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Author Topic: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa  (Read 1318170 times)

faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5960 on: January 19, 2021, 02:26:52 pm »

Honestly, I think most people here, including Alan, when speaking of a "free market economy" actually mean  a "mostly free market economy" as opposed to a heavily regulated economy. Most rational people realize that a totally free market economy results in a race to the bottom and an economy that would resemble the American South during slavery, with a thin crust of winners and a huge bulk of losers.

Unfortunately, the person with whom you are having the discussion is not always rational.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2021, 02:35:22 pm by faberryman »
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Robert Roaldi

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5961 on: January 19, 2021, 02:44:21 pm »

Amazon sells quite decent Nescafe Instant Cappucino, we used to take in the summer to the lake and prepare it there with just hot water.

https://www.amazon.ca/NESCAFÉ-Gold-Cappuccino-Coffee-Grams/dp/B083L2H8ZY/ref=sr_1_5?dchild=1&gclid=CjwKCAiAo5qABhBdEiwAOtGmbuZAvnlWMiDBFEqmBPhRJ0IMudqr1LxnvcWmwCXb6XjrLWEM-CongRoCRhMQAvD_BwE&hvadid=230026996736&hvdev=c&hvlocphy=9000794&hvnetw=g&hvqmt=e&hvrand=9618740130962705788&hvtargid=kwd-299672033979&hydadcr=24692_10309283&keywords=instant+cappuccino&qid=1611081284&sr=8-5&tag=googcana-20

Thanks. I am happy with the coffee I make at home but going out for cappuccino is more about being entertained by the barista and people watching. And the croissants. Oh well, it will be that much better when the time eventually comes. :)
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James Clark

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5962 on: January 19, 2021, 03:07:46 pm »

Honestly, I think most people here, including Alan, when speaking of a "free market economy" actually mean  a "mostly free market economy" as opposed to a heavily regulated economy.

You'd think so.  And yet, the line between a robust free market economy brimming with unprecedented opportunity, and a communist hellhole that stifles innovation and wantonly steals from job creators is, apparently, something like a 2-3% increase in taxes on income over 600K, and restrictions on dumping slag into mountain streams.  A fine line indeed.   

Most rational people realize that a totally free market economy results in a race to the bottom and an economy that would resemble the American South during slavery, with a thin crust of winners and a huge bulk of losers.

That result is a feature, not a bug.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2021, 03:30:19 pm by James Clark »
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faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5963 on: January 19, 2021, 03:09:45 pm »

I feel like it is New Year's Eve. I am watching the news and they have a clock in the corner counting down the time to the inauguration. I sort of feel like I should go out and get a bottle of champagne. 20:50:41 to go.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5964 on: January 19, 2021, 03:18:52 pm »

Honestly, I think most people here, including Alan, when speaking of a "free market economy" actually mean  a "mostly free market economy" as opposed to a heavily regulated economy. Most rational people realize that a totally free market economy results in a race to the bottom and an economy that would resemble the American South during slavery, with a thin crust of winners and a huge bulk of losers.

But, the people who object to regulation, although they overstate the case in many instances, also have a point. I personally have the simplest of businesses, writing novels which I make up. I don't do extensive travel for research, no assistants, no big deductibles, and yet, I'm plagued by taxes -- not the amount, which I'm reasonably content to pay, but the paperwork. Even with an accountant, I have to spend hours every spring of prep to run a business in which I write a book, and send it in. I have to spend time four times a year working with the accountant to figure out and send in estimated tax payments, because of the way the US government requires the taxes to be paid. My brother once ran a bookstore, and the regulations drove him crazy. When he was approaching the Grand Opening, which was going to be a big pain in the ass no matter what happened, he was told at the last minute by a fire marshal that he couldn't open the store because it lacked signs on the doors which said, "This door must remain unlocked during business hours." Further, such inspections could only be conducted by appointment, and none were available until after the Grand Opening was scheduled -- he couldn't just run out and buy the required signs and put them up. After some more major hassle, he managed to hold the Grand Opening as scheduled, but this is the kind of thing that small businesses run into all the time. I don't know if this is true, but I've been told that in the US, if you employ ten people, you will probably have to designate one person to take care of responses to government regulation. Have you ever been in an elevator and seen a sign that said, "This elevator can't carry more than (some number) of people," and thought, "No way that many people could squeeze in here?" That's the kind of ubiquitous, nonsensical regulation that drives you crazy (not the limit on the number, but the regulation that says you must have the sign and can be penalized for not having it.) Just a few thoughts for people who haven't run businesses. 
Those are my feet in an elevator in Manhattan recently.  What signs?
 

Don't crowd me
by Alan Klein, on Flickr

faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5965 on: January 19, 2021, 03:26:31 pm »

I could be wrong, but I don't remember any farewell extravaganzas for past presidents. I thought they just walked over to the helicopter, climbed aboard, and flew off into the sunset. Looks like Trump has scripted himself red carpet, a 21 gun salute, a marine band, a color guard, a fighter jet fly-over, a cheering crowd, and who knows what else. I hope the press doesn't cover it.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2021, 03:39:53 pm by faberryman »
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TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5966 on: January 19, 2021, 03:52:02 pm »

You could make the argument that with a strategic product like oil, maybe Canada would be better off having our own refining capacity rather than sending the crude to the Gulf coast refineries. It's not clear how Canada benefits by letting them reap the value-added profits.

That's an argument that should be made. There are already refineries there that supply domestic needs which could be expanded. Additionally, the Canadian oil sands sludge being extracted is already being refined onsite into an upgraded synthetic crude oil or Dilbit (diluted bitumen) making it possible to transport thru a pipeline for further refinement.

The Keystone Pipeline already exists and has been built in three phases. The first phase brings Canadian oil sands product to the Wood River Refinery in Illinois. The second phase to tank storage facilities in Oklahoma where American oil is added to the pipeline and the third phase runs from Oklahoma to Texas refineries. Keystone XL is a proposed fourth-phase project to add an extension to the existing pipeline to add additional capacity. The biggest environmental concern is the route it takes over the Nebraska Sandhills region and Ogallala Aquifer, one of the world's largest fresh water reserves. The existing Keystone pipeline has had multiple spills, some in the hundreds of thousands of gallons.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keystone_Pipeline#/media/File:Keystone_XL_-_Ogallala_Aquifer.png

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keystone_Pipeline#/media/File:Keystone-pipeline-route.svg

Keystone is not the only pipeline that brings Canadian oil sands into the U.S. The Enbridge oil sands pipeline is another bringing Canadian oil sands to refineries in Midwestern states. The Enbridge pipeline has already caused major environmental disasters including the largest ever inland oil spill in the United State of 1.7 million gallons from a ruptured pipeline in Grand Rapids, MN. in 1991. A more recent rupture in 2010 spilled in excess of a million gallons into the Kalamazoo River. There have been numerous other smaller leaks and ruptures. Two other pipelines take oil sands product to Illinois' Wood River Refinery and to Washington State.

https://www.nrdc.org/kalamazoo river spill

One basic fact that is often overlooked is that the oil being transported is not conventional crude oil. It is from oil sands (also called: tar sands, crude bitumen, or bituminous sands). It is more expensive and dirtier than conventional oil. It is also harder to cleanup from water supplies (see above Kalamazoo river link) and produces other environmentally toxic by-products.

https://www.nrdc.org/stories/dirty-battle-chicagos-backyards
« Last Edit: January 19, 2021, 04:35:29 pm by TechTalk »
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LesPalenik

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5967 on: January 19, 2021, 03:57:35 pm »

Those are my feet in an elevator in Manhattan recently.  What signs?

Red shoes or some colorful sneakers would look much better in that landscape.
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jeremyrh

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5968 on: January 19, 2021, 04:33:26 pm »

Just for a change, some photography - a podcast about a photographer aovering protests against the construction of the Dakota Access Pipeline.

https://www.photographydaily.show/episodes/standing-rock-story
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PeterAit

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5969 on: January 19, 2021, 05:15:48 pm »

What a fine collection of Trump supporters.

Members Of Right-Wing Militias, Extremist Groups Are Latest Charged In Capitol Siege

https://www.npr.org/2021/01/19/958240531/members-of-right-wing-militias-extremist-groups-are-latest-charged-in-capitol-si

And how about the Trump supporter who stole Pelosi's laptop with the intention of selling it to the Russians? Yet another fine example of America First patriotism.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5970 on: January 19, 2021, 05:25:16 pm »

That's an argument that should be made. There are already refineries there that supply domestic needs which could be expanded. Additionally, the Canadian oil sands sludge being extracted is already being refined onsite into an upgraded synthetic crude oil or Dilbit (diluted bitumen) making it possible to transport thru a pipeline for further refinement.

The Keystone Pipeline already exists and has been built in three phases. The first phase brings Canadian oil sands product to the Wood River Refinery in Illinois. The second phase to tank storage facilities in Oklahoma where American oil is added to the pipeline and the third phase runs from Oklahoma to Texas refineries. Keystone XL is a proposed fourth-phase project to add an extension to the existing pipeline to add additional capacity. The biggest environmental concern is the route it takes over the Nebraska Sandhills region and Ogallala Aquifer, one of the world's largest fresh water reserves. The existing Keystone pipeline has had multiple spills, some in the hundreds of thousands of gallons.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keystone_Pipeline#/media/File:Keystone_XL_-_Ogallala_Aquifer.png

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keystone_Pipeline#/media/File:Keystone-pipeline-route.svg

Keystone is not the only pipeline that brings Canadian oil sands into the U.S. The Enbridge oil sands pipeline is another bringing Canadian oil sands to refineries in Midwestern states. The Enbridge pipeline has already caused major environmental disasters including the largest ever inland oil spill in the United State of 1.7 million gallons from a ruptured pipeline in Grand Rapids, MN. in 1991. A more recent rupture in 2010 spilled in excess of a million gallons into the Kalamazoo River. There have been numerous other smaller leaks and ruptures. Two other pipelines take oil sands product to Illinois' Wood River Refinery and to Washington State.

https://www.nrdc.org/kalamazoo river spill

One basic fact that is often overlooked is that the oil being transported is not conventional crude oil. It is from oil sands (also called: tar sands, crude bitumen, or bituminous sands). It is more expensive and dirtier than conventional oil. It is also harder to cleanup from water supplies (see above Kalamazoo river link) and produces other environmentally toxic by-products.

https://www.nrdc.org/stories/dirty-battle-chicagos-backyards
Pipelines are safer than running oil with train and road tankers.

Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5971 on: January 19, 2021, 05:29:07 pm »

Pipelines are safer than running oil with train and road tankers.
Pipelines also eliminate CO2 in the air and schmutz as trains and trucks run on fossil fuel.  With pipelines, you only need electricity to run the pumps.  Less truck traffic on the roads.  Labor costs are less so it is cheaper for consumers. 

TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5972 on: January 19, 2021, 05:34:22 pm »

Georgia certified today the elections of Warnock and Ossoff to the U.S. Senate changing majority control of the senate to the Democratic Party. Ossoff and Warnock are expected to be sworn in Wednesday by newly inaugurated Vice President Kamala Harris, along with her senate replacement Alex Padilla, in one of her first acts in presiding over the Senate.

Today Mitch McConnell had a noticeably different tone toward Trump and the future of compromise and bipartisanship in the Senate. "The mob was fed lies. They were provoked by the president and other powerful people, and they tried to use fear and violence to stop a specific proceeding ... which they did not like," McConnell said on the Senate floor.

https://www.axios.com/mcconnell capitol riots provoked by trump lies
« Last Edit: January 19, 2021, 06:48:09 pm by TechTalk »
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TechTalk

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5973 on: January 19, 2021, 06:15:05 pm »

Pipelines are safer than running oil with train and road tankers.

That isn't something on which I commented or offered an opinion. There is no safe way to transport oil, pipelines are no exception. They may be safer than other methods, but that depends on the age, maintenance, location, monitoring and inspection, safety technology, effectiveness and enforcement of regulation and oversight, and where a leak or rupture occurs.

My post addressed other considerations like the potential for onsite refining. It also raised an implied question of whether we need to increase the amount of Canadian oil sands that is already being sent to the U.S., thru the many miles of existing pipeline, of a particularly expensive, dirty, and hazardous type of fuel—especially over areas that would be extraordinarily sensitive to a major spill.

It's a complicated set of questions that isn't answered adequately in one sentence. Joe's assertions regarding who has "their heads up their asses" or what group has the "loudest and most uninformed members" doesn't help in answering the legitimate concerns of those that oppose the location and building of the Keystone XL extension either.

https://www.propublica.org/article/pipelines-explained-how-safe-are-americas-2.5-million-miles-of-pipelines
« Last Edit: January 19, 2021, 06:43:56 pm by TechTalk »
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Alan Klein

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5974 on: January 19, 2021, 06:57:44 pm »

Well after constant no openings when trying to reserve an appt., my wife and I are now scheduled for the first vaccine shot Feb 10th here in New Jersey.  If they don't run out.  ;)
It's gotten even better. I was able to get appts for me and my wife for this Friday, Jan 22 for our first shots.  Biden's doing a wonderful job and he isn't even president yet.   ::)

Peter McLennan

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5975 on: January 19, 2021, 09:52:22 pm »

As someone living in PA, she is beyond unqualified;
She has no right being in charge of public health and this is nothing but a lets use her to mark the intersectional check list.

Hey, Joe.  How about an apology to the forum for spreading bullshit?
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kers

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5977 on: January 20, 2021, 06:32:53 am »

So much for 'draining the swamp' - https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/jan/20/trump-pardons-and-commutations-the-full-list

APNews
https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump-ap-top-news-pardons-and-commutations-66c82f25134735e742b2501c118723bb

Quote
Taken together, the actions underscore the president’s willingness, all the way through his four years in the White House, to flex his constitutional powers in ways that defy convention and explicitly aid his friends and supporters.

Quote
“Steve Bannon is getting a pardon from Trump after defrauding Trump’s own supporters into paying for a wall that Trump promised Mexico would pay for,” Democratic Rep. Adam Schiff said on Twitter. “And if that all sounds crazy, that’s because it is. Thank God we have only 12 more hours of this den of thieves.”

Hopefully his last act as a president.
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faberryman

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5978 on: January 20, 2021, 08:36:58 am »

What an odious and despicable excuse for a human being.
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JoeKitchen

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Re: Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa
« Reply #5979 on: January 20, 2021, 08:53:45 am »

If I had had an elderly relative in a nursing home and could have made appropriate arrangements, I would have taken her/him out of a nursing home too.

"Rachel attended Belmont Hill School, Bellmont is an independent school for boys. She later joined Harvard College for her undergraduate studies. In 1983 she graduated from Tulane U, School of Medicine and specializes in pediatric medicine."

"Levine completed her pediatrics training at Mount Sinai Medical Center in New York, where she practiced from 1988 to 1993. She later developed an interest in the intersection of medical, mental and behavioral health issues – such as individuals with bulimia and anorexia. This saw her become the chief of the Division of Adolescent Medicine and Eating Disorders and vice chairwoman for Clinical Affairs for the Department of Pediatrics at Penn State Milton S. Hershey Medical Center."

You can read the rest of her credentials here:

https://itsbiography.com/dr-rachel-levine/

I have no faith in her what so ever.  She has been a failure in PA, albeit not as bad as Cuomo. 
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