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Danijela D. Karic

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« Reply #120 on: February 15, 2007, 08:34:17 pm »

Att: [span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\']Thierry[/span]

Rollei Lenses are interchangeable with ALPA 12SWA which is good news, but
are they interchangeable with Sinar Hy6 since Rollei/Sinar are using the same platform.

Regards
Danijela
« Last Edit: February 16, 2007, 11:54:12 pm by Danijela D. Karic »
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yaya

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« Reply #121 on: February 16, 2007, 02:19:47 am »

Quote
Att: [span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\']Thierry[/span]

Att: [span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\']Steve Hendrix[/span]

Att: [span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\']Phase One[/span] - I don't know anybody here from Phase, is there someone? Where is the dazzling Praetorian Guard?

Att: [span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\']Yaya[/span]
Using digital back in cold/warm weather with the ground glass off and on, how does the DB hold in the winter/summer/moisture/particles/etc.? Perhaps Cambo, Gottschalt, Linhof 679 are using Sliding Adapters and therefore there is no need for removing the GG, but that's not the case with ALPA.

I would appreciate your opinion on the camera such as ALPA or any other for that matter when used without the sliding adapter, how do the associated DBs hold
under these conditions.

Thank you

Regards
Danijela
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101001\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Hi Danijela,

With all these WA camera/ lenses combinations, there is no much use for a ground glass, because for most working apertures, anything from 5m is "infinity".

The rear element sits very close to the sensor and adding a sliding back means that infinity focus cannot be achieved.

Some photographers use distance meters (laser, ultrasonic etc.) and the framing is done through a viewfinder accessory of some sort.

When using longer lenses and when having to achieve critical focus, we recommend using Live Video View, but this requires tethering the back to a computer.

Using a ground glass and taking the back off/ on the camera: of course there's the risk of dropping it or scrathing the IR filter. Dust is less of an issue since cleaning the IR filter is dead easy.

I hope this helps

Yair
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Dustbak

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« Reply #122 on: February 16, 2007, 02:52:36 am »

Quote
I agree but I was referring to the 6x7 actual area as something desirable by others including myself, not their quality.
I know but Leaf is not the only one on this one. Which Digital Back do you use?
I agree.
I am planning to shoot tethered with a little monster Mac. But cruising Morocco/etc. you can't just set-up your system in the middle of the street and behave like: yes, that happens every other minute. People get intimidated by any kind of equipment wherever you go, not only Morocco. That is where nice 6x7 would come handy. Learning to use histograms well is imperative these days. Do you have any short-cut/literature/Books/Links to suggest.
Regards
Danijela
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101111\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I use the Aptus17. Yes 6x7 might be desirable but if it cannot be seen or when it is impossible to judge what you have done even the largest screen renders worthless.

In  Morocco during daylight I am quite sure you are better of with the Oled display of the Sinar than both the Mac or the Aptus screen. Maybe a really small camera or waist level system is even better over there

I find myself using the screen only for checking whether I nailed the composition I had in mind and the histogram to see whether I have a workable file. I rarely have the time to check other things like focus, etc.. Things where you really need a big screen for, I found it too time consuming to zoom in and start looking around in my images. For this a 6x7 image is too small as well. Naturally working methods are different for most people so this might not apply to you.

I almost forgot another nuisance. Try changing settings on your back with a touchscreen that is really hard to read.

Besides this, which is not a dealbreaker for me (and slow software which is far more aggravating) I am very happy with my Leaf back.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2007, 03:09:06 am by Dustbak »
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godtfred

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« Reply #123 on: February 16, 2007, 04:17:05 am »

Quote
The rear element sits very close to the sensor and adding a sliding back means that infinity focus cannot be achieved.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101174\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
This is true for some lens/shutter combinations and not for others. An example is the HR 35 lens from Rodenstock in copal 0 that will focus to infinity with a sliding back, but not the schneider 35. Then again i dont know if the schneider will do so in the specially designed lensboard for electronic shutters...

I would definitely use the "test and see for yourself" procedure when it comes to infinity focus using a sliding back. Also the schneiders are a lot cheaper than the rodenstock alternatives (at least at my dealer they are?)

If you are set on the ALPA, then this is of no concern to you.

-axel
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rainer_v

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« Reply #124 on: February 16, 2007, 04:46:58 am »

live image dont work at daylight.
computer displays dont work on daylight, aside thatits really not very practical to work tethered for exterior shootings..

so remain three solutions:

1. work with viewfinders
2. groundglass with interchangeable back( with fresnell screens, otherwise lenses as the 24xl, 28hr or 35xl or hr will remain      very dark )
3. sliding backs.

1. viewfinders:
for some reasons its a question of adaption to work with viewfinders. but there reamin several disadvantages with them ( aside that leica has a great viefinder, the 21-28, which equals the f.o.v of 28+35mm lenses on 645 sensors ):
distortion and unexact framing does not allow serious image composition, you have to do that with using the viewfinder fortheapp. views, than shooting, seeing the lcd ( nearly impossible in sunlight with dark lcds ), adjusting new seeing the lcd and so on....
its simply not fun although possible.
you dont see what you shift. have to do that after your feeling and experience "blind". ofcourse works also but ame than above, no fun for composing images.

2. groundglass with interchangeable back:
as yaya said its not without risc for crashing the back, esp. in complicate environments if someone -as i do - often work in narrow ambients as cranes, scaffords.
maybe psychologic but i dont like much to remove my sensor on location therefore.
dust is a problem on a site allways, if there still is some construction ( or cleaning ) work around. the sensors are easy to claen, but not so easy to control if there is fine dust on them or not.

3. sliding backs: they are bulky and many dont allow the ultrawides as 24,28+35xl/hr lenses. but they allow image composition , if you have them with fressnell, bellow and loupe.
i dont know if there is one for the cambo  . with the alpas there is no sliding baqck available.
my sliding back for the gottschalt is a prototype,  sure he would make another one if someone want to order it. it works fine after i added the fresnell screen to it.

as my friend michael heinrich said some days ago here in the forum, there is a reason why so many architecture shooters still prefer film. the problem of image composition is one of this reasons. many prefer the huge image on a 4x5" or even on a 6x9cm screen so much that they dont want to give that up. i understand it... its not an easy deal to change that habbit.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2007, 04:48:36 am by rehnniar »
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rainer viertlböck
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thsinar

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« Reply #125 on: February 16, 2007, 06:19:17 am »

Quote
Att: [span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\']Thierry[/span]

Rollei Lenses are interchangeable with ALPA 12SWA which is good news, but
are they interchangeable with Sinar Hy6 since Rollei/Sinar are using the same platform.

Regards
Danijela
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101148\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Dear Danijela,

Any Rollei lens that can be mounted on the 6008 (AF or not AF) can also be mounted on the new Sinar Hy6.

Best regards,
thierry
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Thierry Hagenauer
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Danijela D. Karic

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« Reply #126 on: February 16, 2007, 06:37:30 am »

Att: [span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\']Rainer[/span]

Att:[span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\'] Yaya[/span]

I appreciate your reply but as you may be aware from the previous posts, I
was originally looking for the 4x5 system with quad-stitch Sliding Adapter
particularly when working on the Perspective of different viewpoints including the Scheimpflug
effect which you can't actually guess without the Ground Glass, at least I know I can't.

Now I see, I will probably end up with two ALPAS XY, ALPA 12SWA.

I need one for its modest size, mobility, so that I can walk if need be and use it like
a Leica only MF, etc. and the other for movement and precision.

Well, anybody here using ALPA XY? Probably, better chance in future.

Regards
Danijela
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marcwilson

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« Reply #127 on: February 16, 2007, 07:39:51 am »

Quote
Att: [span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\']Rainer[/span]

Att:[span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\'] Yaya[/span]

I appreciate your reply but as you may be aware from the previous posts, I
was originally looking for the 4x5 system with quad-stitch Sliding Adapter
particularly when working on the Perspective of different viewpoints including the Scheimpflug
effect which you can't actually guess without the Ground Glass, at least I know I can't.

Now I see, I will probably end up with two ALPAS XY, ALPA 12SWA.

I need one for its modest size, mobility, so that I can walk if need be and use it like
a Leica only MF, etc. and the other for movement and precision.

Well, anybody here using ALPA XY? Probably, better chance in future.

Regards
Danijela
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101193\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


I assume the alpas can only shift in the vertical and horizontal and therefore give no tilt option so the Scheimpflug effect will not be of concern.
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BJNY

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« Reply #128 on: February 16, 2007, 07:55:04 am »

The ingenius design of Arca-Swiss' R series offers tilt, and eliminates the need for each lens to have a dedicated/expensive helicoid for focusing:
http://www.precisioncameraworks.com/Pages/...l#photokina2006

Rainer, Would you ask Gottschalt if they have similar solution?

Billy
« Last Edit: February 16, 2007, 07:59:40 am by BJNY »
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Guillermo

Danijela D. Karic

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« Reply #129 on: February 16, 2007, 08:08:47 am »

Quote
I assume the alpas can only shift in the vertical and horizontal and therefore give no tilt option so the Scheimpflug effect will not be of concern.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101197\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I am so focused on 4x5 Ebony for some reason, but nevertheless you could be right. I have to talk to somebody today. The problem is,
not many people using ALPA 12SWA and even less the new ALPA XY on this forum.

Perhaps, Michael Kravit or Yevgeny can answer on this one.

Scheimpflug effect doesn't concern me at all if I am in position to use the
Quad-Stitching Sliding Adapter. The problem is that Quad-Stitch adapter is
an excellent idea for 4x5 shooters but not a good performer yet apparently.

I guess Tilt-Shift is much less important for Landscapes but in Architecture I found it
to be something special, something extra that will draw your eyes right away, especially
when playing with perspective.

Regards
Danijela
« Last Edit: February 16, 2007, 08:15:22 am by Danijela D. Karic »
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rainer_v

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« Reply #130 on: February 16, 2007, 08:28:33 am »

the arca looks great..... no dont think that this fits in gottschalts programm. he has nothing similar.
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rainer viertlböck
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marcwilson

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« Reply #131 on: February 16, 2007, 09:11:58 am »

Quote
I am so focused on 4x5 Ebony for some reason, but nevertheless you could be right.

I guess Tilt-Shift is much less important for Landscapes but in Architecture I found it
to be something special, something extra that will draw your eyes right away, especially
when playing with perspective.

Regards
Danijela
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101202\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


This is why it is so very imporatant that you choose the camera platform that does everything you require of it..and in high end architectural terms..if you require the ability to tilt then you must work with a set up that allows you to do so..the choice between film or digital must be secondary to that...i believe.

marc
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ericstaud

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« Reply #132 on: February 16, 2007, 12:18:52 pm »

Quote
Att: [span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\']Rainer[/span]

Att:[span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\'] Yaya[/span]

I appreciate your reply but as you may be aware from the previous posts, I
was originally looking for the 4x5 system with quad-stitch Sliding Adapter
particularly when working on the Perspective of different viewpoints including the Scheimpflug
effect which you can't actually guess without the Ground Glass, at least I know I can't.

Now I see, I will probably end up with two ALPAS XY, ALPA 12SWA.

I need one for its modest size, mobility, so that I can walk if need be and use it like
a Leica only MF, etc. and the other for movement and precision.

Well, anybody here using ALPA XY? Probably, better chance in future.

Regards
Danijela

[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101193\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Hello Danijela,

I am using a 12SWA and will be buying the XY as soon as funds allow.

About framing... I compose in my mind the image I want, place the camera and tripod without the use of a viewfinder or groundglass, choose a lens that will properly "crop" the image I have imagined, and then take several test captures looking at the P45 screen to fine tune the composition.  During those captures I also a fine tuning focus and exposure.

I have given up Scheimpflug, but I only miss it occasionally.  It has taken a long time to get used to the lenses and digital back.  I can more effectively visualize the final image better when I am more familiar with the lenses I am using.

The 12SWA is a great camera.  I think the lack of side to side shifting is more of a loss than the loss of Swings and Tilts.  This is why I will buy the XY.

The XY is only about 8.5" x 11".  It will slide into a sleeve that holds a laptop computer.  Many camera bags now accommodate laptops.  In some sense then, it is smaller than other cameras with the lens and DB removed because it is flat.  I have the 24, 35, 47, 60, 100, 12SWA, P45, Carbon tripod, and accessories in one airline carry-on bag.  If I open the lid, the XY could lay right on top.

I do not envy you making this choice.  Each camera and DB has it's drawbacks and advantages.
 I would prefer to have a system where the lenses could be attached to something like the Alpa or Cambo, and then also to the Rollie X-ACT 2 with simple lens board adapters.  I loved that my 4x5 lenses would fit on any 4x5 ever made.  Now I have a proprietary lens system which would be expensive to adapt to another camera, and equally so to sell and re-buy the lenses under another brand of camera.

As for the Quad-Stitch, I think it is too time comsuming.  These cameras offer speed and quality.  Rather than shooting a quad on a 4x5, put the smaller digitar on the Alpa and get the shot in one picture.  You will spend less time in capture, and less time in post (Post will kill you if you are not carefull in your shooting).  Time is money of course  Quad stitching is also not forgiving to moving clouds, cars, people, light, and trees blowing in the wind.  It will therefore limit your creative choices in making images to a much larger degree than not have swings and tilts.

Good Luck.
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pixjohn

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« Reply #133 on: February 16, 2007, 02:08:12 pm »

Why Not!

I use live video and a laptop out doors all the time.

1) live video all you need to do is place a cheap piece of +4 ND over the lens during composing the image.

2) I just use a dark cloth over the laptop to view out doors. Just as easy as working with a dark cloth over a 4x5.


Quote
live image dont work at daylight.
computer displays dont work on daylight, aside thatits really not very practical to work tethered for exterior shootings..


[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101181\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
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rainer_v

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« Reply #134 on: February 16, 2007, 02:14:51 pm »

Quote
Why Not!

I use live video and a laptop out doors all the time.

1) live video all you need to do is place a cheap piece of +4 ND over the lens during composing the image.

2) I just use a dark cloth over the laptop to view out doors. Just as easy as working with a dark cloth over a 4x5.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101252\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

simply a horrible idea in difficult environments. possible is much.....
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rainer viertlböck
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Danijela D. Karic

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« Reply #135 on: February 16, 2007, 08:15:40 pm »

Quote
Dear Danijela,

Any Rollei lens that can be mounted on the 6008 (AF or not AF) can also be mounted on the new Sinar Hy6.

Best regards,
thierry
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101189\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

What about the beautiful Sinar M Lenses, are they going to fit the Sinar Hy6?

If not, what is the future of M system and how does the Sinar feel about making
something like ALPA 12SWA, able to hand hold with LF lenses in between the Hy6 and Sinar's LF 4x5 which is actually excellent idea. Because, lets say you have SINAR 12SWA and existing 4x5 which you can already turn in to 8x10 without having to purchase two cameras or additional lenses, so practically Sinar will kill three rabbits with one bullet, I think this is structurally and financially viable. Model Based on ALPA will be very easy to manufacture and definitely appealing to many of us, especially if they can build it with the digital rangefinder, but to start even without the digital rangefinder will be an excellent idea to use all cameras with the single selection of ultra fine lenses.

I think you should let SINAR think seriously about this possible addition since
the future SINAR 12SWA doesn't require software electronics etc. and therefore
minimal investment with the substantial opportunity to lead the market without any financial fears.

As you said, Rollei lenses will fit Sinar Hy6 and they do fit ALPA 12SWA which
in another words will fit future SINAR 12SWA.

Now my question is, who or which company other then SINAR is in position to offer marriage of such a beautiful and integrated system?

Hasselblad/Mamiya/Leaf/Phase, I DON'T THINK SO!!!

REGARDS
Danijela
« Last Edit: February 16, 2007, 11:21:28 pm by Danijela D. Karic »
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Danijela D. Karic

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« Reply #136 on: February 16, 2007, 08:50:28 pm »

Quote
This is why it is so very imporatant that you choose the camera platform that does everything you require of it..and in high end architectural terms..
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101205\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I realize now, it is harder to find the right system then the right Man/Woman.


Quote
if you require the ability to tilt then you must work with a set up that allows you to do so..the choice between film or digital must be secondary to that...i believe.

marc
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101205\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Let’s understand each other,

Let’s say my choice between film or digital is and will be secondary. The problem
I found is with finding the right Mobile system which as I always like to say is small and
Leica like, with powerful LF lenses. Plus being able to use the very same expensive lenses on tilt and shift camera and it
doesn't have to be 4x5 if the image circle on digital lenses is small, let it be Arca/Linhof 679 or any other company as long as
I can fit my ALPA lenses. Otherwise duplicating lenses is just pure waste.
 
I just can't believe that we are living in the 21st Century with less then limited solutions to marry the
classic style of photography with the digital attributes and avoid burning money.


Regards
Danijela
« Last Edit: February 16, 2007, 09:40:33 pm by Danijela D. Karic »
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Danijela D. Karic

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« Reply #137 on: February 16, 2007, 09:34:47 pm »

Quote
I just can't believe that we are living in the 21st Century with less then limited solutions to marry the
classic style of photography with the digital attributes and avoid burning money.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101303\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

This is why I think SINAR is in unique position to change this for good.

Regards
Danijela
« Last Edit: February 16, 2007, 09:41:05 pm by Danijela D. Karic »
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thsinar

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« Reply #138 on: February 16, 2007, 09:35:15 pm »

hi Danijela.

The Sinaron Digital AF Zeiss lenses will not fit the Hy6: they have a complete different mount and have been built exclusively for the Sinar m.

The Sinar m will continue, since there are ther thoughts behing it: it is a camera system, fitting as well the LF Sinar, as a electronical shutter with full automated controls (via Sinar m or Captureshop), accepting at the same time lense from Nikon, Hasselblad V and the Zeiss AF.

You idea about a Sinar camera like the Alpa is interesting: I will forward your idea/suggestion.

Thierry

Quote
What about the beautiful Sinar M Lenses, are they going to fit the Sinar Hy6?

If not, what is the future of M system and how does the Sinar feel about making
something like ALPA 12SWA, able to hand hold with LF lenses in between the Hy6 and Sinar's LF 4x5 which is actually excellent idea. Because, lets say you have SINAR 12SWA and 4x5 which you can turn in to 8x10 without having to purchase two cameras or additional lenses, so practically Sinar will kill three rabbits with one bullet, I think this is structurally and financially viable. Model Based on ALPA will be very easy to manufacture and definitely appealing to many of us, especially if they can build it with the digital rangefinder, but to start even without the digital rangefinder will be an excellent idea to use all cameras with the single selection of ultra fine lenses.

I think you should let SINAR think seriously about this possible addition since
the future SINAR 12SWA doesn't require software electronics etc. and therefore
minimal investment with the substantial opportunity to lead the market without any financial fears.

As you said, Rollei lenses will fit Sinar Hy6 and they do fit ALPA 12SWA which
in another words will fit future SINAR 12SWA.

Now my question is, who or which company other then SINAR is in position to offer marriage of such a beautiful and integrated system?

Hasselblad/Mamiya/Leaf/Phase, I DON'T THINK SO!!!

REGARDS
Danijela
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=101300\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
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Danijela D. Karic

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« Reply #139 on: February 16, 2007, 11:32:02 pm »

Att: [span style=\'font-size:11pt;line-height:100%\']Rainer[/span]

Could you post some images taken with 35HR and 60HR and if you could
share your thoughts on working with them, including any shortcomings if
any at all?

Regards
Danijela
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