Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa

[TechTalk]

Everyone keeps repeating their same points, true or not, over and over again.

Actually... relatively few. Most engage in substantive exchanges of thoughts and information on a variety of topics.

[Alan Klein]

They're a crime family. Trump's parents were criminals, Trump is a criminal, his children are criminals who conspired to cheat on taxes and to the illegal payments (in Ivanka's case.) Jared's a slum lord, as was his recently pardoned father, whose crimes were disgusting. If there was serious justice in the US, they'd all be in prison.

The Biden's took money from China and Ukraine for influence peddling VP Biden's position.  And four years ago we had another corrupt official running for president, Hillary Clinton, who influence peddled by selling her position as Secretary of State.  Who should the poor voters vote for?  How do we determine who's more corrupt? 

[TechTalk]

The Biden's took money from China and Ukraine for influence peddling VP Biden's position.  And four years ago we had another corrupt official running for president, Hillary Clinton, who influence peddled by selling her position as Secretary of State.

Have any solid evidence of those charges?

[JoeKitchen]

Like I said to you once before, I might enjoy sitting down for a good meal and glass of wine with you because there's a lot more to life than politics. There's a million things to talk about other than politics and many are just as important. We may disagree on nearly everything political, but I respect your integrity on the issue of assaulting the Capitol—putting country above politics.

Thanks! 

[TechTalk]

Thanks! 

No thanks needed. People that love their country and want to see what's best for it can, do, and should have very different opinions that they can argue over vigorously. That's what makes a democracy.

But when it's under attack, we're not very far apart at all.

[JoeKitchen]

What could possibly go wrong.

The Russians could bomb us. 
WW3 could break out. 
A new ice age could start. 
And yes, as you imply, perhaps I could catch C-19 and spread it to that magical land somewhere in Chicago, or between Austin and Dallas, none us of knows about where Covid-19 has yet to spread too.  I would almost certainly still survive, along with nearly everyone else in this magical land. 

Yes, all these things could happen. 

What could also happen during my trip is that democratic leaders finally realize that their lockdown policies are counter-productive and back course.  Whoops-a-daisy, that already happened!  My trip is already paying off in spades!

NY Gov. Cuomo's tone shifts after months of coronavirus lockdowns

"We simply cannot stay closed until the vaccine hits critical mass – the cost is too high," Cuomo said in his address. "We must reopen the economy, but we must do it smartly and safely."

I read a tweet this morning that compared the lockdowns to the end of Vietnam.  Everyone in charge knows they dont work, but are stalling while trying to find a exit strategy that will save face.  I think that is the best observation so far on this nonsense. 

If you really want to know how I feel on all of this, read this post I just added today.  Covid 19 Testing Fiasco

Cheers from Chicago; tasting my first ever mead tonight, and, well, it's interesting to say the least.  Thankfully I have a bottle of Rosé brut as well. 

[Alan Klein]

Have any solid evidence of those charges?

More evidence than you have on Trump. 

[Alan Klein]

The Russians could bomb us. 
WW3 could break out. 
A new ice age could start. 
And yes, as you imply, perhaps I could catch C-19 and spread it to that magical land somewhere in Chicago, or between Austin and Dallas, none us of knows about where Covid-19 has yet to spread too.  I would almost certainly still survive, along with nearly everyone else in this magical land. 

Yes, all these things could happen. 

What could also happen during my trip is that democratic leaders finally realize that their lockdown policies are counter-productive and back course.  Whoops-a-daisy, that already happened!  My trip is already paying off in spades!

NY Gov. Cuomo's tone shifts after months of coronavirus lockdowns

"We simply cannot stay closed until the vaccine hits critical mass – the cost is too high," Cuomo said in his address. "We must reopen the economy, but we must do it smartly and safely."

I read a tweet this morning that compared the lockdowns to the end of Vietnam.  Everyone in charge knows they dont work, but are stalling while trying to find a exit strategy that will save face.  I think that is the best observation so far on this nonsense. 

Cheers from Chicago; tasting my first ever mead tonight, and, well, it's interesting to say the least.  Thankfully I have a bottle of Rosé brut as well. 

Unfortuantely as we have been saying for months, the whole Democrat position was based on politics for the presidential election.  Now that the election is over, the truth about what they really want and/or have to do is coming out.  The fact is they bankrupted the nation for political power.

[TechTalk]

More evidence than you have on Trump. 

A one sentence deflection and a smiley face is pretty weak evidence.

[Alan Klein]

A one sentence deflection and a smiley face is pretty weak evidence.

Well, the Clintons collected 100s of millions from foreign governments and companies into their so-called Clinton Foundation.  Bill was paid millions additionally for his short speeches by these same groups.   Biden's no-show job worth millions wasn't paid because he was a good-looking guy.  What evidence do you have that Trump sold his position to make money?  The fact is, during his time as president, his net worth went down over a billion dollars. 

[JoeKitchen]

There is a complicated thing going on here -- the social media companies argue on one hand that they're not responsible for what their users say, that they're just a means of transmission, but on the other hand, they do take *some* responsibility -- they ban Trump. They have taken a step that, say, Verizon has never taken. If you want to conspire to something illegal on Verizon, they won't stop you or even try to stop you; if the FBI finds out about it, they may get a warrant to listen in on your calls, but Verizon doesn't do anything but comply with the terms of the warrant. Facebook and Twitter have now taken a step beyond that, and on their own responsibility, have begun limiting what Trump can say, banning his use of their means of transmission. By doing that, it seems to be they have asserted not only a responsibility but a right. And if they have the right to do that, it seems to me that they have now abandoned the pretense (which is all it was) of being purely a means of transmission, and are now more the equivalent of a newspaper...and so could be sued for things like libelous statements carried on their electronic pages.

This a rather complicated issue, and the view you outlined is one I support.  With that said, Dan Crenshaw on a recent podcast had a right of center policy nerd Canyon Brimhall talking about Section 230 protections and why they are important. 

We are all understand the need to censor "obscene, lewd, lascivious, filthy, excessively violent, harassing ..." content but the "or otherwise objectionable" content is what is causing all of the issues and allowing for political censorship, even if it is not violent.  Many on the right just want to nix that last phrase, which I was in favor of until I heard this podcast. 

Canyon Brimhall brought up the example of cat-fishing on dating sites, which does not fall into the former of those terms but certainly is otherwise objectionable.  They need to have the right to remove profiles that are cat-fishing, so it really is a nuance problem with lots of pitfalls. 

Ultimately I of the opinion the "otherwise objectionable" needs to stay and that the Supreme Court needs to rule on this.  Thomas has been for months subtlety signaling he wants a case of prominence to be heard and ruled on. 

[chez]

German's Chancelor Merkel finds Twitter's actions, "problematic".
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/germanys-merkel-trumps-twitter-eviction-122940474.html

Parler sues Amazon for kicking it off the internet.  It appears that they are an alternative to Twitter that's more conservative in their approach.
https://www.theverge.com/2021/1/11/22225072/parler-amazon-web-services-lawsuit-antitrust-twitter-capitol-riot-incitement-moderation

No one answered my earlier question.  Why can a small store that makes ice cream cakes be required not to discriminate against who their customers are.  But a large company like Twitter or Amazon can?  Who decides where the lines are drawn?

Well twitter has warned Trumps a few times and Trump crossed the line.

Take that ice cream store. If I walk in on a regular basis and make a commotion, make a mess and be obnoxious...do you think that store owner would put up with me for very long?   

[chez]

Have any solid evidence of those charges?

Hey, we are talking Alan ( just make it up on the fly ) here.

[TechTalk]

Well, the invasion of the capital wasn't some seditious action by a bunch of anarchists.  That's just hype. They were regular Trump supporters complaining about what they thought was an unfair election...

Just regular Trump supporters that constructed a gallows and a noose in front of the Capitol and chanted "Hang Mike Pence!". Regular folks with Zip Tie handcuffs and weapons taking a tour of our nation's Capitol hoping for a meet and greet with an elected representative. They enjoyed their visit, but were a little annoyed at the wait to get in due to having to battle cops and smash out windows to gain access. They do offer thoughts and prayers for the dead and hospitalized.

https://www.gannett-cdn.com/Gallows and Noose at Capitol.JPG

https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/10/Two men carrying plastic restraints during Capitol riot charged by feds

The domestic terrorists that invaded the Capitol did so for specific purposes. They went in to terrorize Congress. They went in to disrupt, delay, or prevent a democratic election of a president from being finalized. Some publicly announced their intentions to do far worse than that days before the riot and violent insurrection occurred.

And... they may not be finished yet. There is a fair likelihood that more violence and bloodshed could occur in the days ahead.

who got carried away.

Oh those crazy rowdy kids!

[TechTalk]

I read a tweet this morning that compared the lockdowns to the end of Vietnam.  Everyone in charge knows they dont work, but are stalling while trying to find a exit strategy that will save face.  I think that is the best observation so far on this nonsense. 

Unlike Vietnam, it isn't face they're trying to save... it's real people's lives.

[JoeKitchen]

Unlike Vietnam, it isn't face they're trying to save... it's real people's lives.

So all those people killed executed after the North took over were not real people trying to be saved? 

Sometimes, you just have to let it go and look at the bigger picture.

Vietnam was a disaster, just like the lock downs.  Leaving Vietnam caused some to loose their lives, but it was net positive, just like forgoing the lockdowns. 

[chez]

So all those people killed executed after the North took over were not real people trying to be saved? 

Sometimes, you just have to let it go and look at the bigger picture.

Vietnam was a disaster, just like the lock downs.  Leaving Vietnam caused some to loose their lives, but it was net positive, just like forgoing the lockdowns.

We'll talk with Sweeden, last year's darling of countries that resisted any lockdowns...now say the fucked up and are putting lockdown measures in place. Oops.

[JoeKitchen]

We'll talk with Sweeden, last year's darling of countries that resisted any lockdowns...now say the fucked up and are putting lockdown measures in place. Oops.

And yet this country (USA) is realizing it was a mistake. 

Let's see, which state has the highest surge?  CA!  Which state has the strictest lockdown?  CA!

Which state is doing the best?  FL!  Which state has the least strict lockdown?  FL! 

Fact is, you cant change human nature.  People will meet up, regardless if in public or away from prying eyes.  If you take away outdoor activity, such as CA has done, and where C19 does not spread, then they will just go inside, where C19 spreads easily. 

The lockdowns are counter productive and causing the increase in spread, at least in areas still warm enough to allow for outdoor activities. 

I know this a far cry from Canada; perhaps you should had the good nature to be born somewhere without extreme cold. 

[chez]

And yet this country (USA) is realizing it was a mistake. 

Let's see, which state has the highest surge?  CA!  Which state has the strictest lockdown?  CA!

Which state is doing the best?  FL!  Which state has the least strict lockdown?  FL! 

Fact is, you cant change human nature.  People will meet up, regardless if in public or away from prying eyes.  If you take away outdoor activity, such as CA has done, and where C19 does not spread, then they will just go inside, where C19 spreads easily. 

The lockdowns are counter productive and causing the increase in spread, at least in areas still warm enough to allow for outdoor activities. 

I know this a far cry from Canada; perhaps you should had the good nature to be born somewhere without extreme cold. 

Yes, when the fearless leader doesn't follow any of the health orders...why should anyone else.

[JoeKitchen]

Hahahaha

Keep on pushing the narrative! 

Hahahaha!

I can taste that brisket that I am risking it for right now.  I'll let you know how good it taste.