Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa

[Craig Lamson]

I wouldn't hold my breath on that concession thing.

I have no idea what he will do, but I hope he goes out with dignity. 

[Craig Lamson]

Here is his case: No evidence of wide spread voter fraud. He had a commission created a few years ago to find it (cause he was so sure about it in 2016 but won), it folded because again, no evidence.
Here is his case:
1. Mail in voting is bad and fraudulent; unless the vote is for Trump (he and wife of course voted by mail this year).
2. If in the states he is ahead, keep counting all the votes.
3. If in the states he is behind, stop counting the votes. All those votes (for Biden) are fraudulent.
4. States that allow votes to be collected after election day (and some do), are fraud despite its the law. But in his mind, the losers and suckers in the military who vote by mail in states that allow this, they don't count.
It is absurd and any American who actually buys into this nonsense needs to study how the history of our elections for 240 years has been conducted.

I’m simply amazed you have all of this inside information from the Trump team.  Oh wait, it’s nothing but bluster on your part.  Got it.  Please keep up the amazing work.

[digitaldog]

I’m simply amazed you have all of this inside information from the Trump team.  Oh wait, it’s nothing but bluster on your part.  Got it.  Please keep up the amazing work.

No inside information; Trump has said it in plain sight for months.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Rt6nCZRKChE

[Craig Lamson]

Right...but do your homework with some proof before going on nationwide ( worldwide ) TV and make your accusations. You just look like an idiot spouting at the mouth without anything to back it up.

Again, you have no idea what evidence he has and nor do I.  I suspect once the counting is complete he will proceed.  Until then we wait and see.  Clearly you must have the ability wait and see what happens.

[digitaldog]

I have no idea what he will do, but I hope he goes out with dignity.

What has he done with dignity?
Albert Einstein- "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different result”

[digitaldog]

Again, you have no idea what evidence he has and nor do I.  I suspect once the counting is complete he will proceed.  Until then we wait and see.  Clearly you must have the ability wait and see what happens.

Yes, I've seen what HAS happened. It is easy once you open your eyes.

[faberryman]

But all one needs to do is observed the severe depression amongst Dems right now.  They are not happy by any stretch, which they should be, since it was just about getting rid of Trump, right? 

Out of the roughly 73,500,000 people who voted for Biden, exactly how many have you observed with severe depression?

[Craig Lamson]

Yes, I've seen what HAS happened. It is easy once you open your eyes.

I have seen what has happened as well and in my opinion it’s been an amazing 3.5 years   Take away the virus and we would not be having this conversation   Trump has every right to object and take legal action if he chooses.  You have a problem with this?  After all you side spent 3 years trying to undo an election. 

Why not just sit down, take a deep breath and see what happens as the final vote count and any legal action takes place.

[Craig Lamson]

What has he done with dignity?
Albert Einstein- "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different result”

That’s a good question.  I’m sure I could find some examples if I decided to try.   Let’s be clear here.  I would prefer Trump  to President Harris any day, but I don’t believe Trump will win,  and I haven’t for a few weeks now. But he has his rights and I expect him to fight for them. 

[digitaldog]

Take away the virus and we would not be having this conversation 

We would, but the way he handled the virus (and of course you'll disagree) was awful.
Think about this with an ounce of critical thinking: the US has 4 percent of the worlds population and about 23% of the worlds deaths from Covid. Now look at how say Canada did. Same virus over the entire planet. Now he's the head of the US and we've lost 230 thousand Americans. Remember when he said (after about 13 infections): it's going to disappear and "we have this under control" and recently (a massive lie)" it's rounding the corner" (to examine how many Americans got infected this week). A massive lie. Even after he knew and admitted to Woodword, how deadly it was. And let's not forget, just this month, how many rallies he held, breaking state and local laws for the gathering large groups (this from the law and order president?), exposing those who for whatever reason, love him, to the the virus. Deliberate malpractice.
But I'm not trying to convince you, that's not possible nor useful.
Yes, we'll see what happens, you can (try to) come back here and tell us all the proof he provides and how well his cases go in court. Like the last time he setup a commission on voter fraud.

[digitaldog]

I’m sure I could find some examples if I decided to try. 

"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence."-Carl Sagan
You sir, have none. Enough said, Adiós.

That’s a good question.

"When someone says, That's a good question. You can be sure it's a lot better than the answer you're going to get". -Source Unknown

[faberryman]

You know that story has been discredited, well the SAT one.

I don't know how you would prove it, short of the hired test taker confessing, and even then Trump would just say the guy was lying. I don't know how you would disprove it at all. Maybe that's why you said discredit. I think someone guessed some guy took the test, and that guy denied it. Lying, not lying? Maybe they guessed wrong and it was someone else. Who knows? Who cares?

[Craig Lamson]

We would, but the way he handled the virus (and of course you'll disagree) was awful.
Think about this with an ounce of critical thinking: the US has 4 percent of the worlds population and about 23% of the worlds deaths from Covid. Now look at how say Canada did. Same virus over the entire planet. Now he's the head of the US and we've lost 230 thousand Americans. Remember when he said (after about 13 infections): it's going to disappear and "we have this under control" and recently (a massive lie)" it's rounding the corner" (to examine how many Americans got infected this week). A massive lie. Even after he knew and admitted to Woodword, how deadly it was. And let's not forget, just this month, how many rallies he held, breaking state and local laws for the gathering large groups (this from the law and order president?), exposing those who for whatever reason, love him, to the the virus. Deliberate malpractice.
But I'm not trying to convince you, that's not possible nor useful.
Yes, we'll see what happens, you can (try to) come back here and tell us all the proof he provides and how well his cases go in court. Like the last time he setup a commission on voter fraud.

Much like the issues we have with differing voting rules from state by state because of States Rights, the same situation exists with COVID. 

Over the last few months I’ve laid out my case as to why the US is performing as it is.  I’m not going to repeat it now as it would not change your mind nor would it be helpful.  You believe COVID was poorly handled by Trump I believe Biden will make the overall situation worse, even though like Trump, there is little his position will allow him to do.

Yes Trump was present at a number of large and peaceful protests all over the country.  Nothing really different than the large and  “mostly” peaceful protests that occurred all over the country this year. 

[Craig Lamson]

"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence."-Carl Sagan
You sir, have none. Enough said, Adiós.
"When someone says, That's a good question. You can be sure it's a lot better than the answer you're going to get". -Source Unknown

Bye bye Andrew. SOP

[Robert Roaldi]

I didn't listen to Trump's speech nor could I muster the energy to read the entire article I saw about the speech, but it sounded like he was calling into question the electoral process. Isn't that kind of a serious charge? The thing to consider is, would he be saying that if he had won? I mean, if the electoral process was really flawed, then it would be flawed regardless of who won, wouldn't it? It makes no sense that it be flawed if Biden wins but is perfectly ok if Trump wins. Who would accept that argument as credible?

I see that there are already headlines (https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/524663-mulvaney-says-he-absolutely-expects-trump-to-run-again-in-2024-if-he-loses) about Trump running in 2024, but I didn't read past the headline because I don't care. There was another headline about Don Jr. tearing a strip out of 2024 hopefuls about something (https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/524708-trump-jr-calls-out-2024-gop-hopefuls-for-lack-of-action-amid-vote-counting. I didn't read that one either because I care even less about that. My point is that the US electoral system is one hell of an industry. This election period isn't over yet, and they're already out there marketing the next one.

[digitaldog]

Much like the issues we have with differing voting rules from state by state because of States Rights, the same situation exists with COVID. 

With that 'logic' if I can be so kind, we don't need Trump or anyone in the Federal Government. And it's another lame excuse of Trump for not doing his job, lack of leadership. He doesn't give a shit about any state that isn't in his column, as we are seeing tonight (if it's a state where he's ahead, they are great, if not, they are democratic cheaters).
You have zero excuses to shield Trump from not doing his job, based on the population of this country and the number of dead, compared to the rest of the world. 

[chez]

I didn't listen to Trump's speech nor could I muster the energy to read the entire article I saw about the speech, but it sounded like he was calling into question the electoral process. Isn't that kind of a serious charge? The thing to consider is, would he be saying that if he had won? I mean, if the electoral process was really flawed, then it would be flawed regardless of who won, wouldn't it? It makes no sense that it be flawed if Biden wins but is perfectly ok if Trump wins. Who would accept that argument as credible?

I see that there are already headlines (https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/524663-mulvaney-says-he-absolutely-expects-trump-to-run-again-in-2024-if-he-loses) about Trump running in 2024, but I didn't read past the headline because I don't care. There was another headline about Don Jr. tearing a strip out of 2024 hopefuls about something (https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/524708-trump-jr-calls-out-2024-gop-hopefuls-for-lack-of-action-amid-vote-counting. I didn't read that one either because I care even less about that. My point is that the US electoral system is one hell of an industry. This election period isn't over yet, and they're already out there marketing the next one.

I wonder if Trump will be out of jail by 2024.

[digitaldog]

I didn't listen to Trump's speech nor could I muster the energy to read the entire article I saw about the speech, but it sounded like he was calling into question the electoral process.

Exactly.

Isn't that kind of a serious charge?

We'll see if the republican leaders feel that way or not. Some Americans think it's very serious.

The thing to consider is, would he be saying that if he had won? I mean, if the electoral process was really flawed, then it would be flawed regardless of who won, wouldn't it?

Again, exactly. It's rigged if and only if he loses but not if he wins. He actually said that; no one has to make it up or misinterpret what he actually said.

[Craig Lamson]

With that 'logic' if I can be so kind, we don't need Trump or anyone in the Federal Government. And it's another lame excuse of Trump for not doing his job, lack of leadership. He doesn't give a shit about any state that isn't in his column, as we are seeing tonight (if it's a state where he's ahead, they are great, if not, they are democratic cheaters).
You have zero excuses to shield Trump from not doing his job, based on the population of this country and the number of dead, compared to the rest of the world.

Wow, back again?  The logic is solid because that’s how our system works, like it or not.  This ground has been covered over and over again Andrew, and if you missed it and are not up to speed on the conversations on this forum, that’s your problem, not mine. 

Yea, Trump didn’t “give a shit “ about NY and CA when this pandemic started.  Sheesh.

[James Clark]

So here’s where we are. Conservative batshit radio guy Mark Levin is openly advocating for the PA legislature to disregard the state’s lawfully established method for selecting electors and submit a Trump-supporting slate instead, and Trump Jr is retweeting it. Meanwhile, without offering evidence, the Trumpiest people (think Cruz, Jim Jordan, Lindsey Graham) are going all in on this fraud thing and essentially calling the election illegitimate.  If this starts getting traction, we’ve got problems.