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Author Topic: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa  (Read 1324896 times)

PeterAit

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15160 on: July 17, 2022, 09:46:20 am »

It wasn't hours after Biden begged the Saudi's for more oil (they refused and said he'd have to wait until Opec meets) and Biden's fist bumped the Saudi killer's hand, that the Saudis arrested Khashoggi's lawyer who was travelling to a wedding.  (What is it with Saudis and weddings?)   

Well, maybe it was a coincidence. Or maybe, more likely, they were waiting for Biden to let them off the hook and then thumb their nose at him while the contrails of Air Force One were still in the sky above Riyadh.    Time will tell but it looks like another feckless deal like the pullout in Afghanistan. So here we go again, defending the Arabs and their oil with our blood and treasure.  Why didn't Biden just get the American oil industry to help America?



Aren't you being hypocritical? On the one hand you knock Biden for not doing anything about gas prices, and then you knock him for trying to do something. The Saudis are sure a sleazy bunch but they have the oil and are at least nominally our friends.

And the US has been energy independent for a while in that we export more than we import:

https://www.factcheck.org/2022/03/examining-u-s-energy-independence-claims

As for "...get the American oil industry to help America?" are you serious? The oil industry does not give a fiddler's fart about the country but only about their own profits. And even if they did, they cannot just turn a spigot and get more oil. It takes time, years sometimes, to get wells producing. Not to mention the shortage in refinery capacity.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15161 on: July 17, 2022, 10:06:55 am »

For someone that keeps accusing Biden of being senile, you have a poor memory for things that have already been discussed in detail. The Capitol Police Board is the body that governs the United States Capitol Police. It was established in 1873, and today consists of three voting members: the Sergeant at Arms of the United States House of Representatives, the Sergeant at Arms of the United States Senate, and the Architect of the Capitol.

As a reminder...

You failed to mention that Chief of the Capitol Police Sund, Sargeant of Arms of the House Irving, and Sargeant of the Arms of the Senate Stenger were all fired for their incompetence on Jan 6th. (Officially they were asked to submit their resignation, the way things are done in Washington). 

CHief of Capitol Police Sund originally failed to accept additional police officers for the demonstration that were offered to him by other police organizations and the military controlled by Trump. So Trump offered additional manpower through the military he controls as Commander in Chief. Is there any evidence the military was told to stand down by Trump or anyone else in the administration?  Why did Sund refuse when they offered it?  And then the two Sergeants of Arms refused to give him the men when Sund finally asked them on Jan 6th after it was too late to make a difference.  Was any of this mentioned in the public hearings?  Of course, Democrats running it don't want any other reasons for the riots to be discussed other than Trump because it would take away from the"guilt" Democrats are trying to establish about him.  In a real trial, all these important facts will be pressed home by the defense which is absent at the current hearings.  It all stinks of the same Decmorat charges about Russian collusion.

While it's true the Sergeants were appointed by Republicans, they reported on Jan 6th to Democrats Speaker Pelosi in the House and Leader Schumer in the Senate who run both the Senate and House.  Did anyone tell Sund not to ask for any more help knowing that his police would be overwhelmed without it?  Are these things all being discussed in the hearings? This entire affair would never had happened if the police did their job.   Why didn't they?

Robert Roaldi

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15162 on: July 17, 2022, 10:12:45 am »

You failed to mention that Chief of the Capitol Police Sund, Sargeant of Arms of the House Irving, and Sargeant of the Arms of the Senate Stenger were all fired for their incompetence on Jan 6th. (Officially they were asked to submit their resignation, the way things are done in Washington). 

CHief of Capitol Police Sund originally failed to accept additional police officers for the demonstration that were offered to him by other police organizations and the military controlled by Trump. So Trump offered additional manpower through the military he controls as Commander in Chief. Is there any evidence the military was told to stand down by Trump or anyone else in the administration?  Why did Sund refuse when they offered it?  And then the two Sergeants of Arms refused to give him the men when Sund finally asked them on Jan 6th after it was too late to make a difference.  Was any of this mentioned in the public hearings?  Of course, Democrats running it don't want any other reasons for the riots to be discussed other than Trump because it would take away from the"guilt" Democrats are trying to establish about him.  In a real trial, all these important facts will be pressed home by the defense which is absent at the current hearings.  It all stinks of the same Decmorat charges about Russian collusion.

While it's true the Sergeants were appointed by Republicans, they reported on Jan 6th to Democrats Speaker Pelosi in the House and Leader Schumer in the Senate who run both the Senate and House.  Did anyone tell Sund not to ask for any more help knowing that his police would be overwhelmed without it?  Are these things all being discussed in the hearings? This entire affair would never had happened if the police did their job.   Why didn't they?

Oh please stop it with that tired Tucker spin. It's obvious to everyone what happened that day. The alternative scenario you're trying to portray is farcical.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15163 on: July 17, 2022, 10:20:08 am »

I agree, much of the stimulus money was unnecessary. We were in the same boat as you and did not need it, so we gave it all away to groups helping those who really were in dire straights. You might also direct your ire at the many businesses and churches who took payroll protection money that they didn;t need.

But as for retiring because of stimulus money, I don't think so. Even a couple who got all 3 payments woud have gotten maybe 2 months worth of a mediocre salary, hardly enough to trigger retirement.
Peter, you haven't been reading my posts.  I've said many times that there were hundreds of billions of dollars in fraud by businesses who applied for stimulus money to pay their employees.  They got the money and put it in their pockets.  The employees were given nothing.  The IRS and government have waived all investigations for everyone who got this money if it was under I believe around two million per application.  So all this money was stolen from us and the government is doing nothing.  Well, of course, they're doing nothing.  It isn't their money. Why should they care?   

It's not just the stimulous money they got that got older employees to retire. Most of it was the unemployment insurance they got from both the Federal government and their state government. In many cases that totaled an amount greater than their salaries.  So here they were, without jobs because businesses had shut down or laid them off, getting all that money.  Why would they look for a new job paying way less than their old jobs or the insurance money?  Well, many decided getting a new job was not worth it at that point in their lives.  So they retired and collected Social Security.  So those jobs are not being filled today in many cases. 

Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15164 on: July 17, 2022, 10:37:52 am »

Aren't you being hypocritical? On the one hand you knock Biden for not doing anything about gas prices, and then you knock him for trying to do something. The Saudis are sure a sleazy bunch but they have the oil and are at least nominally our friends.

And the US has been energy independent for a while in that we export more than we import:

https://www.factcheck.org/2022/03/examining-u-s-energy-independence-claims

As for "...get the American oil industry to help America?" are you serious? The oil industry does not give a fiddler's fart about the country but only about their own profits. And even if they did, they cannot just turn a spigot and get more oil. It takes time, years sometimes, to get wells producing. Not to mention the shortage in refinery capacity.
The optics for America and Biden are terrible.  Isn't he embarrassed bumping fists, especially after all the negative things he said about that killer Prince MBS?  It looks like we're selling our soul for oil. He did not have to ask a killer to help us with oil when he could have made it easier for American oil producers to keep producing it for us. 

Before Biden took over, we were pumping a million barrels of oil more than today.  We were energy-independent.  We didn't need the Saudis to go beg to. Another advantage is all the money and profits and additional taxes for us would stay in America instead of being spent overseas in Saudi Arabia, Russia, Iran and Venezuela for their oil.  We're importing half a million barrels of oil daily from Russia instead of processing Canadian oil being piped through the XL pipeline because it was canceled by Biden on the first day of his administration.  Now he's bumping fists.

Americans are not stupid.  They can see higher oil prices are at least partially caused by Democrats and Biden's anti-oil policies.  If we need more refineries, why is he subsidizing Chinese solar panels?  Voters will be reminded of all this at the voting booths.

Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15165 on: July 17, 2022, 10:46:21 am »

Oh please stop it with that tired Tucker spin. It's obvious to everyone what happened that day. The alternative scenario you're trying to portray is farcical.
I don't watch Tucker.  Is he still stealing my material? :)

Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15166 on: July 17, 2022, 10:53:11 am »

Unfortunately, there were quite a few people taking advantage of the generous government offers who stopped working and chose taking the easy money instead. And this happened not only in USA, but also in other countries. I know personally people in USA, Canada and Germany who did exactly what Alan described.
Too much money printing and other stupid decisions caused by Fed and well meaning, but clueless and incompetent politicians.
Thanks for the support Les.  Be careful or you'll wind up on the same sh*t list as I'm on.  :)

I will say that many of the politicians are not just well-meaning.  They want to give out money to buy votes.  Of course, the voting public cheers them on.  Then we complain when inflation makes that money worthless.  It's insidious.

TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15167 on: July 17, 2022, 11:11:42 am »

While it's true the Sergeants were appointed by Republicans, they reported on Jan 6th to Democrats Speaker Pelosi in the House and Leader Schumer in the Senate

Listen to yourself Mr. Senility. First it was the "Democratic controlled Congress who run the police"... WRONG. Just like you were wrong when you spread the same manure 6 months ago. Now you're again saying Chuck Schumer was the Majority Leader in the senate on January 6th... WRONG. Your parade of repeated false assertions and factual errors doesn't end there. They are numerous. You're a fountain of misinformation. Actually, it's more like a sewer backing up and I'm sick and tired of cleaning it up for you.

You want facts? The fact is that you have no interest in facts. None. Zero. Nada. You're going to point in any and every direction except that of the actual perpetrators of the crime and minimize what happened to the point of absurdity.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2022, 01:24:38 pm by TechTalk »
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TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15168 on: July 17, 2022, 11:16:49 am »

This entire affair would never had happened if the police did their job.

How does anyone become as blind as this?
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TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15169 on: July 17, 2022, 11:32:26 am »

...It all stinks...

That odor you're detecting is your own never ending supply of sh*t you recycle and repeat. Christopher Hitchens once said of Jerry Falwell: "If you gave Falwell an enema, he could be buried in a match box." Well, Falwell wasn't alone in that regard.

Your complete blindness to the BIG LIE, and the liar behind it, which created a violent mob and sent them to the Capitol is sad. Your actions in trying to minimize the assault on the Capitol and ignore the ongoing assault on democracy is disgraceful.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2022, 12:31:22 pm by TechTalk »
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TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15170 on: July 17, 2022, 12:24:29 pm »

...Canadian oil being piped through the XL pipeline...

Somehow, I get the impression you say that because you actually know how idiotic it is and enjoy the sheer lunacy of it. Kind of like going on a carnival ride for you, isn't it?
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Peter McLennan

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15171 on: July 17, 2022, 01:23:48 pm »

Somehow, I get the impression you say that because you actually know how idiotic it is and enjoy the sheer lunacy of it. Kind of like going on a carnival ride for you, isn't it?

My Sprinter van forum has about a half dozen "Alans".  Just like Alan, they all spout the same unsupportable rightist crap.

They're all bored white men and they all say stupid things, apparently just to cause trouble. Keyboard Vandals, I'd call them.  They constantly call attention to themselves by saying stupid things, apparently just for the fun of it.  As with Alan, arguing facts with them is fruitless as it simply causes them to change course, move the goalposts and spout new crap. 

"Commie!  Socialist! Why do you hate America? The government is out to get you! ANTIFA caused Jan 6. The moon landings were all fake!" You know - the same old crap endlessly repeated, never validated.

One of them recently reported the results of an online IQ test he'd taken and was proud to announce (to great derision) that he'd scored 167.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15172 on: July 17, 2022, 01:28:43 pm »

Listen to yourself Mr. Senility. First it was the "Democratic controlled Congress who run the police"... WRONG. Just like you were wrong when you spread the same manure 6 months ago. Now you're again saying Chuck Schumer was the Majority Leader in the senate on January 6th... WRONG. Your parade of repeated false assertions and factual errors doesn't end there. They are numerous. You're a fountain of misinformation. Actually, it's more like a sewer backing up and I'm sick and tired of cleaning it up for you.

You want facts? The fact is that you have no interest in facts. None. Zero. Nada. You're going to point in any and every direction except that of the actual perpetrators of the crime and minimize what happened to the point of absurdity.
I'm done with your personal insults.  You're on my Ignore list.

Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15173 on: July 17, 2022, 01:29:22 pm »

My Sprinter van forum has about a half dozen "Alans".  Just like Alan, they all spout the same unsupportable rightist crap.

They're all bored white men and they all say stupid things, apparently just to cause trouble. Keyboard Vandals, I'd call them.  They constantly call attention to themselves by saying stupid things, apparently just for the fun of it.  As with Alan, arguing facts with them is fruitless as it simply causes them to change course, move the goalposts and spout new crap. 

"Commie!  Socialist! Why do you hate America? The government is out to get you! ANTIFA caused Jan 6. The moon landings were all fake!" You know - the same old crap endlessly repeated, never validated.

One of them recently reported the results of an online IQ test he'd taken and was proud to announce (to great derision) that he'd scored 167.
I'm done with your personal insults. You're on my ignore list.

Peter McLennan

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15174 on: July 17, 2022, 01:30:14 pm »

How does anyone become as blind as this?

I blame the Internet and right wing, for-profit media.  I had the fortunate experience of driving from Washington DC to Western Canada recently.  Unfortunately, I decided to listen to AM radio while crossing the "flyover states". American talk radio is simply beyond description. Until America regains control of the airwaves and social media, this disease of disinformation will continue to metastasize.
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digitaldog

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15175 on: July 17, 2022, 01:30:50 pm »

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Peter McLennan

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15176 on: July 17, 2022, 01:32:10 pm »

I'm done with your personal insults. You're on my ignore list.

So?

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TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15177 on: July 17, 2022, 03:03:26 pm »

My Sprinter van forum has about a half dozen "Alans".  Just like Alan, they all spout the same unsupportable rightist crap...

The concern I have is that there may be just enough blind ideologues, who are willing to place their ideology above any moral or civic commitment to democracy and country, to rot the whole 230+ year experiment in self-government from the inside to the point of collapse. They've already come quite close, to the shock and dismay of many and to the delight of the antigovernment zealots; who have been working steadily toward that goal for decades by systematically chipping away at any sense of connection people feel to their own government. All that's then required is a demagogue to come along and lean on it enough to make it crumble.

Their goal has been to create an image of government as some singular entity ("the" government) and establish a narrative surrounding it as some distinctly separate other thing to be feared — some "other" thing separate and apart from real Americans. It's the same time tested method which has been used forever to fracture any connection or bond that one group of people might feel for another and create a vision of some "other" to be feared and destroyed. Just target the current anxieties, worries, and fears people have in their lives and then accuse the "other" of causing them — repeatedly and relentlessly over a long period of time. In this case, "the" government (meaning our government) has been the "other" blamed for any number of problems by a determined group of antigovernment ideologues for decades.

When faith in elected government and its institutions at the top have been sufficiently eroded by decades of sustained effort, all that's needed is to attack the foundation on which it rests which is faith in democracy and its exercise by the people thru elections. Then watch it collapse into anarchy as it did on January 6th in the central symbol and seat of self-government, the nation's Capitol. That's where we are today and it's a dangerous time — if you haven't turned a blind eye and are deliberately ignoring it or are complicit in attempting to conceal it.
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TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15178 on: July 17, 2022, 03:17:34 pm »

So?

Exactly. When you routinely ignore what people have actually written when you reply to them, what difference does it make?
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TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #15179 on: July 17, 2022, 03:19:41 pm »

I'm done with your personal insults.  You're on my Ignore list.

Maybe I can put the plunger, mop, and bucket away for a little while if that's the case.
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