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Author Topic: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa  (Read 1341882 times)

faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6320 on: January 26, 2021, 12:47:50 pm »

The Federal government offered to purchase $1.9 billion from them.  If someone offers you that, you'd get the product out pretty quick to earn the money.  That's the incentive to work faster.  IF the government didn't offer them big bucks, they would have taken the usual years to develop a vaccine.

Right, because no one but the United States was in a big hurry to get the vaccine. Who else would have possibly been interested in buying the vaccine if they developed it first? There was no incentive to be first to market but for the contract with the US. Obviously.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2021, 12:57:40 pm by faberryman »
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6321 on: January 26, 2021, 12:58:57 pm »

Lots of BS spewing from you here. Where did I say I wouldn't take the vaccine...pure BS Alan. As far as Trump not doing enough...well his mocking wearing masks, disregarding social distancing and egging on people to disregard lockdown orders and go out to party as usual are all examples of the idiot not doing enough...in fact doing harm...and here you sit with over 400,000 dead.

Alan, can you tell me exactly what Trump did to speed up the development of the vaccine?

Read this.  I posted it earlier.
https://www.hhs.gov/coronavirus/explaining-operation-warp-speed/index.html

faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6322 on: January 26, 2021, 01:00:59 pm »

So who's facts are right?

I can't even begin to imagine.
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faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6323 on: January 26, 2021, 01:06:28 pm »

If the US government did nothing, why do the Democrats want to spend another $25 billion getting more vaccines developed, distributed, and injected?

Because Trump didn't order enough?
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6324 on: January 26, 2021, 01:07:29 pm »

Warp Speed didnl;t only include payments  for the development of the vaccines and promises to buy certain quantities.  It also included manufacturing and distribution.  Here are just a couple of sample months of activities for both:

Manufacturing
The federal government is making investments in the necessary manufacturing capacity at its own risk, giving firms confidence that they can invest aggressively in development and allowing faster distribution of an eventual vaccine. Manufacturing capacity for selected candidates will be advanced while they are still in development, rather than scaled up after approval or authorization. Manufacturing capacity developed will be used for whatever vaccine is eventually successful, if possible given the nature of the successful product, regardless of which firms have developed the capacity.

Select actions to support OWS manufacturing efforts so far include:

May
The May 21, April 16, and March 30 HHS agreements with AstraZeneca, Moderna, and Johnson & Johnson respectively include investments in manufacturing capabilities.

June
June 1: HHS announced a task order with Emergent BioSolutions to advance domestic manufacturing capabilities and capacity for a potential COVID-19 vaccine as well as therapeutics, worth approximately $628 million, using Emergent's BARDA-supported Center for Innovation in Advanced Department and Manufacturing.

July
July 27: HHS announced a task order with Texas A&M University and FUJIFILM to advance domestic manufacturing capabilities and capacity for a potential COVID-19 vaccine, worth approximately $265 million, using another BARDA-supported CIADM.

Development
To accelerate development while maintaining standards for safety and efficacy, OWS has been selecting the most promising countermeasure candidates and providing coordinated government support.

Protocols for the demonstration of safety and efficacy are being aligned, which will allow the trials to proceed more quickly, and the protocols for the trials will be overseen by the federal government, as opposed to traditional public-private partnerships, in which pharmaceutical companies decide on their own protocols. Rather than eliminating steps from traditional development timelines, steps will proceed simultaneously, such as starting manufacturing of the vaccine at industrial scale well before the demonstration of vaccine efficacy and safety as happens normally. This increases the financial risk, but not the product risk.

Select actions to support OWS vaccine and therapeutic development so far include:

March
March 30: HHS announced $456 million in funds for Johnson & Johnson's (Janssen) candidate vaccine. Phase 1 clinical trials began in Belgium on July 24th and in the U.S on July 27th. Janssen's large-scale Phase 3 clinical trial began on September 22, 2020, making them the fourth OWS candidate to enter Phase 3 clinical trials in the United States. Up to 60,000 volunteers will be enrolled in the trial at up to nearly 215 clinical research sites in the United States and internationally.

April
April 16: HHS made up to $483 million in support available for Moderna's candidate vaccine, which began Phase 1 trials on March 16 and received a fast-track designation from FDA. This agreement was expanded on July 26 to include an additional $472 million to support late-stage clinical development, including the expanded Phase 3 study of the company's mRNA vaccine, which began on July 27th.

May
May 21: HHS announced up to $1.2 billion in support for AstraZeneca's candidate vaccine, developed in conjunction with the University of Oxford. The agreement is to make available at least 300 million doses of the vaccine for the United States, with the first doses delivered as early as October 2020, if the product successfully receives FDA EUA or licensure. AstraZeneca's large-scale Phase 3 clinical trial began on August 31, 2020.




Distribution
OWS and our private partners are developing a plan for delivering a safe and effective product to Americans as quickly and reliably as possible. Experts from HHS are leading vaccine development, while experts from DoD are partnering with the CDC and other parts of HHS to coordinate supply, production, and distribution of vaccines.

Download the Vaccine Distribution Process - PDF*

Select actions to support OWS distribution efforts include:

May
May 12: DoD and HHS announced a $138 million contract with ApiJect for more than 100 million prefilled syringes for distribution across the United States by year-end 2020, as well as the development of manufacturing capacity for the ultimate production goal of over 500 million prefilled syringes in 2021.

June
June 9: HHS and DoD announced a joint effort to increase domestic manufacturing capacity for vials that may be needed for vaccines and treatments

June 11: HHS announced $204 million in funds to Corning to expand the domestic manufacturing capacity to produce approximately 164 million Valor Glass vials per year if needed. Valor Glass provides chemical durability to minimize particulate contamination. The specialized glass allows for rapid filling and capping methods that can increase manufacturing throughput by as much as 50 percent compared with conventional filling lines, which in turn can reduce the overall manufacturing time for vaccines and therapies.

June 11: HHS announced $143 million to SiO2 Materials Science to ramp up capacity to produce the company's glass-coated plastic container, which can be used for drugs and vaccines. The new lines provide the capacity to produce an additional 120 million vials per year if needed.

Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6325 on: January 26, 2021, 01:11:01 pm »

What the Democrats are doing is trying to take credit for all the work the Trump Administration did to prepare and plan for the rollout of the vaccines. 

faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6326 on: January 26, 2021, 01:13:07 pm »

Ok, so I don;t remember all the facts from 50 years ago.  But that doesn't;t change my point.

Actually, it does matter that you got your facts wrong. Because you used false "facts", you arrived at the wrong conclusion.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2021, 01:32:58 pm by faberryman »
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MattBurt

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6327 on: January 26, 2021, 01:18:10 pm »

What the Democrats are doing is trying to take credit for all the work the Trump Administration did to prepare and plan for the rollout of the vaccines.

I'm sure Biden is going to start holding rallies to elevate his vaccine glory any day now...

But it does appear Trump (or his administration) may have reluctantly helped. After his denial cost many lives he must have realized it was making him look bad. Too little too late but it was more than nothing.
I don't see anyone trying to take credit except Trump. Everyone else seems to be concentrating on just getting the job done. Which still has a long way to go.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2021, 01:24:18 pm by MattBurt »
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John Camp

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6328 on: January 26, 2021, 01:20:16 pm »

What the Democrats are doing is trying to take credit for all the work the Trump Administration did to prepare and plan for the rollout of the vaccines.

Made me laugh. Really.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6329 on: January 26, 2021, 01:22:52 pm »

I'm sure Biden is going to start holding rallies to elevate his vaccine glory any day now...

But it does appear Trump may have reluctantly helped. After his denial cost many lives he must have realized it was making him look bad. Too little too late but it was more than nothing.
I don't see anyone trying to take credit except Trump. Everyone else seems to be concentrating on just getting the job done. Which still has a long way to go.
Too little too late?   Read the link.  Payment incentive activities are posted for March 2020.

Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6330 on: January 26, 2021, 01:26:13 pm »

Made me laugh. Really.
The Dems supported by the biased anti-Trump press have been saying for months Warp Speed is doing nothing.  Is this doing nothing?
https://www.hhs.gov/coronavirus/explaining-operation-warp-speed/index.html

faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6331 on: January 26, 2021, 01:36:42 pm »

Read this.  I posted it earlier.
https://www.hhs.gov/coronavirus/explaining-operation-warp-speed/index.html

Okay, so I read that. I didn't find anything in there about chez saying he wouldn't take the vaccine since Trump was involved in it. Perhaps you gave the wrong link.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6332 on: January 26, 2021, 01:39:32 pm »

Thanks to Trump and Operation Warp Speed, vaccinations in the US are outpacing the rest of the world by a lot except for Israel, UK, and maybe one or two other small countries.
https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/covid-vaccine-tracker-global-distribution/

Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6333 on: January 26, 2021, 01:41:32 pm »

Here's the map from that link.

TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6334 on: January 26, 2021, 01:45:20 pm »

Alan left out the last part from the link that he provided.

How is Operation Warp Speed being funded?

Congress has directed almost $10 billion to this effort through supplemental funding, including the CARES Act. Congress has also appropriated other flexible funding. The almost $10 billion specifically directed includes more than $6.5 billion designated for countermeasure development through BARDA and $3 billion for NIH research.

Alan's long list of money being allocated to companies has to come from Congress and more specifically originates in the House of Representatives. The U.S. Constitution Article 1, Section 7 begins with: "All Bills for raising Revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives".

So, I guess we should be calling it the Pelosi Vaccine to really follow Alan's logic—such as it is.
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jeremyrh

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6335 on: January 26, 2021, 01:52:09 pm »


So, I guess we should be calling it the Pelosi Vaccine to really follow Alan's logic—such as it is.

I think it's called the "Turkish Muslim Vaccine", right ?
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kers

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6336 on: January 26, 2021, 01:52:33 pm »

I thought 'Operation Warpspeed' was about getting 400.000 casualties in 10 months...
Even Startrek did not get over warpspeed 7.
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jeremyrh

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6337 on: January 26, 2021, 01:57:26 pm »

Ok, so I don;t remember all the facts from 50 years ago.  But that doesn't;t change my point.  Free markets are the best process. 

Evidently not, since we ended up with VHS and not Betamax.
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faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6338 on: January 26, 2021, 02:10:21 pm »

Evidently not, since we ended up with VHS and not Betamax.

I wanted to get a Betamax, but my wife told me that everything in Blockbuster was on VHS which pretty much sealed the deal. The quality of VHS is really crappy, but I guess it is better to be able to watch The Little Mermaid on crappy VHS than not at all, though that depends largely on how many times you have had to watch The Little Mermaid. Sometimes I wake up in the middle of the night having this nightmare about a crab singing Under the Sea. It's pretty scary. My therapist doesn't know what to make of it. I have tried hypnosis but apparently when asked about it, I just keep repeating "Betamax, Betamax..."
« Last Edit: January 26, 2021, 02:44:47 pm by faberryman »
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TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #6339 on: January 26, 2021, 02:11:02 pm »

IF the government didn't offer them big bucks, they would have taken the usual years to develop a vaccine.

Remember, the free market supplies services more efficiently and at a lower cost than the government.  Vaccines aren't different.  If the government didn't get involved, the free market would have handled it.  Frankly, I think more efficiently than the government.

There you go again wanting it both ways... Make up your mind.
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