Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa

[digitaldog]

Alan frequently makes errors in logic, one of which is reliance on a false premise. In this case, the false premise is that everyone shares his opinion.

+1
His habit of speaking for others or everyone isn't anything new and a request to speak for himself, and that is in frequent error, has been requested multiple time. Such requests always falls on deaf ears. An indication of not much between them. 

[TechTalk]

We could just tell them to go their own way like we did the Philippines and become a nation.

You mean after a long bloody revolt like in the Philippines?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philippine–American_War

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moro_Rebellion

[faberryman]

There you go again with a personal cheap shot.  Why don't you attack the facts I present?  You only seem to know how to call people names.

You did not present any facts; you simply expressed your opinion. In expressing your opinion, you assumed as true the fact that everyone shares your opinion, which is false, and thereby committed the logical fallacy of false assumption.

[TechTalk]

I didn't see you concerned when people here were expressing opinions about me.  Why is that allowed?

My request was about expressing opinions for other people—not about other people. I'm assuming that you are capable of understanding both the difference and the distinction and simply weren't paying much attention when you posted.

[Alan Klein]

You did not present any facts; you simply expressed your opinion. In expressing your opinion, you assumed as true the fact that everyone shares your opinion, which is false, and thereby committed the logical fallacy of false assumption.

When I say "No one really cares about the Puerto Ricans, only about power", that's a figure of speech.  Why are you taking me literally?  I'm referring to most politicians in power.  If they cared about Puerto Rican independence, you would have heard something from them before the 50/50 split in the Senate after the Georgia vote..

I assume it's obvious to most people that's what I meant. Maybe I'm giving you too much credit.  Especially foreigners here who may have problems with American idiomatic expressions.    It reminds me of when Trump said Obama was tapping his phone.  The press took him literally because they wanted to.  They knew as most people who speak American English he meant that Obama was surveilling him, not that Obama was actually listening with earphones.  It's all just game playing.

[TechTalk]

It reminds me of when Trump said Obama was tapping his phone.  The press took him literally because they wanted to.  They knew as most people who speak American English he meant that Obama was surveilling him

It wasn't true regardless of the intended meaning of the words used.

not that Obama was actually listening with earphones.

Uh... yeah. I doubt reporters in the White House press corp had that picture in their minds.

It's all just game playing.

And your game is... ?

[faberryman]

When I say "No one really cares about the Puerto Ricans, only about power", that's a figure of speech.  Why are you taking me literally?  I'm referring to most politicians in power.  If they cared about Puerto Rican independence, you would have heard something from them before the 50/50 split in the Senate after the Georgia vote. I assume it's obvious to most people that's what I meant. Maybe I'm giving you too much credit.  Especially foreigners here who may have problems with American idiomatic expressions.

How are we suppose to know that when you said "no one" you meant "most politicians in power"? Why would you assume that is obvious? Got any factual support for "most politicians in power" don't care about Puerto Ricans? Maybe that's true, maybe it's not. It might turn on what you means by "politicians in power."

It reminds me of when Trump said Obama was tapping his phone.  The press took him literally because they wanted to.  They knew as most people who speak American English he meant that Obama was surveilling him, not that Obama was actually listening with earphones.  It's all just game playing.

Obama wasn't surveilling Trump by wiretap or any other means. The FBI was surveilling Carter Page, one of Trump's so-called foreign policy advisors aka "coffee boys", months after Carter Page left the Trump campaign.

[digitaldog]

When I say "No one really cares about the Puerto Ricans, only about power", that's a figure of speech.

Like so many of your speeches, filled with inaccuracies. It's simply impossible to take you seriously and know when you're kidding, using a 'figure of speech' or or just posting utter rubbish.
That burden is yours. It's why you lack so much respect from others here.

I assume it's obvious to most people that's what I meant.

Yes, you assume. Far, far too often. Stop. Please.

It reminds me of when Trump said Obama was tapping his phone.  The press took him literally because they wanted to.

So like Trump, we should NEVER take you literally; and that's exactly the position you've put yourself into. A writer of fiction, assumptions and not to be taken literally.
"I would like to take you seriously, but to do so would affront your intelligence. -William F. Buckley, Jr.

[Alan Klein]

Got any factual support for "most politicians in power" don't care about Puerto Ricans?

Obama wasn't surveilling Trump. The FBI was surveilling Carter Page, one of Trump's so-called foreign policy advisors aka "coffee boys", months after Carter Page left the Trump campaign.

There you go again with literalism. Members of Trump's campaign were being surveilled.   Trump intuited it correctly and used an idiom saying Obama was "tapping his phone".  It took a while to determine exactly what was going on. Obviously, Obama wasn't in the basement of Trump Tower listening in to Trump's phone calls.

[TechTalk]

I'm referring to most politicians in power.  If they cared about Puerto Rican independence, you would have heard something from them before the 50/50 split in the Senate

We did. Apparently, you weren't paying attention.

[TechTalk]

There you go again with literalism.

Maybe you could sell us decoder rings on the side that translate what you actually mean. Extra income never hurts.

[digitaldog]

Maybe you could sell us decoder rings on the side that translate what you actually mean. Extra income never hurts.

"One never needs their humor as much as when they argue with a fool."
-Chinese Proverb

[faberryman]

There you go again with literalism. Members of Trump's campaign were being surveilled.   Trump intuited it correctly and used an idiom saying Obama was "tapping his phone".  It took a while to determine exactly what was going on. Obviously, Obama wasn't in the basement of Trump Tower listening in to Trump's phone calls.

Which members of Trump's campaign were being surveilled and when were they being surveilled? This should be a softball question for you.

[digitaldog]

Looks like Alan is going to need those extension cords to his nice neighbors for awhile:
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/02/17/generac-ceo-on-meeting-generator-demand.html

Generac CEO says demand for power generators is high: ‘We can’t make them fast enough’
Given the company’s backlog, local permitting processes and the contractors involved, it can take 20 weeks for residents to get a generator installed in their home.

[James Clark]

Mitch McConnell on statehood - 2019: "They plan to make the District of Columbia a state — that would give them two new Democratic senators — Puerto Rico a state, [that] would give them two more new Democratic senators," McConnell said. "This is full bore socialism on the march in the House."

Did he really say that? How is allowing more people to contribute to their self-governance “socialism??”  Is “socialism” just the code word for anything a Republican doesn’t like? Is being gay socialism? Are cats socialism?  What about Hawaiian pizza??? socialism!!!!

[TechTalk]

Did he really say that? How is allowing more people to contribute to their self-governance “socialism??”  Is “socialism” just the code word for anything a Republican doesn’t like? Is being gay socialism? Are cats socialism?  What about Hawaiian pizza??? socialism!!!!

Yes.

https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/mcconnell-appears-to-call-dc-puerto-rico-statehood-socialism-in-fox-news-interview

[Robert Roaldi]

Good thing Trump never acquired Greenland or they'd want statehood too, and you know that all those Scandinavian socialists would vote Dem too. That was a close call, right there.

[Robert Roaldi]

Trump and McConnell seem hellbent on worsening the internecine strife, https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/539298-trump-ready-to-make-mcconnells-life-miserable.

[faberryman]

Is “socialism” just the code word for anything a Republican doesn’t like?

Yes. It is a dog whistle. You can object to the characterization by explaining to the dog whistler what the term socialism actually means in political and economic theory, but you are wasting your time. Even if the dog whistler ultimately concedes that to which he objects is not socialism, he will change his characterization and instead say is the first step on the road to socialism. [cue Willie Nelson here] A good example is calling Bernie Sanders a socialist. Bernie Sanders is not a socialist. Bernie Sanders is a social democrat. But then you have to explain the difference between socialism and democratic socialism and by that time you have lost your audience. My advice is to simply say that whatever the dog whistler objects to as socialism is not socialism to log your objection and move on. It is not possible to have a rational conversation with an irrational person. At least that has been my experience.

[faberryman]

I read that Trump appeared on Fox News, Newsmax, and OAN yesterday to eulogize Rush Limbaugh. I know you will find this hard to believe, but I refrained from tuning in to hear his remarks. Reading about it was bad enough. I actually used to listen to Rush Limbaugh for entertainment whenever I had to go on a road trip for work. When you are out in the middle of nowhere it is impossible to pick up NPR. It was sometimes tricky to find Rush Limbaugh among all the religious stations on the AM band. It used to be you had to turn the knob to change stations. I liked that better. It was a quicker way to find your station. Now you have to push a button which takes you to the next frequency in tiny increments, so it takes about a hundred button pushes to get from one end of the band to the other. Frequently you would arrive at your destination before you got to the end of the band, in which case the entertainment value was in pushing the button. So about the same as listening to Russ Limbaugh. Do you know what Rush Limbaugh will be remembered for? Elevating the term "big fat idiot" to common usage. You never heard that term before Rush Limbaugh came along. You think I am kidding. Before I posted this comment, I googled "big fat idiot" and the first search result was Russ Limbaugh's obituary.