Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa

[MattBurt]

Sounds like whataboutism. In any case, Trump's kids were not charged with anything.  Biden's was. What involvement did Joe have?  Did he do anything untoward the Chinese have on him?  Everyone was concerned the Russians had something on Trump.  But with their guy as president, the same posible issue is ignored.  Why?  It's all phony politics.

You brought up the Trump kids to begin with. The reason they are relevant is not whataboutism, they have official roles in the highest office of the federal government.
If they didn't have important roles in government with real consequences for all of us they would be as irrelevant as any other president's kids.

[TechTalk]

Israel and Morocco establish diplomatic relations, the fourth after United Arab Emirates, Bahrain and Sudan groomed by Trump and all handled by his "do-nothing" son-in-law Jarad Kushner.

You have a highly selective and narrow view of events. Who was "grooming" whom?

The UAE is anticipating the purchase of $23 billion in latest-generation U.S. military technology including F-35 stealth multirole combat aircraft and Reaper hunter-killer drones. For the past few decades, Bahrain and the UAE have been actively building toward a post-oil economy focused on international finance, banking, and tourism. Diplomatic relations with Israel removes a hurdle to their long-term goals. They are both longtime military allies of the U.S. and longtime allies of Saudi Arabia in opposing Iran in the Middle East power balance and for their own security concerns.

Sudan is in an entirely different situation. After decades of civil war and authoritarian rule, it is just emerging from both after a revolution last year. Sudan is reliant on international aid and organizations to cope with its current situation. It has a new secular constitution that reflects the major changes that were brought about from their own revolution last year. Sudan wants and needs broad international acceptance and cooperation. Like the UAE and Bahrain, Sudan has never been involved in any military conflicts with Israel.

And as previously pointed out by others, Morocco got—at least for now—a controversial U.S. recognition of Moroccan sovereignty over the entire disputed Western Sahara territory in opposition to the position of our allies and the United Nations. A blow to the Sahrawi people, who have long fought for their independence in Western Sahara and recognized internationally as being illegally occupied by Morocco and who just declared an end to a 29-year truce last month.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/15/world/polisario-front-morocco-western-sahara-ceasefire-intl

https://www.axios.com/trump-morocco-western-sahara-recognition-deal

Each of these countries is improving their relationship with Israel in pursuit of their own self-interest and longterm political, military, or financial goals. The U.S. was a natural broker for these diplomatic deals, but local situations and priorities were the driving force in all of them.

Now that the election is over, CNN seems to be getting up to speed with reporting the real news.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/10/politics/trump-israel-morocco/index.html

I hate to disrupt your delusions, but CNN has reported "real news" for decades now, notwithstanding your blindness to it.

[TechTalk]

The Supreme Court will stay out of it. They have no desire to decide presidential elections or get their own court packed by Democrats.

Desire is irrelevant. The U.S. Supreme Court has no constitutional authority to decide presidential elections; that authority resides in the states.

[Alan Klein]

Desire is irrelevant. The U.S. Supreme Court has no constitutional authority to decide presidential elections; that authority resides in the states.

They got involved in the 2000 presidential election and overruled Florida's supreme court and effectively decided the election.  What I'm saying is they're going to stay out of it this time even if there are constitutional grounds for them to be involved. Chief Justice Roberts is a very cautious man who wants to keep the court out of politics.  He's also afraid of "packing".  So he'll keep the court out of it. 

[faberryman]

Now that the election is over, CNN seems to be getting up to speed with reporting the real news.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/10/politics/trump-israel-morocco/index.html

Not sure what the news is. The FBI has had Hunter’s laptop for a year now, so the assumption is they are looking into something. I guess they are still looking. When they find something I guess they will let us know.

Do you have any specific facts about Hunter Biden and money laundering and tax evasion you would like us to consider?

I am wondering when Giuliani and the New York Post are going to release those videos of Hunter Biden sexually abusing underage Chinese girls. That seems to have fallen off the radar everywhere.

Maybe since Giuliani has been an abject failure at proving that there was any voter fraud, he’ll turn his attention back to Hunter Biden where he doesn’t actually have to prove anything.

[Alan Klein]

When Hunter is a senior advisor to the President I'll be concerned.

What do you suppose those preemptive pardons that are being discussed for the Trump kids are for? Being lawful?

You're being politically selective as is the left-wing press.  But of course, America realizes the press is biased. 

[Alan Klein]

Hey Alan...great to see you watching something other than Fox News...or has Fox News turned on Trump lately?

I've always watched what CNN and MSNBC are saying.  You always want to know what your enemy is up to. 

[Alan Klein]

Since that didn't occur in any state, it's a moot point.

There's no basis for the U.S. Supreme Court to intervene.

The U.S. Constitution gives to the individual states the duty of deciding their own election processes including the contesting of elections. The role of the federal government is extremely limited. What kind of additional federal control of your state's elections would you want?

Given the lack of any basis for the U.S. Supreme Court to intervene, that's a safe bet.

None did so, but each state has a legal process to determine and contest both elections and election processes. Only if federal laws or federal constitutional issues are asserted, would a federal court consider whether or not to hear a case. Given the difficulties of overcoming the issues of standing and justiciability under the political question doctrine, there is little likelihood of a case surviving beyond an initial hearing before being dismissed.

Here's an interesting read about how the Supreme Court got involved in 2000 and it's decisions.  Certainly, similar arguments can be given now for them to get involved.  But like I say, they'll take a pass.

Quote: “At that point, there were actually two key votes,” Hasen says. “The first was a 7-2 determination that the Florida recount, as it was being conducted, was unconstitutional on the grounds that there were no clear standards that were being applied consistently to all ballots. Then, by a 5-4 vote, the court declared that time had run out to devise a remedy. That stopped the process, with Bush ahead.”

The decision resulted in one of the most controversial Supreme Court decisions in American history. With the Florida win, Bush led Gore in electoral votes nationally 271-266, and, out of legal options, Gore conceded.

“The court divided along ideological lines with the conservatives backing Bush, the more conservative candidate, and the liberals backing Gore, the more liberal candidate,” Hasen says. “The case presented difficult questions about court intervention in a process that both sides thought was infected with politics from the opposing side.”
https://www.history.com/news/2000-election-bush-gore-votes-supreme-court

[digitaldog]

You're being politically selective as is the left-wing press.  But of course, America realizes the press is biased.

But of course Alan is speaking for America. He is being politically selective for all America's. Not to be taken seriously again.

[Alan Klein]

You brought up the Trump kids to begin with. The reason they are relevant is not whataboutism, they have official roles in the highest office of the federal government.
If they didn't have important roles in government with real consequences for all of us they would be as irrelevant as any other president's kids.

But the main issue with Hunter isn't Hunter.  It's what involvement if any that Joe Biden had in securing Chinese contracts for his son and did he profit from it or get his son to profit from his position as VP?  The anti-Trump press ignored the issue before the election because they were protecting the VP.  That's the story and my point.  Nothing held the press back from attacking Trump's family.  The press has been acting like politicians rather than journalists. 

[Alan Klein]

You have a highly selective and narrow view of events. Who was "grooming" whom?

The UAE is anticipating the purchase of $23 billion in latest-generation U.S. military technology including F-35 stealth multirole combat aircraft and Reaper hunter-killer drones. For the past few decades, Bahrain and the UAE have been actively building toward a post-oil economy focused on international finance, banking, and tourism. Diplomatic relations with Israel removes a hurdle to their long-term goals. They are both longtime military allies of the U.S. and longtime allies of Saudi Arabia in opposing Iran in the Middle East power balance and for their own security concerns.

Sudan is in an entirely different situation. After decades of civil war and authoritarian rule, it is just emerging from both after a revolution last year. Sudan is reliant on international aid and organizations to cope with its current situation. It has a new secular constitution that reflects the major changes that were brought about from their own revolution last year. Sudan wants and needs broad international acceptance and cooperation. Like the UAE and Bahrain, Sudan has never been involved in any military conflicts with Israel.

And as previously pointed out by others, Morocco got—at least for now—a controversial U.S. recognition of Moroccan sovereignty over the entire disputed Western Sahara territory in opposition to the position of our allies and the United Nations. A blow to the Sahrawi people, who have long fought for their independence in Western Sahara and recognized internationally as being illegally occupied by Morocco and who just declared an end to a 29-year truce last month.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/15/world/polisario-front-morocco-western-sahara-ceasefire-intl

https://www.axios.com/trump-morocco-western-sahara-recognition-deal

Each of these countries is improving their relationship with Israel in pursuit of their own self-interest and longterm political, military, or financial goals. The U.S. was a natural broker for these diplomatic deals, but local situations and priorities were the driving force in all of them.

I hate to disrupt your delusions, but CNN has reported "real news" for decades now, notwithstanding your blindness to it.

Of course, the self-interest of every participant is the payoff for every deal ever made.  Nothing new about that. But the point is four formerly anti-Israeli Arab countries now have diplomatic relations with Israel fostered under the Trump administration.   That hasn't been done in 25 years when Egypt and Jordon made peace with them.  There's now a chance for real peace in the Middle East, at least as far as Israel is concerned.  It also establishes a stronger front against Iran's design for the ME. Would it break your heart to give Trump and Kushner at least some credit?

[Robert Roaldi]

But the main issue with Hunter isn't Hunter.  It's what involvement if any that Joe Biden had in securing Chinese contracts for his son and did he profit from it or get his son to profit from his position as VP?  The anti-Trump press ignored the issue before the election because they were protecting the VP.  That's the story and my point.  Nothing held the press back from attacking Trump's family.  The press has been acting like politicians rather than journalists.

Chinese contracts? I must have missed something, I thought it was about Ukraine.

What do you mean they were protecting him? It was almost never out of the news.

[faberryman]

There's now a chance for real peace in the Middle East, at least as far as Israel is concerned.  It also establishes a stronger front against Iran's design for the ME. Would it break your heart to give Trump and Kushner at least some credit?

Are we talking about the same Morocco. The one in North Africa bordering the Atlantic Ocean?

[chez]

I've always watched what CNN and MSNBC are saying.  You always want to know what your enemy is up to. 

I suggest you cut down on watching so much news. Life is so much better without the squawk box driving propoganda into your head.

[John Camp]

Got up and watched the news this morning, which was probably a mistake.

The Texas lawsuit seems to be so cynical, and so poorly written, I wish that the Supreme Court would do the right thing, and not only refuse to consider it, but to further consider action against the AGs who are bringing the suit. They should be disbarred from federal legal practice, IMHO. The further legal question is whether the Texas AG, who is being investigated for securities fraud, brought the suit in an effort to secure a pardon from Trump. That would be an illegal use of the pardon power, part of an illegal conspiracy that could put both of them in jail. (Trump can pardon any federal crime he wishes, but can't do it as the result of a bribe.)

Everybody is waiting for the FDA's decision on the covid vaccine. The FDA and CDC don't seem to be doing any further investigation, but simply waiting to get together to have the proper meetings. Strikes me as bizarre -- given the urgency, the various commissioners should have been standing in a line outside the meeting rooms, ready to approve it.

A NYT column by a doctor suggests that action be taken against doctors who push (known) incorrect pandemic information because it is seen as medical advice by the public and is therefore unethical.

[faberryman]

What do you mean they were protecting him? It was almost never out of the news.

I followed the Hunter Biden laptop story on Fox News and Breitbart and the New York Post until even they stopped covering it. Now that the voter fraud circus is circling the drain, it’s back in the news for another go. The thing that’s got everybody excited this time around is that some Chinese business guy allegedly gave Hunter Biden a diamond. I think it is called the Pink Panther. Anyway, the query is whether Hunter Biden paid tax on it. I have forgotten where I read about it. There have been so many news articles on Hunter Biden and his taxes in the past couple of days it’s hard to keep up.

[Robert Roaldi]

I followed the Hunter Biden laptop story on Fox News and Breitbart and the New York Post until even they stopped covering it. Now that the voter fraud circus is circling the drain, it’s back in the news for another go. The thing that’s got everybody excited this time around is that some Chinese business guy allegedly gave Hunter Biden a diamond. I think it is called the Pink Panther. Anyway, the query is whether Hunter Biden paid tax on it. I have forgotten where I read about it. There have been so many news articles on Hunter Biden and his taxes in the past couple of days it’s hard to keep up.

Thanks, obviously I am incapable of keeping track. So maybe you can tell me why Alan thinks that the elder Biden might be responsible for any of his adult son's possible misdeeds. Other than Alan's own innuendo, I have never heard any hint of a connection between the two of them to do anything untoward. But I could easily have missed something.

At least the media doesn't blame Don Jr's or Eric's behaviour on their dad, they are very capable of goofing up all on their own.

[faberryman]

Thanks, obviously I am incapable of keeping track. So maybe you can tell me why Alan thinks that the elder Biden might be responsible for any of his adult son's possible misdeeds. Other than Alan's own innuendo, I have never heard any hint of a connection between the two of them to do anything untoward. But I could easily have missed something.

It’s pretty simple. Alan is out for revenge. Since the FBI and DOJ investigated Trump, he wants them to investigate Biden too. Turn about is fair play, and all that. Maybe they could find something, although that is not essential. Alan doesn’t understand that revenge is a dish best served cold.

[faberryman]

Any of our international friends concerned about a no-deal Brexit at the end of the month? Boris is just about out of time, and the EU doesn’t seem all that cooperative.

[jeremyrh]

Any of our international friends concerned about a no-deal Brexit at the end of the month? Boris is just about out of time, and the EU doesn’t seem all that cooperative.

Tnis is the consequence of electing a lying narcissistic charlatan who makes Benny Hill look like an intelectual heavyweight.  The EU's position is quirte clear and consistent - you want to leave, that's fine, but you can't expect to keep the benefits. For the UK, the rich will make out fine but the poor will have to put up with higher prices andc fewer life opportunities.  Americans will be familiar with the general picture, but the USA will be rid of Trump soon, while we will be stuck with the consequences of Brexit for decades.