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Author Topic: New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)  (Read 224959 times)

Dean s24

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #140 on: September 02, 2008, 07:22:42 am »

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Thierry,

I'm sure you're a nice guy, but to just give you some feedback from a potential customer: Why would you come to the town square, like a Town Crier, and yell out all this information, but not have a price for it? You guys wonder why we accuse you MF reps of being used-car salesmen, and this is one reason. It just feels like bait-and-switch, or in the least, "get the customer hyped up", instead of one man looking into another man's eyes, and saying "here is my product; these are the details; this is the price", like a respectable man would.

This camera system does indeed sound interesting, and it does sound like Sinar has listened and responded, but seriously, to do business this way is infuriating.

Would be like someone strolling down the streets of Amsterdam one lovely night, and the girl in the window says, "this is my product", and the customer says "How much?", and the girl says "Uh, I'm not sure, call me next week".

Trust me, it's as basic as that.

This is business, not personal. But if you want to know what's behind some of the resentment toward most anything MediumFormat, it's practices like not having your act together when you come to market.

Would Apple Computer announce a product without all the details? No way in hell. You want Apple loyalty?; then treat customers like grown-ups. I know you're excited, but you have to know the effect of half-disclosure.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218275\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


It really isn't this bad and i'm sure Thierry is just doing his Job. Can you imaging going out and investing in Hasselblad or Phase with their new 50 and 60mp backs and then Sinar comes strolling in AFTER Photokino with this wonderful system. Then the replies on LL would be different, something like," why did you wait so long to tell us about this". I am more than gratefull that thierry has announced it because it makes the market fair and gives everyone a chance to decide by using pros and cons between all Backs.

Just on the note about Apple not releasing info before the price, well, Im sorry to tell you that is a misconception. In my country thier are nice big posters in our shop windows telling us about the Iphone 3G that will be coming soon. We have no price yet and have been waiting for about 6 months already. This is frustrating. We will know the price of a Sinar before the I phone. Thats funny!!!
« Last Edit: September 02, 2008, 07:23:49 am by Dean s24 »
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FrançoisTT

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #141 on: September 02, 2008, 07:41:17 am »

Exact Thierry,
the H3DII 31 is actually proposed at $ 17,995...with HVD viewfinder and HC80mm lens.

For my part,
- I hope to see a Sinar product range declined around this Hy6 markII : e54r, e65r, e75r...
- and I am curious to see if this Kodak sensor on a Sinar Back (soft) will offer the same "film like" rendering than others Leaf or Sinar digital back equipped with Dalsa sensor.

Regards,
François
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FrançoisTT

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #142 on: September 02, 2008, 08:36:58 am »

s54r, s65r, s75r...
Which one will be the Sinar entry level ($) with a big 36x48mm chip ?
(difficult to order a e54R when you take a look at the characteristics of the new eSprit).
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Natasa Stojsic

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #143 on: September 02, 2008, 08:46:59 am »

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I do dare to think the contrary.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218862\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Why didn't I think of that........ hehehehehe  

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The internet and the forum world are an important player, but it's not the whole world, by far not.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218862\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I respectfully desagree, since internet/communication field is only grwoing.... anyways, I was referring to the photography World!!!

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I can assure you that some other people from Sinar are well known and deserve credit.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218862\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Why not, it doesn't hurt to name a few....

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I would not swap for any money of the world!  

[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218862\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Fair enough  

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Business survival, Natasa.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218862\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
that is what i thought.... human mind drives business!

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You said it!
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218862\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
of course... and I stand by it  

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I am busy!
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218862\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
LOL  

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Thanks and best regards,
Thierry
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218862\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Last year if you remember I wanted to buy Hy6 and it didn't happen.... hopefully this time around it will be easier... I would appreciate if you could PM as soon as you can deliver one.... I can travel and pick it up in Europe if I have to... Thailand included   but let's not be mute this time around about it  

You can PM if it's easier!

Thanks and regards
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thsinar

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #144 on: September 02, 2008, 09:30:27 am »

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For my part,
- I hope to see a Sinar product range declined around this Hy6 markII : e54r, e65r, e75r...
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218873\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
This is exactly what is available, François!:

- Sinar Hy6 - 54r (Live Video) or w/o revolving adapter (Sinar Hy6 - 54)
- Sinar Hy6 - 65r (Live Video) or w/o revolving adapter (Sinar Hy6 - 65)
- Sinar Hy6 - 75r (Live Video) or w/o revolving adapter (Sinar Hy6 - 75)

Quote
- and I am curious to see if this Kodak sensor on a Sinar Back (soft) will offer the same "film like" rendering than others Leaf or Sinar digital back equipped with Dalsa sensor.

Regards,
François
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218873\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
That's not so much a sensor issue as profiling. We have had the best skin tones with the Sinarback 54 series (Kodak 22 MPx): just do/use the right profile.

Best regards,
Thierry
« Last Edit: September 02, 2008, 09:33:38 am by thsinar »
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Thierry Hagenauer
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hubell

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #145 on: September 02, 2008, 09:37:28 am »

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Hi Guy,

just some corrections:

Remark: Sinar has a standard 3-year warranty for all its products.
Add this value to the price and you will get a closer/fairer comparison, when the "Sinar Hy6 - 65" prices are known.

Thanks and best regards,
Thierry
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218864\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Does the Sinar 3-year warranty include the guaranty of a loaner unit within 24 hours if your camera/back needs service? (Does it say anywhere or is that info in the same category as the price of the camera?) If not, it is misleading to compare it to the Phase or Hasselblad 3-year warranties, which do provide that level of service for the extra money. For most of us, having a MFDB and camera as a backup is not realistic at today's prices, and a "hot swap" warranty is highly desirable or even essential.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2008, 10:02:59 am by hcubell »
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thsinar

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #146 on: September 02, 2008, 09:38:06 am »

Entry level will be the 22 MPx, logically.

Best regards,
Thierry

Quote
s54r, s65r, s75r...
Which one will be the Sinar entry level ($) with a big 36x48mm chip ?
(difficult to order a e54R when you take a look at the characteristics of the new eSprit).
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218880\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
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Thierry Hagenauer
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thsinar

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #147 on: September 02, 2008, 09:43:06 am »

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I respectfully desagree, since internet/communication field is only grwoing.... anyways, I was referring to the photography World!!!
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218881\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Me too, Natasa.


Quote
Last year if you remember I wanted to buy Hy6 and it didn't happen.... hopefully this time around it will be easier... I would appreciate if you could PM as soon as you can deliver one.... I can travel and pick it up in Europe if I have to... Thailand included   but let's not be mute this time around about it  

You can PM if it's easier!

Thanks and regards
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218881\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I honestly don't remember. FYI: the Sinar Hy6 IS available, since begin of the year, from Sinar or from our distributors.

Thierry
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Thierry Hagenauer
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thsinar

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #148 on: September 02, 2008, 09:54:53 am »

Dear hcubell,

No, it doesn't include it, as I have already said this a few months ago. It is a warranty which covers malfunction and defective parts.

BUT:

- it does include servicing and repair for 3 years after purchase.

- usually we (our distributors) are flexible enough to provide the customer with a loaner within 24 hours. This has to be discussed with the distributor. There is always a solution and I guess some here can intervene to support my claim.

Best regards,
Thierry

Quote
Does the Sinar 3-year warranty include the guaranty of a loaner unit within 24 hours if your camera/back needs service?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218895\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
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Thierry Hagenauer
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Natasa Stojsic

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #149 on: September 02, 2008, 09:55:51 am »

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I honestly don't remember. FYI: the Sinar Hy6 IS available, since begin of the year, from Sinar or from our distributors.

Thierry
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Link > [a href=\"http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=20667&hl=sinar]try here[/url]

As I said... hopefully, this time around we can do it because everything I need/wanted is on the list,  except we don't know the price... but I am willing to make excuses to buy one hehehehe  

just don't tell me it will be delivered next year please.... that would be kind of snobbish  

PS: Just for the record I am not selling my P30+ just adding P45+ or new generation combo by SINAR!!!
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Natasa Stojsic

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #150 on: September 02, 2008, 09:58:13 am »

[span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\']Thierry, no excuses this time... as I said I will travel to Thailand if need be!!![/span]
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thsinar

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #151 on: September 02, 2008, 10:02:09 am »

Natasa,

I have no excuse, but I don't sell from Thailand: you would have to pay the shipping costs AND my commission (but free Thai food cooked by my wife).
 

Thierry

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[span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\']Thierry, no excuses this time... as I said I will travel to Thailand if need be!!![/span]
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218904\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
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Thierry Hagenauer
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Mitchell Baum

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #152 on: September 02, 2008, 10:02:38 am »

Thierry,

Thanks for all your information. And, yes, I'd much rather know the 65 is on the way, than wait till photokina to hear about it and it's price.

I've heard that the 54LV is not available in the US, and there are no plans to update it's screen to equal the improvement to the 75LV screen. Is this correct?

Also, I believe Leaf prices their 54 above their 65 which has a smaller albeit higher pixel chip. This makes me hope that the Hy6-65 will be cheaper than the Hy6 54LV.

Best,

Mitchell
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thsinar

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #153 on: September 02, 2008, 10:06:15 am »

seems that I just "delete" all in my brain when the year is passed!
 

It was though not available begin of November '07 and since I had"deleted" ....

 

Thierry



Quote
Link > try here

As I said... hopefully, this time around we can do it because everything I need/wanted is on the list,  except we don't know the price... but I am willing to make excuses to buy one hehehehe  

just don't tell me it will be delivered next year please.... that would be kind of snobbish  

PS: Just for the record I am not selling my P30+ just adding P45+ or new generation combo by SINAR!!!
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218903\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
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Natasa Stojsic

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« Reply #154 on: September 02, 2008, 10:07:07 am »

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Natasa,

I have no excuse, but I don't sell from Thailand: you would have to pay the shipping costs AND my commission (but free Thai food cooked by my wife).
 

Thierry
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218907\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I am up for it  

I'll try to compensate Sinar workflow and free food with a nice present for your wife  


Just say when you're ready.... or as I said before PM if it's easier!!!
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Natasa Stojsic

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #155 on: September 02, 2008, 10:12:38 am »

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It was though not available begin of November '07 and since I had"deleted" ....
 

Thierry
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218910\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

It was perfect time to put me on the list of customers followed by the list of equipment and for you/etc. to follow it up after christmas, that's all!!

But everybody was mute and I upgraded to P30+....

If you remember, at that time I had only P20+ and few lenses and was really ready to upgrade!!!

Hopefully that's History
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thsinar

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #156 on: September 02, 2008, 10:21:49 am »

Quote
Thierry,

I've heard that the 54LV is not available in the US, and there are no plans to update it's screen to equal the improvement to the 75LV screen. Is this correct?
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

That's partly wrong:

- the eMotion 54 LV and the kit Sinar Hy6 - eMotion 54 LV (with or w/o revolving adapter) IS available in the USA ----> [a href=\"http://sinarbron.com/documents/Sinar_Pricing_2008.pdf]http://sinarbron.com/documents/Sinar_Pricing_2008.pdf[/url]

- it is correct that there are no plans to modify the OLED display of the eMotion 54 LV: it has already the latest technology and had been improved, though not the same as in the eMotion 75.

Quote
Also, I believe Leaf prices their 54 above their 65 which has a smaller albeit higher pixel chip. This makes me hope that the Hy6-65 will be cheaper than the Hy6 54LV.

Best,

Mitchell
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218909\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Leaf Aptus 65 is a 28 MPx Dalsa sensor. I can't comment on the price.
Best regards,
Thierry
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Thierry Hagenauer
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Mitchell Baum

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #157 on: September 02, 2008, 10:25:42 am »

Thanks Thierry.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2008, 10:26:00 am by Mitchell Baum »
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hubell

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #158 on: September 02, 2008, 10:25:58 am »

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Dear hcubell,

No, it doesn't include it, as I have already said this a few months ago. It is a warranty which covers malfunction and defective parts.

BUT:

- it does include servicing and repair for 3 years after purchase.

- usually we (our distributors) are flexible enough to provide the customer with a loaner within 24 hours. This has to be discussed with the distributor. There is always a solution and I guess some here can intervene to support my claim.

Best regards,
Thierry
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218902\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

There are warranties and there are warranties. A few weeks ago, I brought a luxury brand watch in for service under warranty, and they said, yes, the parts and labor are covered, but it will be three months to do the repair.

thsinar

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New Sinar Hy6 - 65 Camera System (31 MPx)
« Reply #159 on: September 02, 2008, 10:31:56 am »

Yes, I agree, it happens to me quite often. Or then I am told that this "particular" malfunction or brake-down is not covered.

Back to Sinar's support/servicing: that's why I said we are flexible, take each case as a particular case, discuss and find a solution.

Thierry

Quote
There are warranties and there are warranties. A few weeks ago, I brought a luxury brand watch in for service under warranty, and they said, yes, the parts and labor are covered, but it will be three months to do the repair.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=218919\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
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Thierry Hagenauer
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