Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa

[Alan Klein]

On another note, I am glad to see that political discussion about Biden is in the realm of whether his policies are sensible or not or whether or not they're working. The usual political argy-bargy, in other words. Makes a change from the daily dose of insanity of the last 4-5 years.

Unfortunately, Trump's policies were attacked because they came from Trump.  Sensible discussions about them were ignored by his critics.  Those policies were never examined on their own.  I don't intend to follow the same process.  If Biden does something right, I'll applaud him.  If he does something wrong, then I'll criticize him.

[Robert Roaldi]

Unfortunately, Trump's policies were attacked because they came from Trump.  Sensible discussions about them were ignored by his critics.  Those policies were never examined on their own.  I don't intend to follow the same process.  If Biden does something right, I'll applaud him.  If he does something wrong, then I'll criticize him.

I know that you believe that, but your attempt to normalize the past 4-5 years is unconvincing. Non-Americans didn't tune into the daily Trump soap opera because they care about the day-to-day of American politics, which is just politics after all, the American version isn't any more interesting than any other kind. They tuned in to watch the unprecedented mass psychosis.

[PeterAit]

And now it is coming out he may be re-engaging in one of the worst foreign policy decisions of the USA with the potential to be the absolute worse of all time, the Iran Nuclear Deal. 

You are showcasing your ignorance yet again. Here are the details of this "horrid" deal; Iran agreed to:

- Reduce the number of centrifuges, which are used to enrich uranium, by two-thirds;
- Cap uranium enrichment at 3.67% for 15 years (must be 90% enriched for a weapon);
- Give up 97 percent of its low-enriched uranium stockpile;
- Halt all uranium enrichment at its underground Fordow facility for at least 15 years;
- Redesign its Arak heavy water reactor so that it will not produce weapons-grade plutonium, ever; and
- Agree not to build any additional heavy water reactors for 15 years.

And all of this was not based on trusting Iran but on a detailed and exhaustive schedule of on-site inspections.

All of our allies and essentially every nuclear weapons/disarmament expert praised the treaty. Yet of course Joe and all the right-wing blathering nincompoops know better, right?

But in their eyes there was a fatal problem with the treaty: it was an Obama accomplishment.

[Alan Klein]

I know that you believe that, but your attempt to normalize the past 4-5 years is unconvincing. Non-Americans didn't tune into the daily Trump soap opera because they care about the day-to-day of American politics, which is just politics after all, the American version isn't any more interesting than any other kind. They tuned in to watch the unprecedented mass psychosis.

Well, you're Canadian.  So I understand why you're upset since Trump cancelled NAFTA trade agreement between our countries.  On the other hand, Biden on his first day in office, cancelled the Canadian XL pipeline.  It seems you can't win. 

[Alan Klein]

You are showcasing your ignorance yet again. Here are the details of this "horrid" deal; Iran agreed to:

- Reduce the number of centrifuges, which are used to enrich uranium, by two-thirds;
- Cap uranium enrichment at 3.67% for 15 years (must be 90% enriched for a weapon);
- Give up 97 percent of its low-enriched uranium stockpile;
- Halt all uranium enrichment at its underground Fordow facility for at least 15 years;
- Redesign its Arak heavy water reactor so that it will not produce weapons-grade plutonium, ever; and
- Agree not to build any additional heavy water reactors for 15 years.

And all of this was not based on trusting Iran but on a detailed and exhaustive schedule of on-site inspections.

All of our allies and essentially every nuclear weapons/disarmament expert praised the treaty. Yet of course Joe and all the right-wing blathering nincompoops know better, right?

But in their eyes there was a fatal problem with the treaty: it was an Obama accomplishment.

First, you;d have to trust the Iranians.  I don't any more than I trusted the Chinese when they promised they wouldn't militarize the South China Sea islands. In Iran, certain nuclear facilities are off-limits to inspection.  You'd have to trust what they tell us.  Sure. 

In addition, the deal allowed Iran to be able to militarize our enemies in the Middle East again and exert pressure on our friends since they were given money and resources from us as part of the deal.  Trump reduced that significantly with trade restrictions and other banking impositions.  If Biden backs off as he apparently will, we'll be back fighting in the Middle East in no time especially because we'll have to protect Saudi oil since we're no longer oil independent due to Biden's partial shutdown of oil in our country.  Biden's setting us up for more fighting in the Middle East.    Haven't you had enough of that yet?

[faberryman]

But in other news, it looks Joe Biden has no idea what the hell he is doing.

So no change from the past four years, except that we don't have an orange face blowhard lying to us about how the virus will magically disappear.

[faberryman]

So, when can we stop wearing masks according to Biden?

I don't know why this matters to you. You have been living your life from now on for what - six or eight months - without a mask. For the rest of us idiots who may or may not be convinced that masks work but don't mind wearing them if it makes others around us safer, whether it is this month or next month doesn't really matter. Whose job is not able to be performed wearing a mask? A birthday clown who can't blow up balloons and make animals out of them?

[Alan Klein]

So no change from the past for years, except that we don't have an orange face blowhard lying to us about how the virus will magically disappear.

Thanks to Trump, and Operation Warp Speed,  almost 60 million vaccinations have been done in America already, far more than any other country.  The rate of vaccinations is more than three times the rate per hundred in the European Union. It's almost five times the rate per hundred people in Canada. 

[Alan Klein]

I don't know why this matters to you. You have been living your life from now on for what - six or eight months - without a mask. For the rest of us idiots who may or may not be convinced that masks work but don't mind wearing them if it makes others around us safer, whether it is this month or next month doesn't really matter. Whose job is not able to be performed wearing a mask? A birthday clown who can't blow up balloons and make animals out of them?

Even bank robbers don't mind wearing them.

[faberryman]

Workers would pay NYS and NYC income taxes as well as federal Social Security and Medicare taxes. Those cannot and were not waived.  What was waived to a certain extent were corporate taxes of different sorts.  That was the argument against Amazon. That the City and State would lose those taxes.  However, by not moving to NYC, NY loses those taxes anyway.   100% of nothing is still nothing.  The state can't tax a company that isn;t there. What the City and State did lose were the 25, 000 jobs, all that new construction, all the associate jobs created by the Amazon Campus, a huge seed of technology growth into NY.  It also would gain from employee taxes and other industry jobs created by the Campus.  It was a win-win for Amazon and NY.

Or, just to cite one adverse consequence, except for the poor low income guys who would get tossed out of their housing when Daddy Warbucks and his gentrification crew came along to tear down or renovate their housing for the money bags new tech employees. Then, the government would have to build some Section 8 housing up next to your 55+ community to take care of them. Is your mind so small you can only hold one side of the argument in it?

[Robert Roaldi]

Well, you're Canadian.  So I understand why you're upset since Trump cancelled NAFTA trade agreement between our countries.  On the other hand, Biden on his first day in office, cancelled the Canadian XL pipeline.  It seems you can't win. 

What am I upset about, I don't understand. Did I say I was upset about something? Seems like you're having a different conversation with someone else.

NAFTA was not cancelled, they gave it a new name, nothing substantial was changed, it was all media grift. Except that every few months Trump would mention tariffs on Cdn aluminum for no reason that anyone could understand.

As for the pipeline, who cares. There are lots of people who don't want it. There are plenty of pipelines around. Nobody is digging up Alberta bitumen when the price of oil is so low anyway. Personally, I think that oil is a strategic resource, and I kind of prefer that it didn't leave our borders. What we saw was that the USA cannot be trusted to honour treaties, that's one lesson that the world learned.

You want to isolate, Alan, as you've said many times. Ok, go ahead, no one is stopping you.

[faberryman]

Unfortunately, the left and Democrats refuse to credit Trump with anything, even if it was the right thing to do.  So they want to reverse everything he did in a knee-jerk reaction, rather than seeing if his policies made sense and then keeping them if they do. I do think that Biden is trying to walking a fine line there.  For example, he seems to maintaining the pressure in the South China Sea.  He's put off changing tariffs on China.  But I agree some of his other reversal policies will just hurt America and make the world more dangerous.

Putting troops back into Germany has told our NATO partners there it's OK to not keep their financial agreements on defense, again shifting more of the military burden and cost to the US.  Sitting down with Iran will put us back where we were and encourage them to be more aggressive in the Middle East and developing nuclear.  You know Biden's going to drop trade restrictions on them.  His shutting down the XL pipeline loses high-paying jobs for Americans just when we need them.  Shutting down fossil fuel exploration and fracking will raise the price of gas at the pump.  It will raise the cost of everything for Americans including food production and other products just at a time when we're broke.  We lost other 800K+ jobs last week. 

He must be getting economic advice from AOC. 

Oh my God, wake me up when it is all over.

[faberryman]

It's Trump's Warp Speed that's getting my wife and me our second Covid shot today.

It was the prince that gave Cinderella the glass slipper.

[faberryman]

We were discussing how AOC hurt the very people she represents for political gain rather than being concerned about their economic well-being.

No, that was what you were discussing with yourself.

[Alan Klein]

Or, jus to cite one adverse consequence, except for the poor low income guys who would get tossed out of their housing when Daddy Warbucks and his gentrification crew came along to tear down or renovate heir housing for the money bags new tech employers. Then, the government would have to build some Section 8 housing up next to your 55+ community to take care of them. Is your mind so small you can only hold one side of the argument in it?

There are already low-income housing in that area.  With loads of people out of work.  An Amazon Campus would open up jobs for these people.  I understand your point.  It's called gentrification.  However, keeping poor neighborhoods are never good for a city.  They disintegrate.  Look what happened to Detroit? Huge areas have been abandoned because there's no industry.

Poor neighborhoods in Brooklyn, minority-owned homes, have gone up so much, many minorities are now rich.  That's what happens when neighborhoods improve.  So your argument is don't add new business and build up poor neighborhoods.  Keep them poor, less employment, into drugs, high crime, and disintegrating.  How does that help anyone?

[Alan Klein]

What am I upset about, I don't understand. Did I say I was upset about something? Seems like you're having a different conversation with someone else.

NAFTA was not cancelled, they gave it a new name, nothing substantial was changed, it was all media grift. Except that every few months Trump would mention tariffs on Cdn aluminum for no reason that anyone could understand.

As for the pipeline, who cares. There are lots of people who don't want it. There are plenty of pipelines around. Nobody is digging up Alberta bitumen when the price of oil is so low anyway. Personally, I think that oil is a strategic resource, and I kind of prefer that it didn't leave our borders. What we saw was that the USA cannot be trusted to honour treaties, that's one lesson that the world learned.

You want to isolate, Alan, as you've said many times. Ok, go ahead, no one is stopping you.

Your PM seems upset the XL pipeline was cancelled.  You lost more jobs because of Biden's decision than Americans did.

[Alan Klein]

Oh my God, wake me up when it is all over.

Again you don't address my points.  Because you can't.

[Alan Klein]

It was the prince that gave Cinderella the glass slipper.

Another cogent response.

[faberryman]

Workers would pay NYS and NYC income taxes as well as federal Social Security and Medicare taxes. Those cannot and were not waived. 

Really? You mean Cuomo and deBlasio can't waive federal taxes? Well, that changes everything.

What was waived to a certain extent were corporate taxes of different sorts.

Were these the taxes that didn't involve money?

That was the argument against Amazon. That the City and State would lose those taxes.  However, by not moving to NYC, NY loses those taxes anyway. 100% of nothing is still nothing.  The state can't tax a company that isn;t there.

Fortunately for Amazon, Bezos figured that out.

What the City and State did lose were the 25, 000 jobs, all that new construction, all the associate jobs created by the Amazon Campus, a huge seed of technology growth into NY.  It also would gain from employee taxes and other industry jobs created by the Campus.  It was a win-win for Amazon and NY.

Perhaps Amazon thought it would be a bigger win on its side of the win-win equation if it relocated to Virginia.

[Craig Lamson]

Nope.  Dragging the undercarriage along the runway does not constitute a landing.

Well, it seems you are now dragging your behind across the carpet, trying to change the narrative.

You are simply a victim of your own poorly written original question.  I knew the second I read it you were going to go ballistic when I posted the correct answer to your question.

Lets review:

OK, next question:

What were the first words uttered from the surface of the moon?

Notice you did not ask, What were the first words uttered after LANDING on the surface of the moon?

Since that was NOT the question, the correct answer to your original was and will continue to be  "contact light", the moment the Lunar Module first touched the surface of the moon.

You are welcome.