivery of its new landscape camera in time for the spring/summer season.

Whether Hassy will have a new body out with this chip is anyone's guess. They are really bad at communicating, while Fuji is getting better and better at publishing roadmaps, setting realistic timeframes and meeting delivery dates. On the other hand, Hassy now have a good lens collection out there, and no excessive QC issues, so if they manage to bring out a new hi-rez body it should sell well.


Edmund


Sony's roadmap seems to indicate 60mp as the next step. I have personally no information about what Nikon is planning to do.

If I were them I would try to drop another D800, meaning to go 1.5x times the competition in terms of resolution. And that happens to mean 90mp.

Cheers,
Bernard
« Last Edit: February 09, 2019, 05:11:49 am by eronald »
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Doug Peterson

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #16 on: February 09, 2019, 08:54:55 am »

My rumormongering feeling is the Sony 100MP chip is now coming out of embargo, and official sample images will be published by March 30. Fuji may be able to start delivery of its new landscape camera in time for the spring/summer season.

You're off by around a year. Phase One has been shipping aerial cameras with the 1.3x crop 100mp sensor in question since the first half of last year.

The rumor mill really seems to disregard that a sensor is not a camera. Said differently, the availability of one component does not, a camera, make.

eronald

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #17 on: February 09, 2019, 08:52:57 pm »

Doug

 Thank you for the correction, indicating the sensor for the Fuji GFX-100 has already been in production for some time.

 In my rumor-mongering way, I would expect the Fuji GFX-100 camera to be demoed this spring, WITH DELIVERIES BEFORE END JUNE, AT A PRICEPOINT OF $10K.

 And by the way, I'm not inventing this stuff, the Fuji guys are saying this in public, while toting around a functioning proto with IBIS.  However as you point out the project may be exceptionally hard - even for a company that seems to churn out body variants as fast as a hen lays eggs - and so a delay is always possible.

If people want to see mockups of a possible future modular Fuji MF camera, and a test image getting made with the working proto of the 100, I recommend watching the video of the presentation around the 1 hour mark.

https://fujiaddict.com/2019/02/09/fujifilm-x-summit-at-gpp-photo-week-2019-gfx-modular-concept-x-t3-firmware-update-coming-with-improved-af-new-lenses-film-simulation-and-more/


usherxupeng

Edmund
 

You're off by around a year. Phase One has been shipping aerial cameras with the 1.3x crop 100mp sensor in question since the first half of last year.

The rumor mill really seems to disregard that a sensor is not a camera. Said differently, the availability of one component does not, a camera, make.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2019, 09:32:41 pm by eronald »
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landscapephoto

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #18 on: February 10, 2019, 01:55:12 am »

Whether Hassy will have a new body out with this chip is anyone's guess.

What other chip can they use? Sony is the only manufacturer of MF sensors.
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eronald

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Re: Hasselblad X1D-50c discontinued
« Reply #19 on: February 10, 2019, 07:27:00 am »

What other chip can they use? Sony is the only manufacturer of MF sensors.


I don't know. I assume some competition will eventually emerge. I don't think the Red camera sensors are from Sony.
Look how Kodak and Dalsa designed sensors just got superseded by Sony.
My feeling is that Panasonic could now make an MF sensor if they wanted to, and probably will do so for Leica.

Edmund
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