Adobe lowers prices on PS Lr cc combo

[mistybreeze]

I just corrected my original post. What I posted was incorrect (our internal FAQ on this was wrong)...(Basically, you have to have had a previous perpetual version of Photoshop CS3 or greater).

Sorry about the confusion.

Good grief, Mike! Does anyone at Adobe know what the hell they are doing?

I realize you're trying to help, Mike, but honestly, I feel like I'm watching an old Abbott and Costello film with these "pre" announcements coming from all corners. And to pour more salt on the wound, I'm still not clear whether those Adobe customers who acquired Photoshop through their CS3, CS4, CS5, or CS6 Web Premium or Design Premium Suites are eligible for this Photoshop Photography Program offer.

I guess there's no rush to figure this mess out. Most of us have grown accustomed to Adobe's lack of talent for smart and thoughtful communication.

[Simon Garrett]

Yes, it does sound confusing.  I'm very grateful to Mike (and Eric) for helping us out, but it's clear that their internal information is a bit confused.  I was also getting contradictory information from those nice people from Mumbai (or wherever) on the online customer support chat. 

No wonder the poor old customers are confused!

I think I understand it, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if I find it's different when the sceme is launched in a couple of weeks.  And I have no idea whether it's a good deal for me personally.  What I want is a return to the scheme a year or so ago, when we could upgrade Photoshop up to 3 past versions, and I could then figure out when Adobe had put enough new stuff into Photoshop to be worth the upgrade.  Now they want my money anyway, and I have to take it on trust that it will be worth it for future upgrades. 

And what, precisely, is the motivation for Adobe to innovate and improve their products when they've already got our money?

[MikeChambers]

Good grief, Mike! Does anyone at Adobe know what the hell they are doing?

I realize you're trying to help, Mike, but honestly, I feel like I'm watching an old Abbott and Costello film with these "pre" announcements coming from all corners. And to pour more salt on the wound, I'm still not clear whether those Adobe customers who acquired Photoshop through their CS3, CS4, CS5, or CS6 Web Premium or Design Premium Suites are eligible for this Photoshop Photography Program offer.

I guess there's no rush to figure this mess out. Most of us have grown accustomed to Adobe's lack of talent for smart and thoughtful communication.

Yes. I am just as frustrated about the complexity of all of this as you are (which is why I am trying to help clarify the info).

If you got PS via a CS3 - 6 suite, you are NOT eligible for this offer. Basically, the offer is for people who have purchased Photoshop by itself in the past.

Hope that helps...

mike chambers

[email protected]

[kers]

Hope that helps..

mike chambers

[email protected]

No it does not help me...; so I bought too much adobe stuff in the past and now have to bleed...?
CS3 , CS5 and CS6.... ( the end)
If i am only interested in photoshop from here on why is this offer not valid for me ?
In CS-past it was only slightly more expensive compared to buying only photoshop... It was how the pricing was done..

and this 9,95 offer ; will it be 9,95 forever?

(Adobe what are you doing? do you know yourself ?)

[mistybreeze]

Basically, the offer is for people who have purchased Photoshop by itself in the past.

mike chambers

[email protected]

Or, in other words, this special offer is for photographers who have spent the least amount of money on Adobe products in the past. Thanks for clarifying, Mike. Way to go Adobe!

Please, Mike, can you do some of us a favor? Tell the powers that be at Adobe thanks for nothing. 

[Wayne Fox]

I think Adobe assumes most that purchased creative suite are more interested in the entire creative cloud because that's the best way to keep all of the applications they purchased with the suite up to date, which seems logical but certainly isn't always the case.  So those who are sort of exceptions to their assumed model end up without what appears to be the same fair options.

Could a suite owner just buy an upgrade to stand alone Photoshop before or once you owned the suite did you have to upgrade the full suite?  Did adobe ever offer "downgrades" like this?  Seems they are just doing things like they always have, suite owners stay with a "suite" option (the full cloud), PS only or PS/LR users different options (single app upgrades or limited cloud).  but I'm not sure how the suite upgrades worked before.

[BernardLanguillier]

Funny... just at the time where I was starting to think that I might just go for it at that price point... I discover that I am not eligible because I bought PS as part of the Creative Suite...

Abode has probably realized that the widespread disgust for CC would result in many photographers downscaling from the Suite to PS+LR only CC offering. Just like me, there are indeed many photographers using InDesign and Dreamweaver very occasionnally who bought into the suite to get our bases covered... but who are not interested in keeping doing this because CC is too expensive.

It is pretty ironic that the fundamental flaws of CC at the level of the Suite will end up killing the efforts to save CC with this new offering for the many photographers owning the suite but using mostly PS...

Cheers,
Bernard

[mistybreeze]

I think Adobe assumes most that purchased creative suite are more interested in the entire creative cloud

I have no way of knowing the numbers, but every NYC photographer that I know bought into the "suite" for 3 reasons: Photoshop for photos, InDesign for PDFs and Direct Mail, and Dreamweaver for website maintenance or self-design. Photographers had no need to learn entire programs or use every program in a Suite. (Who has that kind of time?)  But buying the Suite made financial sense for many small businesses. PhotoExpo has always offered classes to photographers, taught by Adobe employees, to learn a very specific area of each of these programs.

Once you, the photographer, upgraded to Suite (which made Adobe quite happy), you were no longer eligible for individual program upgrades. It was all or nothing. And now, Adobe is once again telling many of its loyal customers, the photographers who purchased Suites, to go f**k themselves. No bone for them.

This sad tale of greed gets more insane by the minute. To make an exciting transition to the Cloud, all Adobe had to do was make the price a no-brainer for small-business photographers. If the price to switch was a no-brainer, this PR disaster never would have taken place, and most everyone would be singing a happy tune.

[Schewe]

Once you, the photographer, upgraded to Suite (which made Adobe quite happy), you were no longer eligible for individual program upgrades. It was all or nothing. And now, Adobe is once again telling many of its loyal customers, the photographers who purchased Suites, to go f**k themselves. No bone for them.

Again, if you got a suite serial number, you owned the suite, not a stand alone Photoshop serial number. This has always been the policy with suites vs point products. Nothing different with the Photoshop CC point product upgrade...this is old news.

[BernardLanguillier]

Again, if you got a suite serial number, you owned the suite, not a stand alone Photoshop serial number. This has always been the policy with suites vs point products. Nothing different with the Photoshop CC point product upgrade...this is old news.

Jeff,

True, Adobe has the right to limit this offer to non CS Photoshop users.

But the move to CC changes the game in such a way that, if they want to please their photographers customers (which is supposed to be the purpose of this CC discount), then it would be reasonnable to also open this offer to CS owners.

Once again, it feels poorly thought out and half baked.

Cheers,
Bernard

[Schewe]

But the move to CC changes the game in such a way that, if they want to please their photographers customers (which is supposed to be the purpose of this CC discount), then it would be reasonnable to also open this offer to CS owners.

Well, YOU might think it changes the game, but I don't. It's the same old suite vs point product license issue.

If you have (or had) a Photoshop CS3 or above point product Photoshop serial number, you are entitled to the $9.95 price. If you gave up the point product serial for a Creative Suite serial, you don't own a Photoshop license.

Simple as that...yes, I realize a lot of people ended up buying Suite versions cause they thought they were getting a "deal". But if all you use is Photoshop and Lightroom, giving up a point product serial number for a suite number was foolish.

Sorry, that's the only way I can look at this...either you've got a license to Photoshop or you've got a license to the Creative Suite. The Photoshop CS3 and above is eligible for the $9.95 prince...Creative Suite users, no...

Sorry if you didn't read the fine print...Caveat emptor.

[CoyoteButtes]

Dang it's great to see Jeff back on the forum.

[BernardLanguillier]

Sorry if you didn't read the fine print...Caveat emptor.

The point I am trying to make Jeff is that a lot of the "listening effort" of Abode ends up not being one at all for those photographers having spent the largest amount of cash on their products.

So the small prints are not relevant in this discussion.

This is not about me not understanding what I signed up for, it is about Abode missing another opportunity to show a minimum amount of friendliness to its faithful long term customers.

Cheers,
Bernard

[mistybreeze]

If you gave up the point product serial for a Creative Suite serial, you don't own a Photoshop license… Simple as that.

Except, it really wasn't that simple. I don't know a single professional photographer who willingly and knowingly "gave up" anything. Many Suite buyers had no clue they lost individual licenses until they went to upgrade one of the programs within the suite. It's not like Adobe did much to forewarn professionals (or anyone else).

For a shady business operation, "Fine Print" can be used to mislead the consumer. In this case, Adobe had no desire to warn professionals that a CS purchase would mean "giving up" individual licenses. Had Adobe been more aggressive announcing that little caveat, they knew the sales numbers might not reach their goal. Deception for the purpose of making more money. "That's the only way I can look at this."

But if all you use is Photoshop and Lightroom, giving up a point product serial number for a suite number was foolish.

Nice try at calling some Adobe customers "foolish." Nice try at playing dumb. You can't be "foolish" unless you have the power to predict the future. Sorry, sweetie, you're not that gifted. Lightoom launched in January 2007. The CS3 Suite launched in March 2007. Only a handful of people were using LR in March 2007, and most of those people got it for free.

You, Jeff, may claim not to be an Adobe sympathizer, but many of us professionals see through your baloney.

[Schewe]

You, Jeff, may claim not to be an Adobe sympathizer, but many of us professionals see through your baloney.

Hum, and this helps the discussion how?

You may not like what I say but to the extent possible, I try to tell the truth as I see it. And in terms of reading the fine print, I always read the fine print...I like to completely understand any licensing agreement I get involved in whether I'm selling a license or buying one. At the time of the Suite license bundles, yes, I think a lot of people thought they were getting a real deal–and they were, but they were trading their point product license in for a Suite license.

Yes, I know many people where shocked that their new suite license had to be upgrades as a suite not as point products...whose fault is that? Partially Adobe because they marketed the suites hard, partly the users because they didn't understand what they were licensing. But this has been the policy since the suites were introduced...if you have a suite license, you don't have a Photoshop specific license. Same deal now for the Photoshop CC/Lightroom bundle. You need a Photoshop CS3 or above license to qualify...

[Robert-Peter Westphal]

[...] You need a Photoshop CS3 or above license to qualify...

Jeff, plays it a role whther you have a retail CS3 at least or an upgrade to any older version ?

Best wishes - and thank you very much for being here and giving us such precious information and clarification about many question !

Robert

[digitaldog]

Except, it really wasn't that simple. I don't know a single professional photographer who willingly and knowingly "gave up" anything. Many Suite buyers had no clue they lost individual licenses until they went to upgrade one of the programs within the suite.

Their fault for not reading the facts presented to them. So yes, it really is that simple. Now if you (or they) don't want to take responsibility for accepting the terms of the license, I guess blaming someone else is the best resort, but it doesn't make the 'ignorance is bliss' mentality any more compelling.

Nice try at calling some Adobe customers "foolish."

The shoe fits quite well.

[mistybreeze]

I always read the fine print

I do, too. If only I could find a college grad these days who has the patience or the interest.

At the time of the Suite license bundles, yes, I think a lot of people thought they were getting a real deal–and they were, but they were trading their point product license in for a Suite license.

Out of curiosity, I dug up my old CS3 Design Premium box/package, and with magnifier in hand, I can't find this "trade" information anywhere on the product packaging. Digging deeper, this information is not offered on the disc's Read Me file. So, to find it, I suppose you needed to read the license policy that is offered at Install that requires users to click "Accept." Of course, every Adobe executive knows no one reads that thing before installing.

Yes, I know many people where shocked that their new suite license had to be upgrades as a suite not as point products

Buyers were "shocked" for a reason. How could this valuable information to the purchaser be missing from the product's marketing? IMO, Adobe could have communicated this information in a more transparent manner. IMO, their customers who were upgrading from a single license DESERVED better customer service.

whose fault is that?

I've been working in advertising for too many years to take the side of corporate. Deceptive advertising for the sake of making more money has become the norm in America, and many consumers suffer as a result. This behavior is not what I call fair practice. I blame Adobe, because they knew most buyers wouldn't realize they were making a "trade." I also blame Adobe for their current public relations nightmare.

I'm not surprised by those who "blame the customer" when deception practice occurs. I simply consider the source.

[Schewe]

Jeff, plays it a role whther you have a retail CS3 at least or an upgrade to any older version ?

Any Photoshop CS3 or above version will work...it doesn't matter if it's an upgrade version.

Even though I've had the Master Suite since CS4, I've also always upgraded my single Photoshop license even if I had the suite. I primarily do that because I need Photoshop on 3 computers (even though I usually only use one at a time). So, even though I've now got the full CC suite, I'm also going to upgrade my single Photoshop CS6 to the Photoshop CC/Lightroom bundle. in the past I've also had a Photoshop Windows license for those times I needed to run Photoshop on Windows. Now with the cross-platform license for CC I don't need to worry about that.

[graeme]

Their fault for not reading the facts presented to them. So yes, it really is that simple. Now if you (or they) don't want to take responsibility for accepting the terms of the license, I guess blaming someone else is the best resort, but it doesn't make the 'ignorance is bliss' mentality any more compelling. The shoe fits quite well.

I must admit it would have caught me out. We bought the Adobe Web Collection ( PS, Illustrator & GoLive ) with our first computer back in March 2000. We bought Photoshop updates but not the other apps. I know that the Creative Suites are a different kind of product but I use to have a feeling that Adobe weren't the kind of outfit that would trip customers up with 'small print' - their products weren't cheap but customer satisfaction seemed important to them. ( And I'm generally pretty cynical regarding corporations & corporate types ).

Graeme