How media over-represents 15 times climatosceptiks fake science

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

I just found an article that confirms my concerns that there aren't any good analysis and documentation of the amount we spend and for what regarding the climate.

Try getting reliable information about what the government spends on the military. Huge amounts are budgeted (just in case), nobody knows if the money was actually spent ...

Besides, because the government sucks at bookkeeping, doesn't mean that the problems aren't there, and they are mounting.

[Alan Klein]

When you ask taxpayers to spent 15 trillion on something, you have to be a little more specific.  WHen you start spending that money, you;d better be very specific.  Here's the budget for military spending 2019.  The actualk budget request is a lot more specific
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_budget_of_the_United_States#Budget_request_for_FY2019

Here's the actual government request for 2020 just for purchasing advanced weapon systems.  Just check the detail.  99 pages. This is what we should get regarding investments in climate change.
https://comptroller.defense.gov/Portals/45/Documents/defbudget/fy2020/fy2020_Weapons.pdf

[jeremyrh]

Adding a carbon tax is a tax.  Taxes reduce the money available for capital investment and raising salaries.   So the economy suffers.   

Wrong. Adding a tax obliges buyers to pay the correct price for the commodity including externalities, so that they don't load the cost onto other parts of the economy.

[Alan Klein]

Wrong. Adding a tax obliges buyers to pay the correct price for the commodity including externalities, so that they don't load the cost onto other parts of the economy.

You're chasing your tail. Of course it's government spending that requires government taxation. How else will government pay for their spending? In any case the taxes take money out of the economy so that there's not as much money available for Capital spending and expanding the economy.  Taxes reduce your take home pay.   Companies have less money available to raise your salary. So my point is absolutely correct.   You're one of the few people I know who want higher taxes.  🙄

[jeremyrh]

You're chasing your tail. Of course it's government spending that requires government taxation. How else will government pay for their spending? In any case the taxes take money out of the economy so that there's not as much money available for Capital spending and expanding the economy.  Taxes reduce your take home pay.   Companies have less money available to raise your salary. So my point is absolutely correct.   You're one of the few people I know who want higher taxes.  🙄

Nope - pricing things correctly obliges businesses to make rational decisions, so that the economy does not end up in a sub-optimal state. Non-linear dynamics. Just like climate.

[Alan Klein]

Whatever.

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

Nope - pricing things correctly...

Market prices things correctly, not some climato-maniacs.

[kers]

Market prices things correctly, not some climato-maniacs.

Yes, but then it has to include the cost of the pollution the producing party is causing; Otherwise somebody else has to pay for it- that is -if it is a solvable problem.
If not and dangerous, the production should be stopped.

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

...the production should be stopped..l

Be my guest, stop the production of fossil fuels.

[kers]

Be my guest, stop the production of fossil fuels.

Will happen soon, but not in the States...

[Robert Roaldi]

Market prices things correctly, not some climato-maniacs.

Markets are only efficient and price things properly in textbooks.

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

Markets are only efficient and price things properly in textbooks.

The solution, then: central planning.

They know the right, just, and moral price of everything. It starts with setting the price for this, then that, and then ends with price controls for everything. Followed by wage controls. The benefit? No inflation. In the USSR, prices were so stable, they were etched onto the product. True story, bro.

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

The solution, then: central planning.

No, such Black or White alternatives are only for folks without imagination.
Real-life has shades of gray, at least 50 

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

....Real-life has shades of gray, at least 50 

I expect nothing less from you but an S&M real life

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

Red New Deal

[Alan Klein]

The solution, then: central planning.

They know the right, just, and moral price of everything. It starts with setting the price for this, then that, and then ends with price controls for everything. Followed by wage controls. The benefit? No inflation. In the USSR, prices were so stable, they were etched onto the product. True story, bro.

+1

We had central planning here in the US where I live in New Jersey regarding electric rates.  (Don;t know if this situation exists in other states). The Public Service Commission set rates with some input from the producer.  Customers were stuck with the same single producer and had to pay the same high rates.  Then government figured out to deregulate electricity.  Now I can pick from dozens of suppliers of electricity.  Competition has forced the price of electricity down to much lower than it would have been. 

Similar things are happening with health care for the elderly.  Medicare has one price for everyone; the doctors all get the same amount for specific services.  This has limited patients being unable to use the better doctors who have dropped out and raised medical costs overall just like it was with electricity. 

Another area is rent control for apartments.  It has existed in NYC for decades.  People won't move and keep their rental apartments like they own them passing them on to their children.  This has limited construction and raised the cost of housing in NYC for everyone.  So now California's going to do the same thing although admittedly as of yet not as harsh as NYC.  It will get more despotic as time goes on and politicians want more votes.   More Central Planning.  What stupidity.  People never learn.
https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2019-09-11/california-renters-relief-legislation-gavin-newsom-rent-cap

[Alan Klein]

Red New Deal

I'll give you my steak when you pry it from my cold dead hands. 

[Alan Klein]

The solution, then: central planning.

They know the right, just, and moral price of everything. It starts with setting the price for this, then that, and then ends with price controls for everything. Followed by wage controls. The benefit? No inflation. In the USSR, prices were so stable, they were etched onto the product. True story, bro.

On a separate note.  Central Planning doesn;t cause inflation.  Printing money and borrowing does.  Printing money creates too much money chasing too few goods. That creates black markets where extra money has to be paid under the table to actually get the product.  The product is effectively taken off the shelf.  So  even if government's Central Planning sets a maximum public price that can be charged,  the actual cost is much more.  You probably experienced this when you live in Eastern Europe.

If the government enforces the central planning's low price below true market value by arresting black marketeers, then basically the government winds up subsidizing the price.  That means higher taxes so the people pay for it anyway.  Of course, in America the rich would pick up the tab.  So this method redistributes wealth.  Unfortunately, the rich give up producing as much because it no longer is worth working so hard.  Disrupted markets lower efficiency and production.  Then the economy tanks and everyone suffers, stops eating and starves.  Like what happened in Venezuela.

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

... It starts with setting the price for this, then that, and then ends with price controls for everything...

No sooner than I said that...

[Robert Roaldi]

The solution, then: central planning.

They know the right, just, and moral price of everything. It starts with setting the price for this, then that, and then ends with price controls for everything. Followed by wage controls. The benefit? No inflation. In the USSR, prices were so stable, they were etched onto the product. True story, bro.

Whenever someone points out some issue with market behaviour, the retort from you (and RSL and Alan) is always some childish variation of raising the spectre of central planning or Stalin. I call it the reverse-Godwin. It's silly. I'd like to say that you should know better but that presumes that people are interested in an exchange of ideas, which I have come to understand is not at all the case.

Everyone knows that communist central planning was a terrible failure. Do you think no else noticed? Do you think you're the only one who understands this? You're stuck in the 1930s.