COVID-19 updates

[MattBurt]

I worked with him over a six month time period on the HHS AIDS Drug Parallel Track Task Force in 1990-91 and his only agenda was helping those who were ill with AIDS get expanded access to experimental treatments.

That's the impression I get. I'm glad to have that affirmed.

Sadly his goals are probably too out of line with the administration's to allow him to keep speaking on camera although I hope I'm wrong on that.

[Alan Klein]

Dow Jones Leads Big Market Rally Amid Hopes For $2 Trillion Coronavirus Aid Deal

Trump's plan to re-open the economy I'm sure is  large part of the advance of 1900 points in the Dow Jones average in the NY Stock Exchange.  Sure to affect other markets as well.
https://www.investors.com/market-trend/stock-market-today/dow-jones-surges-1600-points-stocks-rally-coronavirus-stimulus-deal-hopes/

[Alan Klein]

Now I know you're a paid troll.

What's a paid troll?

[Alan Klein]

That's the impression I get. I'm glad to have that affirmed.

Sadly his goals are probably too out of line with the administration's to allow him to keep speaking on camera although I hope I'm wrong on that.

The Administration, all administrations, have to speak with one voice when making policy.  How is the public to know otherwise what the policy is?  Advisor's goals are their goals and not necessarily the country's or the administration.  Their job s are to give advice, just like generals give advice.  After all, generals and advisors are not elected and are not trying to run for re-election.  Trump was and is which makes him more sensitive to the voters.  After all this is a democratic republic run by elected leaders not unelected professors or doctors.   

[Alan Klein]

Same thing in Ontario.

Not to forget that these stores bring lot of taxes to the government coffers.

https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/lcbo-beer-store-cannabis-retailers-to-remain-open-amid-closure-of-all-non-essential-businesses-1.4864781

They could go to a detox or an AA meeting.

[MattBurt]

The Administration, all administrations, have to speak with one voice when making policy.  How is the public to know otherwise what the policy is?  Advisor's goals are their goals and not necessarily the country's or the administration.  Their job s are to give advice, just like generals give advice.  After all, generals and advisors are not elected and are not trying to run for re-election.  Trump was and is which makes him more sensitive to the voters.  After all this is a democratic republic run by elected leaders not unelected professors or doctors.   

I agree it's confusing when they put an expert on to deliver facts and then the president immediately contradicts his own expert. I just don't agree that the answer is silencing the expert.

[Alan Klein]

I agree it's confusing when they put an expert on to deliver facts and then the president immediately contradicts his own expert. I just don't agree that the answer is silencing the expert.

The expert is not the leader.  When you worked for a boss, and gave him advice, and the boss did something different, did you publish an article that explained your point of view?  Or did you accept his authority and implement his plan as best you could?  After all, there are many consideration the boss has to consider that go beyond your or Fauci's responsibility.  The president also has economic experts advising him.  What if the various experts are giving conflicting advice. Whose advice is paramount? Which expert is right?  The president and all leaders have to consider all advice and then make a decision.  His subordinates have to support the president. That's what Fauci has to do.  If he can;t go along with the plan, then he should resign rather than throw stones in the path.  To be clear, I'm not saying he's doing it or will do it. 

[MattBurt]

Yes, Fauci's flaw is he is too truthful, even when the truth doesn't meet the president's #1 goal which is self-preservation.
I think I would do the same in his shoes if I thought it would save lives. Doctors have sworn an oath that should take precedent over loyalty to a politician.

You are right he is in charge and can try to make people loyal over anything else. I just think it's morally wrong and it's going to get a lot of people killed.

Good luck with that.

[armand]

You don't need hospital RN's.  There are tens of thousand of home health care nurses, visiting nurse companies, that could provide people who could actually use a job.  Setting up oxygen and ventilators could be quickly trained.  It's not like they're doing brain operations like surgical nurses. The would triage the work.  If the person just need a ventilator and some help, they stay at home.  Frankly, people are better off staying home then staying in a hospital.  If they really get worse, then they're transferred to a hospital.  WE have to start thinking out of the box.  There are many ways to skin a cat.

You have absolutely no clue what you are talking about. As in zero, nada, nilch. That doesn't seem to stop you though from all this grandiose planning. This is getting ridiculous.

[DP]

I just think it's morally wrong and it's going to get a lot of people killed.

well - no issues with nuking Japan - no issues w/ letting some people die

[Alan Klein]

Now I remember what bothered me about Fauci 30 years ago.  His ego.  It's his way or the highway.

[armand]

Yes, Fauci's flaw is he is too truthful, even when the truth doesn't meet the president's #1 goal which is self-preservation.
I think I would do the same in his shoes if I thought it would save lives. Doctors have sworn an oath that should take precedent over loyalty to a politician.

As a physician your allegiance is towards your patients, not towards your employer. Period.

[Alan Klein]

You have absolutely no clue what you are talking about. As in zero, nada, nilch. That doesn't seem to stop you though from all this grandiose planning. This is getting ridiculous.

All you do is criticize.  At least I'm trying to come up with possible solutions to help the situation.  What ideas have you suggested that are new, different and creative? 

[Alan Klein]

As a physician your allegiance is towards your patients, not towards your employer. Period.

Fauci is a Federal government employee who works for the Executive Branch of government. He reports to President Trump.  He doesn't have patients.  If he wants patients let him quit his $300,000 a year taxpayer job and go into private practice. 

[armand]

All you do is criticize.  At least I'm trying to come up with possible solutions to help the situation.  What ideas have you suggested that are new, different and creative?

I have nothing to offer to you here, you are so far from reality on this subject that there is no bridge I can build for you. If you think you can just get some nurses, get them through a Power Point presentation about vents, just get some vents in people's homes and hook them to oxygen (I wonder from where), and you are solving the crisis you are really clueless. It's nothing wrong with that per se, there are many things we don't know shit about. The problem is that you don't realize you can't know it all and it's ok to not have an opinion and a solution for everything.

And for the record this forum is not the place to come with ideas to change how the crisis is managed in US. What we talk here is worthless for the real world.

[hogloff]

You have absolutely no clue what you are talking about. As in zero, nada, nilch. That doesn't seem to stop you though from all this grandiose planning. This is getting ridiculous.

Past ridiculous long ago. Now it's just dribble flowing.

[armand]

Fauci is a Federal government employee who works for the Executive Branch of government. He reports to President Trump.  He doesn't have patients.  If he wants patients let him quit his $300,000 a year taxpayer job and go into private practice.

He's in that position because he is a physician.

Here is CDC's mission:

As the nation's health protection agency, CDC saves lives and protects people from health threats. To accomplish our mission, CDC conducts critical science and provides health information that protects our nation against expensive and dangerous health threats, and responds when these arise.

His allegiance is towards human life and the science to make it better, not towards anybody political. If Trump's ego cannot take a contradictory opinion he shouldn't be dealing with this.

[hogloff]

The expert is not the leader.  When you worked for a boss, and gave him advice, and the boss did something different, did you publish an article that explained your point of view?  Or did you accept his authority and implement his plan as best you could?  After all, there are many consideration the boss has to consider that go beyond your or Fauci's responsibility.  The president also has economic experts advising him.  What if the various experts are giving conflicting advice. Whose advice is paramount? Which expert is right?  The president and all leaders have to consider all advice and then make a decision.  His subordinates have to support the president. That's what Fauci has to do.  If he can;t go along with the plan, then he should resign rather than throw stones in the path.  To be clear, I'm not saying he's doing it or will do it.

Wrong. If you truly believe in something and you truly think you are right...you fight for it...even if it's fighting your boss. We have people's lives at stake here and the last thing we need is only ass licking people surrounding themselves around a fearless ( clueless ) leader.

[faberryman]

Wrong. If you truly believe in something and you truly think you are right...you fight for it...even if it's fighting your boss. We have people's lives at stake here and the last thing we need is only ass licking people surrounding themselves around a fearless ( clueless ) leader.

Trump said that he wants to reopen the economy by Easter. Easter is three weeks away. A lot can happen in three weeks.

[Robert Roaldi]

Here is another helpful suggestion by the Texas lieutenant governor, https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/03/24/covid-19-texas-official-suggests-elderly-willing-die-economy/2905990001/.

I can just hear some white-haired guy in a Houston bar, "Ok buddy, you first."