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Author Topic: rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD  (Read 160983 times)

paul_jones

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #160 on: March 10, 2010, 03:31:15 am »

can someone fill me in about the older pentax 645.  ive never had any interest in pentax in the film days as it never had removable backs. but im interested in this camera...
did the last film pentax 645 have AF? if so, will these work on this camera?
or is the only option of getting a whole range of lenses at this stage just manual focus?

cheers paul
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BernardLanguillier

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #161 on: March 10, 2010, 03:40:20 am »

Quote from: Dan Wells
Of course, an impressive prototype, even if fully functional, doesn't mean they can deliver significant quantities of cameras

I don't believe that Pentax would take the risk to announce a May availability if they didn't have production line versions of the camera already available today.

The 2 months period is most probably just a safety buffer for final software validation and testing.

They could of course still find some late issues, but as was pointed out elsewhere, they have a lot of experience with mass production of DSLR that are using similar technologies.

The fact that it uses a larger sensor doesn't change much really for companies that are expert in manufacturing like Pentax is. The only open question is with color casts, etc... since the Kodak sensors are known to pose issues in some cases.

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Bernard

RazorTM

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #162 on: March 10, 2010, 04:00:54 am »

I wonder if they'll support leaf shutter lenses in the future...
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hsmeets

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #163 on: March 10, 2010, 04:46:04 am »

On paper it has nice spec's for what it is. Nothing that shyed me directly away. Let's see what reviews say that will pop-up next few days/weeks and if and when they start to ship to US/EU.

I would be temped by this system, for 95% of my type of photography I don't need high-iso, fast framerates, very long tele or versatile zooms like in 35mm. But I would welcome more detail/resolution and 'smoothness' as seen in many/most MF systems. Current offerings in the same league are for me out of the question money wise, not willing to pay that kind of money, but with the pentax, still a lot of money I could convince myself....

On the other hand I could upgrade in 1 or 2 years to the next iteration of nikon/canon's that probably will move to 30'sh mpx sensors and have then a more all round system

Choices Choices Choices

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feppe

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #164 on: March 10, 2010, 06:03:50 am »

This is certainly the game-changer I believe Bernard was hoping for earlier in the thread. I can see the biggest impact being in the MFDB world, but if
this Pentax is the beast the specs and pricing suggest, it will be a contender against high-end dSLR market as well.

This is actually the only MFDB I would consider, even though it's still a bit out of my price range. I could see myself moving from crop sensor dSLR right to MFDB if the Pentax delivers what it promises. And offers multi-minute exposures with low shadow noise at base ISO.

If and when Pentax can deliver this camera in reasonable volumes globally, it will cause serious price pressures on P1 and Hasselblad. But the big question is what will be the response from Canikon later this year? Will we finally see the Nikon S2 equivalent?

Cfranson

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #165 on: March 10, 2010, 07:07:20 am »

Quote from: AndreasSchmidt
About Phase: the backs are fixed at the body, so far I know even not removable for using somewhere else.

No, Phase backs aren't permanently attached to their body or anyone else's.
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hsmeets

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #166 on: March 10, 2010, 08:07:49 am »

If it proofs to be a succes and if pentax did not taylor the design too much to the specific sensor, even if it not has a removable back, we might see higher mpx version too by replacing the sensor pcb and a few other components.

A good hint could be when someone discovers that the finder is masked off and the mirror is bigger then needed just for 44x33 chipsize. If I had to design such camera I would for shure think about that.

dammit :-) it isn't yet here in the west and we already think about future versions.
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Huib

eronald

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #167 on: March 10, 2010, 08:27:52 am »

Quote from: hsmeets
If it proofs to be a succes and if pentax did not taylor the design too much to the specific sensor, even if it not has a removable back, we might see higher mpx version too by replacing the sensor pcb and a few other components.

A good hint could be when someone discovers that the finder is masked off and the mirror is bigger then needed just for 44x33 chipsize. If I had to design such camera I would for shure think about that.

dammit :-) it isn't yet here in the west and we already think about future versions.


At this pricing, they may be the last firm standing. Brand H and P priced high when sensors were expensive, and now have systems which simply cost too much.

Edmund
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LKaven

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #168 on: March 10, 2010, 08:50:10 am »

Quote from: eronald
At this pricing, they may be the last firm standing. Brand H and P priced high when sensors were expensive, and now have systems which simply cost too much.
Not to mention Brand "L"

BJNY

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #169 on: March 10, 2010, 08:51:54 am »

Quote from: LEPING
Another thing to worry is the production rate is only 500 a month according to the Pentax Japanese site.  Good luck snap one!

500 x 12 months = 6,000 units per year potentially

would be trumping existing MFD market shipping upwards of 8,000 units per year
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Guillermo

BJNY

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #170 on: March 10, 2010, 08:55:36 am »

It's not clear to me
if the Pentax 645D will capture tethered into computer?
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Guillermo

BJNY

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #171 on: March 10, 2010, 09:02:58 am »

Quote from: AldoMurillo
I like the dual SD cards feature, I could use 1 SD card for Raw's and the other for tethering JPEG's (USB) for revision, I could even use a EYE-Fi SD card for wireless tethering those JPEG'S to my assistant laptop for close up revision.

I've been curious about this for quite a while

and haven't seen any demonstrations or videos showing how quickly a JPEG would wirelessly transfer to computer,

and how easy it would be to set up connection between computer and Eye-Fi card.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2010, 09:11:01 am by BJNY »
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Guillermo

hsmeets

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #172 on: March 10, 2010, 09:32:30 am »

Quote from: eronald
At this pricing, they may be the last firm standing. Brand H and P priced high when sensors were expensive, and now have systems which simply cost too much.

Edmund

If they managed to have this "agressive" pricing without compromising performance/quality/IQ and still be on par (or very close to) with H and P, yes then it has the potential to hurt a few competitors out there....but whether it will overtake with a landslide....most likely this camera is foremost appealing to new-comers to MF that have not yet invested or those that return from high-end 35mm SLR's

Even though the price is substantially lower then we were used to (cough, i never got used to these price levels anyway) it's still quite some substantial money. It starts just above the price level of Nikon and Canon flagships and probably will unit wise sell less than these DSLR's (and thos units aren't nowhere near those like a D700 and 5D).

I could well be that even at this low price it doesn't sell enough.
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Dan Wells

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #173 on: March 10, 2010, 09:38:49 am »

Quote from: hsmeets
If it proofs to be a succes and if pentax did not taylor the design too much to the specific sensor, even if it not has a removable back, we might see higher mpx version too by replacing the sensor pcb and a few other components.

A good hint could be when someone discovers that the finder is masked off and the mirror is bigger then needed just for 44x33 chipsize. If I had to design such camera I would for shure think about that.

dammit :-) it isn't yet here in the west and we already think about future versions.
Do they even need to accommodate a larger sensor? With the advances made in sensor performance/size, could 33x44 be where the development's going? I believe I read here once that it's a lot less difficult to manufacture than a larger sensor (by quite a bit more than the surface area would indicate - I think it requires significantly less stitching - maybe it can be done with one stitch, while the 36x48 has to be stitched in both directions?). This WOULD require them to come out with one lens that is wider than anything they have now (a 35 is as wide as they go, while 33x44 really benefits from a 28, or if they want to shock everyone, a 24). They don't have the same worry about legacy lens collections as Phamiya or Hasselblad, simply because there haven't BEEN many Pentax 645s in active use recently - this is a camera that is meant to capture high-end DSLR users, NOT to digitalize existing MF systems. I hope we see it outside Japan.
      I wouldn't want to be Canon right now, at least on the 1Ds 4 front, trapped between the D3x and this thing! Realistically, the Pentax will enter into just about every buying decision on a very high-end DSLR (some of which are also complicated by the M9). Not every 1Ds4/D3x buyer will choose the Pentax instead, but they'll all give it a close look. It MAY have the effect of not letting Sony into the really high end of the market, if they had any interest. I'd think it a rare buyer indeed who opted for a hypothetical $6000-$8000 Sony over the lens line security of Nikon or Canon OR the larger sensor offered by Pentax (unless the Sony had RED-level video, which would really stir up he market). THAT would be an interesting $6000-$10000 camera market!
1 rangefinder not that much larger than a G11, but with superb image quality - don't even think about video, you don't have AUTOFOCUS (Leica M9)
2 full system DSLRs with no or limited video(D3x/1Ds4)
1 DSLR with a more limited lens system, BUT with raw video (Sony "Alpha 1000")
1 or 2 medium-format systems with ultimate image quality, but less versatility (Pentax and maybe last year's Hasselblad - they're promoting the H3DII-31 under $10k right now)...


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hsmeets

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #174 on: March 10, 2010, 09:56:11 am »

Dan,

I can do no more then agree with your response to my post.

In my defence I was just looking at litlle bit more short term: the 50 and 60mpx version that are on the kodak shelf too.

With enough demand undoubtfully companies that make wafersteppers could introduce one's that allow bigger masks and do away with stitching (Is'nt canon doing that already for the sensor in the 5D?) and increase yield.

Actually, the Pentax, even premature as it is, did shake up my descision making process for buying a new camera next year. I went from film medium format back to APS DSLR....long story....and want to buy I high quality camera but Digital MF until today was just no option, the pentax changed that, while it still is a heck-of-lot-of-money I might convice myself as I hardly can see what I would need/want more in many years to come than this one from pentax.



Quote from: Dan Wells
Do they even need to accommodate a larger sensor? With the advances made in sensor performance/size, could 33x44 be where the development's going? I believe I read here once that it's a lot less difficult to manufacture than a larger sensor (by quite a bit more than the surface area would indicate - I think it requires significantly less stitching - maybe it can be done with one stitch, while the 36x48 has to be stitched in both directions?). This WOULD require them to come out with one lens that is wider than anything they have now (a 35 is as wide as they go, while 33x44 really benefits from a 28, or if they want to shock everyone, a 24). They don't have the same worry about legacy lens collections as Phamiya or Hasselblad, simply because there haven't BEEN many Pentax 645s in active use recently - this is a camera that is meant to capture high-end DSLR users, NOT to digitalize existing MF systems. I hope we see it outside Japan.
      I wouldn't want to be Canon right now, at least on the 1Ds 4 front, trapped between the D3x and this thing! Realistically, the Pentax will enter into just about every buying decision on a very high-end DSLR (some of which are also complicated by the M9). Not every 1Ds4/D3x buyer will choose the Pentax instead, but they'll all give it a close look. It MAY have the effect of not letting Sony into the really high end of the market, if they had any interest. I'd think it a rare buyer indeed who opted for a hypothetical $6000-$8000 Sony over the lens line security of Nikon or Canon OR the larger sensor offered by Pentax (unless the Sony had RED-level video, which would really stir up he market). THAT would be an interesting $6000-$10000 camera market!
1 rangefinder not that much larger than a G11, but with superb image quality - don't even think about video, you don't have AUTOFOCUS (Leica M9)
2 full system DSLRs with no or limited video(D3x/1Ds4)
1 DSLR with a more limited lens system, BUT with raw video (Sony "Alpha 1000")
1 or 2 medium-format systems with ultimate image quality, but less versatility (Pentax and maybe last year's Hasselblad - they're promoting the H3DII-31 under $10k right now)...
« Last Edit: March 10, 2010, 09:57:47 am by hsmeets »
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Doug Peterson

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #175 on: March 10, 2010, 10:31:57 am »

Quote from: BJNY
It's not clear to me
if the Pentax 645D will capture tethered into computer?

Good question. The chose DNG and didn't mention a dedicated processing/tethering application in a press release which otherwise seems pretty detailed. That implies they won't have their own processing/tethering application. Of course this is just another announcement so it's hard to gauge such details.

TMARK

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #176 on: March 10, 2010, 10:42:32 am »

I would think the 645D is aimed at the Japanese wedding market, which is big business in Japan.  I wonder how long it will take Nikon and Canon to respond.

If US pricing is $8k, with a lens, then its on.  Hassel/Phamiya/Leica will be hard pressed to justify their current prices, even the Aptus II 5 with a Phase DF's list price of under $10k seams stupid high when compared to the Pentax.  This assumes that everything works as advertised, but this isn't some fidly European company with 20 employees, this is a big Japanese company with big money behind it.  I think they have the will, the patents, and the cash for R&D, and they know how to build cameras.  

As for secret sauce, the Pentax dslr products are tight packages, produce a nice file.  I think their know-how should scale up nicely.
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paulmoorestudio

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #177 on: March 10, 2010, 10:52:34 am »

Quote from: TMARK
I would think the 645D is aimed at the Japanese wedding market, which is big business in Japan.  I wonder how long it will take Nikon and Canon to respond.

If US pricing is $8k, with a lens, then its on.  Hassel/Phamiya/Leica will be hard pressed to justify their current prices, even the Aptus II 5 with a Phase DF's list price of under $10k seams stupid high when compared to the Pentax.  This assumes that everything works as advertised, but this isn't some fidly European company with 20 employees, this is a big Japanese company with big money behind it.  I think they have the will, the patents, and the cash for R&D, and they know how to build cameras.  

As for secret sauce, the Pentax dslr products are tight packages, produce a nice file.  I think their know-how should scale up nicely.

I couldn't agree more...maybe not the way I would make a camera but I like woodsailboats and prewar arms, so they aren't making these things for my aesthetic, however at that price I am interested to see what it really is and what their system entails.
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trentBOYSEN

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #178 on: March 10, 2010, 11:04:47 am »

Quote from: paulmoorestudio
I couldn't agree more...maybe not the way I would make a camera but I like woodsailboats and prewar arms, so they aren't making these things for my aesthetic, however at that price I am interested to see what it really is and what their system entails.


Usually with an announcement comes sample images. Are there any to be found?

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BJNY

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rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD
« Reply #179 on: March 10, 2010, 11:11:49 am »

Quote from: BJNY
It's not clear to me
if the Pentax 645D will capture tethered into computer?

Quote from: dougpetersonci
Good question. The chose DNG and didn't mention a dedicated processing/tethering application in a press release which otherwise seems pretty detailed. That implies they won't have their own processing/tethering application. Of course this is just another announcement so it's hard to gauge such details.


Okay, I've sent off an email to http://www.sofortbildapp.com/ asking for Pentax 645D support.
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Guillermo
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