Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa

[Alan Klein]

Is this like the drone strike against a terrorist driving a truck-full of explosives toward the airport that killed 10 civilians including 7 kids, except it turned out to be an aid worker driving a truck filled with drinking water?

A terrible tragedy probably done in a rush to strike back for the explosion that killed all those American soldiers and Marines as we were leaving.  However, what does that have to do with striking back at terrorists who want to attack us?  Should we eliminate our military?  Should we have another 9-11 on our shores?  If the terrorists and Afghans and other peoples want us to leave them alone, don't send their terrorists to attack us or our allies. 

[Alan Klein]

Here is the source I used for my examples of salaries at Tesla and GM:
https://medium.com/@paysa/tech-salaries-who-pays-more-tesla-or-general-motors-2edb83480581

here are two more links showing average salaries at Tesla and GM:
https://www.payscale.com/research/US/Employer=Tesla_Motors/Salary

as to the profitability of the company, according to Bloomberg, Tesla's last 8 quarters have been profitable, breaking record practically every quarter.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/alanohnsman/2021/07/26/tesla-profit-streak-rolls-on-for-eighth-quarter-powered-by-record-net-income/?sh=6e1dccc11f74

Of course, Les, in fairness to GM, Tesla has already received millions in subsidies for their customers for buying Tesla EVs.  So the government is spreading it around.  Politicians never know who might vote for them. 

That's what the $1.5T and the $3.5T giveaways are all about.  To lock in the vote so Democrats can keep power forever.  Who cares if it causes the economy to tank from inflation?  Of course the rich will get richer because of it and the middle class and poor will pay for it with inflation and higher prices.  They will all need a second job to pay their bills.

[PeterAit]

Peter, A freer market makes an economy more productive, not less.  You want to lower costs and prices not make them higher. Our standard of living goes up with higher productivity and less cost.     If the government requires more expensive union help or adds costs with more regulation, VAT taxes like in Europe, etc., prices go up to cover these additional costs.  The general public's standard of living goes down.   Higher labor rates and regulation domestically have forced manufacturing offshore so there are fewer American jobs at any wage level.

Now we may want these social benefits.  We may be willing to accept higher prices and less value for certain social values.  We can argue about that.  But let's not shoot ourselves in the foot.  In general, the best economy with fewer negative consequences is formed with less government involvement. I like low prices as much as anyone,

You are missing the big picture. Lower wages mean lower prices but they also mean a lower standard of living for the workers. As an extreme example, cotton was really cheap before the Civil War. And we have Walmart with its low prices and also some of its employees on food stamps and Medicaid. And you know what that means--you and I and other taxpayers are subsidizing Walmart's profits and the higher standard of living of its customers. OK with you?

US manufacturing moved overseas for one reason--desire for more profits on the part of the corporations.

[Peter McLennan]

So you had to join Andrew in a personal attack.

Nothing personal about it at all, Alan.  Just registering agreement with a posted quotation.

For some reason, you appear to really enjoy autovictimization.

[Alan Klein]

Nothing personal about it at all, Alan.  Just registering agreement with a posted quotation.

For some reason, you appear to really enjoy autovictimization.

It's unseemly and a copout.  Your post agreed with a personal attack.   It's why LuLa is dying.  Attack my theories, facts, opinions and beliefs if you feel they're erroneous.  But insults and other gutter talk are less than what we are.  We're all better than that.

[TechTalk]

"The narrower the mind, the broader the statement." -Ted Cook

Excellent!

+1

That's one I'll file away for future reference, as its been consistently proven true.

[TechTalk]

So you had to join Andrew in a personal attack.

If the shoe fits, it's likely because it's been worn many times.

[Peter McLennan]

If the government requires more expensive union help or adds costs with more regulation, VAT taxes like in Europe, etc., prices go up to cover these additional costs.  The general public's standard of living goes down. ...In general, the best economy with fewer negative consequences is formed with less government involvement.

Have you travelled outside the USA recently?  Highly recommended treatment for American myopia.
Western Europeans enjoy by many measures a "general public's standard of living" higher than Americans.

Stuff like, you know, functional health care, functional education, functional highways, functional government...


Not that this is a perfect metric of the "general public's standard of living", but in Denmark, where "more regulation, VAT taxes like in Europe, etc., prices go up to cover these additional costs"

this:

McDonald's worker wage:   Denmark: $22
                                                  USA: $7.25

Cost of Big Mac:                Denmark: $5.15
                                                 USA: $3.99


https://www.newsweek.com/minimum-wage-15-denmark-big-mac-mcdonalds-1573414

[Alan Klein]

You are missing the big picture. Lower wages mean lower prices but they also mean a lower standard of living for the workers. As an extreme example, cotton was really cheap before the Civil War. And we have Walmart with its low prices and also some of its employees on food stamps and Medicaid. And you know what that means--you and I and other taxpayers are subsidizing Walmart's profits and the higher standard of living of its customers. OK with you?

US manufacturing moved overseas for one reason--desire for more profits on the part of the corporations.

But interference from the government is worse.  First off, the government isn't spending its own money.  It's taking money in taxes from one group of people and giving it to another, in this case, the GM employees. The rest of the country is paying more for their car purchases since it's their taxes that are paying GM employees.   So that lowers the standard of living of non-GM employees just as rebates for Tesla car purchasers raises theirs, mainly rich people who can afford $100K autos. If the government would only run the military, the post office and a few other things, and leave the rest of us alone, we'd all be better off.

Regarding low wages causing food stamp,s for the most part it;s been the devaluing of the dollar that has caused that.  When I was a kid my father worked supporting my family. He wasn;t rich -  a postal clerk.  Many families were like that then with one worker in the family.  Because of inflation and high taxes, mothers have had to go to work instead of staying home to help raise a family better.  It's been the government that has caused these problems.  Welfare has forced family generations to continue on welfare rather than stand on their own.  Again government caused that.  When President Clinton, a Democrat, got rid of a lot of welfare, everyone did better, especially those families that had been on welfare for generations.  We have moved back to welfare again and the $3.5T will rededicate and reinforce it again.  They'll be more people on food stamps not less as the economy suffers and more jobs go overseas. 

[digitaldog]

It's unseemly and a copout. 

But not moronic and stupid; there is someone else here who stoop to that level on a daily basis.

It's why LuLa is dying.

Another kneed jerk assumption without a lick of data.
And yet, with all this dying, you will reply here again.
"Cheats and hypocrites are those who do everything with words and do nothing with actions".—  Democritus

[Alan Klein]

Have you travelled outside the USA recently?  Highly recommended treatment for American myopia.
Western Europeans enjoy by many measures a "general public's standard of living" higher than Americans.

Stuff like, you know, functional health care, functional education, functional highways, functional government...


Not that this is a perfect metric of the "general public's standard of living", but in Denmark, where "more regulation, VAT taxes like in Europe, etc., prices go up to cover these additional costs"

this:

McDonald's worker wage:   Denmark: $22
                                                  USA: $7.25

Cost of Big Mac:                Denmark: $5.15
                                                 USA: $3.99


https://www.newsweek.com/minimum-wage-15-denmark-big-mac-mcdonalds-1573414

Economies are more efficient and prices are less in general if things are kept privately.  The more government gets involved, the worse it is.  I can't imagine MacDonalds is paying new employees $7.50.  Meanwhile, more realistically, Amazon is hiring unskilled new people at $18/hr with $3000 bonuses and I believe paying for college.  MacDonalds will never get new people for $7.50 not when you can get a job at Amazon pushing cartons around.  In any case, if your objective in life is to learn nothing and push boxes around or flip hamburgers, you're not going to make much. 

[TechTalk]

if your objective in life is to learn nothing...

then you've probably embraced a rigid narrow ideology.

[digitaldog]

I can't imagine MacDonalds is paying new employees $7.50.

I can't imagine you ever posting an opinion that you first checked the facts on!
https://www.workstream.us/blog/mcdonalds-pay-hourly-workers

A typical McDonald's worker earns around US$8 per hour, which, truthfully speaking, is hardly enough to support an individual, let alone a family. They work five days a week, which is an average of 25-30 hours per week. In fact, we discovered that McDonald's actually limits the number of hours an employee can work to only 40 hours per week.

Now imagine a part time worker at MacDonalds and what they might be paid.
Now imagine holding onto both your knees and researching a topic before posting something else foolish for us to have to fact check and then make fun of you.
McDonald's has promised recently to raise the hourly pay for some of their Restaurants and thus some of their workers.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/05/13/mcdonalds-raises-hourly-wages-for-company-owned-restaurants.html

Based on the current labor market, McDonald’s expects that the average wage for employees of its company-owned restaurants will be $15 per hour by 2024.
However, these increases will not directly impact workers who are employed by restaurants owned by McDonald’s franchisees. The fast-food giant franchises 95% of its U.S. restaurants.

I post this not for the hammer; way over his pay grade.

[TechTalk]

The more government gets involved, the worse it is.

"The narrower the mind, the broader the statement." -Ted Cook

[Alan Klein]

Looks like France may change its mind about Trump.

France Is Outraged by U.S. Nuclear Submarine Deal With Australia
French officials accused President Biden of acting like his predecessor, saying they were stabbed in the back and not consulted.
PARIS — France reacted with fury on Thursday to President Biden’s announcement of a deal to help Australia deploy nuclear-powered submarines, calling it a “unilateral, brutal, unpredictable decision” that resembled the rash and sudden policy shifts common during the Trump administration.

The angry words from Jean-Yves Le Drian, the foreign minister, in an interview with Franceinfo radio, followed an official statement from him and Florence Parly, the minister of the Armed Forces, calling “the American choice to exclude a European ally and partner such as France” a “regrettable decision” that “shows a lack of coherence.”

The degree of French anger recalled the acrimonious rift in 2003 between Paris and Washington over the Iraq war and involved language not seen since then. “This is not done between allies,” Mr. Le Drian said. His specific comparison of President Biden to his predecessor appeared certain to infuriate the American president.

His indignation reflected the fact that France had its own deal with Australia, reached in 2016, to provide it with conventional, less technologically sophisticated submarines. That $66 billion deal has now collapsed, but a harsh legal battle over the contract appears inevitable.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/16/world/europe/france-australia-uk-us-submarines.html

[digitaldog]

Looks like France may change its mind about Trump.

Looks like Alan is making massive assumptions again and posting items that only he can accept to defend Trump.
What France stated that doesn't show they changed their minds about Trump:

France on Thursday accused President Biden of making an "unpredictable decision" like former President Trump "used to do" after he scrapped a $40 billion submarine defense deal that the European nation had signed with Australia, according to Reuters.

Alan has never heard the concept that two wrongs don't make a right. His silly ideas just posted is, because France isn't happy with Biden, and he is (according to France) acting like Trump,
Alan comes up with the silly notion that: "France may change its mind about Trump."
No, idiotic idea and posted opinion. Only a hammer would confuse this concept and form such an idea.

[digitaldog]

Alan of course will not give credit (if it's even deserved) to Biden or the fact he doesn't know or didn't report: China Is Outraged by U.S. Nuclear Submarine Deal With Australia!

China, France furious at new U.S. security alliance with Australia, Britain
Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Zhao Lijian said the pact “seriously undermined regional peace and stability."

[TechTalk]

You were quicker on the draw than I was Andrew...

The country most upset with Australia deciding to acquire nuclear submarines, rather than the previously planned French diesel subs, is China.

https://apnews.com/article/technology-joe-biden-australia-china

China said the alliance would severely damage regional peace and stability, and jeopardize efforts to halt nuclear weapon proliferation. It said it was “highly irresponsible” for the U.S. and Britain to export the nuclear technology, and that Australia was to blame for a breakdown in bilateral relations.

“The most urgent task is for Australia to correctly recognize the reasons for the setbacks in the relations between the two countries, and think carefully whether to treat China as a partner or a threat,” said Zhao Lijian, a spokesperson of China’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

Beijing has been unhappy with the Biden administration calling it out over human rights abuses in the Xianjing region, the crackdown on democracy activists in Hong Kong, and cybersecurity breaches. Biden spoke by phone with China’s President Xi Jinping last week. After the call, the official Xinhua News Agency reported that Xi expressed concerns that U.S. government policy toward China has caused “serious difficulties” in relations.

[digitaldog]

And from China back to natural selection:

Unvaxed Teen Councilman Who Attacked Mask Mandates Now Battling ‘Terrible’ COVID Pneumonia
Hunter Pepper, a 19-year-old council member who vowed to “fight to the end” against a mask mandate in Decatur, Alabama, revealed he’s been hospitalized with shallow breathing.

[TechTalk]

Some time ago, I watched with amusement as a rear admiral tried to explain submarine technology to an Australian senator during a 2017 hearing regarding the contract with France for diesel subs. The dimwitted Senator Pauline Hanson is the founder and leader of One Nation, a far-right populist party. She reminds me a good deal of Trump. She made wild assumptions and assertions regarding first the propulsion system and then the power system limiting the ability to stay submerged for only 20-minutes. The rear admiral summoned all of his patience and self-control in dealing with her asinine questions.

Here's a short excerpt clip that's just over 2-minutes long.

https://www.youtube.com/Rear Admiral Schools Senator in Submarine Capabilities

If you want the full 12-minute version, it is linked below.

https://www.youtube.com/Pauline Hanson asks if pump-jet submarines can only stay underwater for 20mins