rumor: Pentax 645D Price: $6500 USD

[BJNY]

Usually with an announcement comes sample images. Are there any to be found?

Posted earlier:

http://www.camera-pentax.jp/645d/photo/01.jpg
http://www.camera-pentax.jp/645d/photo/02.jpg
http://www.camera-pentax.jp/645d/photo/03.jpg
http://www.camera-pentax.jp/645d/photo/04.jpg
http://www.camera-pentax.jp/645d/photo/05.jpg
http://www.camera-pentax.jp/645d/photo/06.jpg
http://www.camera-pentax.jp/645d/photo/07.jpg
http://www.camera-pentax.jp/645d/photo/08.jpg

[deejjjaaaa]

The chose DNG

DNG or PEF - choice is yours.

and didn't mention a dedicated processing/tethering application in a press release which otherwise seems pretty detailed. That implies they won't have their own processing/tethering application. Of course this is just another announcement so it's hard to gauge such details.

they used to make "PENTAX REMOTE Assistant" software ( http://www.pentax.jp/english/support/digit...t_k10d_win.html ) , but that was abandoned after K10D/K20D... K7 is not there...

[pschefz]

I've been curious about this for quite a while

and haven't seen any demonstrations or videos showing how quickly a JPEG would wirelessly transfer to computer,

and how easy it would be to set up connection between computer and Eye-Fi card.

the new eye-fi cards have "N" standard so transmission is fast...

[pschefz]

Do they even need to accommodate a larger sensor? With the advances made in sensor performance/size, could 33x44 be where the development's going? I believe I read here once that it's a lot less difficult to manufacture than a larger sensor (by quite a bit more than the surface area would indicate - I think it requires significantly less stitching - maybe it can be done with one stitch, while the 36x48 has to be stitched in both directions?). This WOULD require them to come out with one lens that is wider than anything they have now (a 35 is as wide as they go, while 33x44 really benefits from a 28, or if they want to shock everyone, a 24). They don't have the same worry about legacy lens collections as Phamiya or Hasselblad, simply because there haven't BEEN many Pentax 645s in active use recently - this is a camera that is meant to capture high-end DSLR users, NOT to digitalize existing MF systems. I hope we see it outside Japan.
      I wouldn't want to be Canon right now, at least on the 1Ds 4 front, trapped between the D3x and this thing! Realistically, the Pentax will enter into just about every buying decision on a very high-end DSLR (some of which are also complicated by the M9). Not every 1Ds4/D3x buyer will choose the Pentax instead, but they'll all give it a close look. It MAY have the effect of not letting Sony into the really high end of the market, if they had any interest. I'd think it a rare buyer indeed who opted for a hypothetical $6000-$8000 Sony over the lens line security of Nikon or Canon OR the larger sensor offered by Pentax (unless the Sony had RED-level video, which would really stir up he market). THAT would be an interesting $6000-$10000 camera market!
1 rangefinder not that much larger than a G11, but with superb image quality - don't even think about video, you don't have AUTOFOCUS (Leica M9)
2 full system DSLRs with no or limited video(D3x/1Ds4)
1 DSLR with a more limited lens system, BUT with raw video (Sony "Alpha 1000")
1 or 2 medium-format systems with ultimate image quality, but less versatility (Pentax and maybe last year's Hasselblad - they're promoting the H3DII-31 under $10k right now)...

in the specs for the new announced 55 lens it says that the lens does not work on film pentax bodies as it won't cover the area....so i guess the answer is there....

[SeanBK]

Usually with an announcement comes sample images. Are there any to be found?

Check out AldoMurillo's Post#170 on Page#9 (previous page).  think Sample images from the camera are quite nice.

ps >Sorry. Ididn't catch "BJNY"'s reply.My bad for the duplication in reply.

[BJNY]

the new eye-fi cards have "N" standard so transmission is fast...

I'd like to see:
• how easy for user to set up connection between computer and camera
• how many seconds later does image appear on computer display

Has anyone tried "N" speed Eye-Fi card in SD slot of Canon 1ds3?

[aaanorton]

the new eye-fi cards have "N" standard so transmission is fast...

This would be a way cooler setup than a cable tether. I wonder if we could build a basic folder structure on the camera. Does anyone make a Firewire or better SDHC card reader? The "RAW" card will have to come out of the camera eventually.

[douglasf13]

I wouldn't want to be Canon right now, at least on the 1Ds 4 front, trapped between the D3x and this thing...

 
  Yeah, in fact, I think this puts both the 1Dsiii (and its successor) and D3x in a bad position, as well as a lot of MFD, because there has been a one-two punch from both Sony and Pentax against these lines.  We've now got the Sony A850 for under $2k and this new MFD Pentax for under $10K.  We are finally starting to see a bit of a shift towards the film days, where the buy-in for high end imaging, while still not cheap, isn't prohibitively expensive.

[bcooter]

Okay, I've sent off an email to http://www.sofortbildapp.com/ asking for Pentax 645D support.

I would be surprised if there is not some kind of tethered support for this camera, but the Japanese can stubbornly surprise you.

All they really need is something simple like eos utility and adobe support.

We routinely tether to eos and run bridge in the background, for sorting, checking focus, renaming and rating and do it all on a previous generation macbookpro hooked to a 23" monitor.  EOS utility gives you a full screen preview and with bridge, we reads raws, jpegs and video.     So far it's been stable and the learning curve is easy.

Working in bridge keeps it simple and if you really want to show an AD a closer to the final look, just double click to camera raw with a preset and it's there, easy to see, easy to process, so I guess what I'm saying all they need is some kind of simple tethering and let Adobe do the heavy lifting.

You can even tone and color the video in cs4 extended.

Actually the only downer I see to this Pentax camera is the 500 a month mark and that it's not offered world wide, because if they only get 1/1000th's of the medium format film photographers in Japan they'd probably sell 500 a month easy.

BC

[feppe]

Yeah, in fact, I think this puts both the 1Dsiii (and its successor) and D3x in a bad position, as well as a lot of MFD, because there has been a one-two punch from both Sony and Pentax against these lines.  We've now got the Sony A850 for under $2k and this new MFD Pentax for under $10K.  We are finally starting to see a bit of a shift towards the film days, where the buy-in for high end imaging, while still not cheap, isn't prohibitively expensive.

This is good news for us: better cameras at lower prices

Actually the only downer I see to this Pentax camera is the 500 a month mark and that it's not offered world wide, because if they only get 1/1000th's of the medium format film photographers in Japan they'd probably sell 500 a month easy.

The price gap between an MFDB and MF film is still significant, especially for those with investments in incompatible MF lenses.

Also, Michael's assessment of the entire global MFDB market is well below 10,000 units. If Pentax sells 500 a month they'd be a market share winner in less than a year.

But who knows, maybe this is such a game changer it will convert a whole new market segment to MFDB. The pricing alone puts it in the reach of many enthusiasts, and I'm sure the camera will compete against top-end dSLR investments.

[BJNY]

http://photorumors.com/2010/03/10/penatx-6...sold-in-the-us/

[TMARK]

http://photorumors.com/2010/03/10/penatx-6...sold-in-the-us/

I bet they change their minds once the US reps start asking for it.

[trentBOYSEN]

http://photorumors.com/2010/03/10/penatx-6...sold-in-the-us/

Not sure why Pentax would do this. But hey,,, what do I know about big business. Used MFD or new Nikon for me...  Bummer..

[Er1kksen]

in the specs for the new announced 55 lens it says that the lens does not work on film pentax bodies as it won't cover the area....so i guess the answer is there....

You might want to re-check your sources. Official statement from Pentax is that it covers the full 645 frame. But all you really need to tell is to look at the lens name: the D FA 645 55mm f2.8. That FA specifies full coverage for film, while the D specifies coatings optimized for use with digital sensors. If it only covers a digital-sensor crop, the designation is DA. I wouldn't be surprised to see some DA 645 lenses appear, perhaps something like a 24mm that would be impressive on the 645D but hard to design for the full 645 frame, alongside D FA 645 lenses like the 55mm that will continue to be compatible with the film 645 system as well as possible larger sensors in the future.

[bcooter]

http://photorumors.com/2010/03/10/penatx-6...sold-in-the-us/

That loud noise you just heard was dancing in the streets in Denmark and Sweden.



BC

[Doug Peterson]

Okay, I've sent off an email to http://www.sofortbildapp.com/ asking for Pentax 645D support.

Great. Let us know their response. AFAIK the tethering application has to have the SDK for the camera it tethers to. For instance Capture One Pro has the SDK for Leaf, Phase One, Canon, and Nikon built in.

The SDK is the communication language of the camera and must be provided by the manufacturer. Strange to hear about the abandonment of their previous tethering application. Will be interesting to see what they do. Anyone have more information about the speed, stability, feature set of the deprecated tethering application?

It will also be interesting to see what sort of performance it would have tethered (if it can tether) pushing 40 megapixel raw files down a USB pipeline without years and years of experience tweaking all parts of the process for high-resolution tethering (as is the case with Phase/Leaf/Hassy). Or how fast a generic program would render the 100% view - the difference in shot-to-render time varies a lot based on the program used to tether such that the same Phase One back renders an initial full-frame preview and a 100% view (to check focus) much faster now than in the days of version 3 for instance, largely because of optimization on the camera firmware and c1 software to get it up on the screen as fast as possible and because of the advantage Firewire has over USB for transmission of large continuous streams of data (as opposed to lots of little files).

DNG or PEF - choice is yours.

Thanks for the info!

I would be surprised if there is not some kind of tethered support for this camera, but the Japanese can stubbornly surprise you.

All they really need is something simple like eos utility and adobe support.

We routinely tether to eos and run bridge in the background, for sorting, checking focus, renaming and rating and do it all on a previous generation macbookpro hooked to a 23" monitor.  EOS utility gives you a full screen preview and with bridge, we reads raws, jpegs and video.     So far it's been stable and the learning curve is easy.

Working in bridge keeps it simple and if you really want to show an AD a closer to the final look, just double click to camera raw with a preset and it's there, easy to see, easy to process, so I guess what I'm saying all they need is some kind of simple tethering and let Adobe do the heavy lifting.

Of course everyone's needs/preferences are different and there is also significant regional variation, but the vast majority of tethered shooting in the Miami fashion and rental market is to Capture One. From my experience the tethering market share that a EOS/Bridge has is very, very low. So if they have no native software for tethering it will be interesting to see what photographers will be happy with the setup that you outline above that works for you.

Also: I don't know the Japanese tethering market at all. It would actually be very interesting for me to hear from someone (digital tech, sales rep?) with experience with the Japanese tethered market.

Doug Peterson
__________________
Head of Technical Services, Capture Integration
Phase One, Leaf, Cambo, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Eizo & More
National: 877.217.9870  |  Cell: 740.707.2183
Newsletter: Read Latest or Sign Up
RSS Feed: Subscribe
Buy Capture One at 10% off
Personal Work

[pschefz]

http://photorumors.com/2010/03/10/penatx-6...sold-in-the-us/

there has to be some kind of agreement with kodak....the same chip....so much cheaper....along with features everybody has been asking for.....you can have the chip, but japan only...

if you see this along a hassH4 40 and the 40 mpix phase/leaf offerings on one counter....20000$, 20000$...6500$...it does not look good...

[gwhitf]

Also: I don't know the Japanese tethering market at all. It would actually be very interesting for me to hear from someone (digital tech, sales rep?) with experience with the Japanese tethered market.

I think you could make a case for not even offering a tethering option. If this is a wedding camera, who needs to tether? I'd bet, if you looked at the entire scope of MF cameras, how many users would really NEED to tether, in real life? Yes, they might ask for it, thinking that they might do it someday, but how many would really NEED it, day in and day out? I'd say a very very small percentage.

Maybe Pentax's theory is: "Go Make Photographs. And have fun." The more I tether, the more I desire a camera that wouldn't tether.

They've also provided a nice, tight 3" LCD as well. This goes a long way toward not needing to rely on a laptop, if you're shooting fast and mobile. How did they do this with CCD, when Phase apparently can't?

By the way, what is the carry-on weight limit for flights out of Japan?

[TMARK]

I think you could make a case for not even offering a tethering option. If this is a wedding camera, who needs to tether? I'd bet, if you looked at the entire scope of MF cameras, how many users would really NEED to tether, in real life? Yes, they might ask for it, thinking that they might do it someday, but how many would really NEED it, day in and day out? I'd say a very very small percentage.

Maybe Pentax's theory is: "Go Make Photographs. And have fun." The more I tether, the more I desire a camera that wouldn't tether.

I'd be fine with it tethering jpegs only, with a look already selected, for a client to see on a 23" and for a designer to use FPO.  Download the sd cards later.

I predict we will see this camera in the states.  Its a matter of time.

[bcooter]

...snip...

Of course everyone's needs/preferences are different and there is also significant regional variation, but the vast majority of tethered shooting in the Miami fashion and rental market is to Capture One.


...snip...

I work in a lot of places and don't see the 'regional" variations you mention, but I guess that depends on what you shoot and who shoots it.

I'm also not saying I won't change, because I've changed workflow a few times, depending on camera but as of today . . .

I'm just explaining an option that works well for us.  Especially since we have to review video next to stills.

Regardless . . .

What I've found in the last two years is this.

First, I don't want or need a dedicated only digital tech.  Everybody's on a tighter budget, everybody has multiple tasks.  At least that's what I see in every market I work in, including Miami.  I expect everyone on the camera crew to know how to lift a sandbag and move a light, including myself.

The second thing is every assistant I know understands photoshop and bridge.  No we don't hot folder to bridge waiting for images to come up, we use eos utility for that but if a client wants a quick review of stills and motion clips bridge handles it along with ratings, naming, drag and drop sorting.

The third thing is any assistant that owns an I phone can work EOS utility in about 20 minutes of learn time and I find the program stable, obviously has excellent previews and it previews fast.

I'm not saying I would never hire another digital tech that is only dedicated to the computer, but . . .

Gone are the days of the I'm a C-1 guy or a Leaf guy or a Hasselblad Tech, any crew member has to bring a lot more than that to the production.  Some have stepped up, some haven't.

Today everyone multitasks and let's be realistic every assistant photographer understands photoshop and since bridge and camera raw come free with the program, eos utility is free with the camera, for me this becomes a very easy decision.

This doesn't mean I don't use C-1 version 4 something.  We just processed out a few thousand canon files for jpegs in it, because I like the look and I have two licenses, though we haven't upgraded to v 5 and probably won't for the time being.

As far as final processing, that depends on the project and who does the retouching.  If I send it to our retouchers, even if I process out a tiff, they want and need the raw and 90% of every digital image that goes through any retoucher I know is processed in camera raw.  A sidecar helps because it gives them the direction we're going.


BC