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Author Topic: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now  (Read 75367 times)

Bart_van_der_Wolf

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #100 on: April 11, 2011, 05:13:46 pm »

Not from India yet, but one company is in Hong kong.
www.qualux.com

Interesting. They can only be grateful that X-rite is making such negative press for themselves. The timing is right for Qualux to make inroads into this market.

Cheers,
Bart
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Alan Goldhammer

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #101 on: April 11, 2011, 05:27:05 pm »

Alan, you are forgetting the whole professional photography market and all the pre-press which need colour management solutions. It's not THAT small a market, especially when you cast your net world-wide. How big I don't know, and how big it needs to be to entice challengers facing high entry costs, I don't know either.
I don't know the total number either.  A lot of event photographers (professional by definition) don't print but supply only images to clients and leave printing up to them.  I just took a look at the Qualux website that has been posted as a possible solution.  Interesting that their software is only targeted at McIntosh users.  Price of the pro product is $1199 for the software.  Don't know what the license terms are but it's cool that interface choices are English/Traditional Chinese.
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atlproimaging

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #102 on: April 11, 2011, 05:32:02 pm »

I don't know the total number either.  A lot of event photographers (professional by definition) don't print but supply only images to clients and leave printing up to them.  I just took a look at the Qualux website that has been posted as a possible solution.  Interesting that their software is only targeted at McIntosh users.  Price of the pro product is $1199 for the software.  Don't know what the license terms are but it's cool that interface choices are English/Traditional Chinese.

Their Mac/PC version due to release in about 10 days
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JeffKohn

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #103 on: April 11, 2011, 06:12:52 pm »

The Q-Print solution looks good in paper, and the $575 Q Print-RGB package looks competitive with i1Profiler as far as features/functionality for photographers who don't need CMYK. Of course the question is how good are the profiles.

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Their Mac/PC version due to release in about 10 days
Do you mean Windows/PC? Wonder if they'll have a demo...
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Jeff Kohn
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Ethan_Hansen

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X-Rite alternatives
« Reply #104 on: April 11, 2011, 06:19:06 pm »

There certainly is a market for custom printer profiles. How large is debatable, but it is substantial. The tradeoff for a customer of these services comes down to how much investment is required in purchasing the necessary hardware and software vs. paying a profiling service to build the profiles. For the DIY crowd, at the low end there is the ColorMunki for $400 (with current rebates) that builds reasonably good profiles or the somewhat less capable DataColor Spyder 3 Print for under $250. Either may prove "good enough" if your needs are not overly critical.

Stepping up, we get to the standard X-Rite Eye-One Proof at $1000. This is what many self-described profiling services use. To upgrade to a full-bore profiling solution - i1Profiler - requires another $800 from the basic i1 solution or $500 if you already own more advanced software.

Profiling services run the gamut from guys owning an i1 and simply turning the crank to outfits that have been around for some time and have both a range of equipment and software available and detailed knowledge of how to best make use of it. The first group charges about $10 per profile. The instrument used may be more accurate than a ColorMunki or Spyder 3, but who knows as to whether it is calibrated, etc. There are a few companies that have real experience. My outfit, Dry Creek Photo, has been providing printer profiles for almost a decade, CHROMiX for a year or two longer, and Andrew Rodney's Digital Dog for longer still. You pay more for these folks services, but you benefit their experience making thousands of profiles (I can't speak for the others, but we are closing in on 100000 profiles), and knowledge of how to wring the utmost performance out of your printer. For really high-end work, you can always hire a consultant to work on-sight. Chromix, Andrew, Rods and Cones, and frequent forum poster Scott Martin are all good ones.

So where does that leave X-Rite? They are charging $1000 for a new installation of i1Profiler. The product is not full-featured, and I have many complaints (amply noted in previous posts). At that price point, however, they probably do not want to enable anyone to set up shop as a bespoke profile provider. From my perspective, X-Rite has been sitting on their thumbs for many years. The main innovation of i1Profiler appears to be combining Monaco Profiler's color engine with ProfileMaker's ability to use arbitrary targets and spectral data. Evolutionary but not revolutionary.

Alternatives do exist. Edmund mentioned Argyll. It is a free, open-source product. Profiles made by Argyll are not subject to any restrictions on usage or sale. The profile quality can. particularly for CMYK, be spectacular. There is one serious caveat: using Argyll is not a straightforward process. There are numerous variables, all of which affect profile quality to a large extent. Building a profile is easy, but building a good one with Argyll requires a great deal of experience and repeated tests and trials. BasICColor has also been busy innovating. Their product lineup has many offerings, some of which look pushed to market before they were ready. I have no direct experience with BasICColor's Print software, except as a user of profiles it created. They were certainly respectable, and the product data sheet notes most of the features one wants. I, however, would need to put the software through its paces before giving it an endorsement. I had never heard of  qualux until this afternoon, so no opinions there.

atlproimaging

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #105 on: April 11, 2011, 06:34:19 pm »

The Q-Print solution looks good in paper, and the $575 Q Print-RGB package looks competitive with i1Profiler as far as features/functionality for photographers who don't need CMYK. Of course the question is how good are the profiles.
Do you mean Windows/PC? Wonder if they'll have a demo...

They told me this morning, that Demo can be downloaded in about 10 days.
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aaronchan

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #106 on: April 11, 2011, 10:06:26 pm »

Qualux is a software developed by a team from Hong Kong. This product is fantastic and I have seen the result of it.

atlproimaging

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #107 on: April 11, 2011, 10:19:06 pm »

Qualux is a software developed by a team from Hong Kong. This product is fantastic and I have seen the result of it.
You refering to which of their product, I mean RGB profiles CMYK profiles or a monitor profiles.
Thanks
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aaronchan

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #108 on: April 11, 2011, 11:20:08 pm »

I've test drive the RGB Q-Print product. The perceptual rendering intent is very good. But I haven't try the CMYK with my RIPs yet.

Johnny V

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Re: X-Rite alternatives
« Reply #109 on: April 12, 2011, 11:45:09 am »

.......For the DIY crowd, at the low end there is the ColorMunki for $400 (with current rebates) that builds reasonably good profiles or the somewhat less capable DataColor Spyder 3 Print for under $250. Either may prove "good enough" if your needs are not overly critical.
.......

I think you have that reversed! The DataColor Spyder 3 Print produces much better profiles than the ColorMunki. I've used both.

Getting my Fire Suit on!
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Christopher

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #110 on: April 12, 2011, 07:33:23 pm »

Well here is a very nice story from today. For some it might be funny for others well, decide for yourself.

I spent around 30 minutes today talking with X-Rite in Germany. I wanted to know about the EULA and any additional Licensing. Here is a selection of answers I got:

Person A: What EULA ?
Person B: Where can I find the EULA you are talking about?
Person C: What? I don't know I never read it.
Person D: Does anybody actually read the EULA ? I haven't.

After this I just gave up. Sorry but WTF ? Only ONE Person knew about the EULA and he didn't have a clue about additional licensing or anything.

In the end I really don't care about the EULA. Perhaps it is binding in the US, but in Germany X-Rite would have no real chance with all these changes.
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Christopher Hauser
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feppe

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #111 on: April 12, 2011, 07:58:10 pm »

Well here is a very nice story from today. For some it might be funny for others well, decide for yourself.

I spent around 30 minutes today talking with X-Rite in Germany. I wanted to know about the EULA and any additional Licensing. Here is a selection of answers I got:

Person A: What EULA ?
Person B: Where can I find the EULA you are talking about?
Person C: What? I don't know I never read it.
Person D: Does anybody actually read the EULA ? I haven't.

After this I just gave up. Sorry but WTF ? Only ONE Person knew about the EULA and he didn't have a clue about additional licensing or anything.

In the end I really don't care about the EULA. Perhaps it is binding in the US, but in Germany X-Rite would have no real chance with all these changes.

Good news, everybody: I'm sure the cease and desist from X-Rite sent to those who break the EULA will make the terms abundantly clear :P

And you have a good point: a company can't unilaterally change a contract - there needs to be a meeting of the minds, which incidentally is one of the attacks on EULAs in general.

Scott Martin

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #112 on: April 12, 2011, 10:47:29 pm »

After this I just gave up. Sorry but WTF ? Only ONE Person knew about the EULA and he didn't have a clue about additional licensing or anything.

Only a few people are involved with the EULA and it's undergoing updating as we speak. The final EULA will be effective in all countries. Just stay put until we resolve this and the new EULA is released. No need to jump to conclusions until then.
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Scott Martin
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Greg_E

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #113 on: April 13, 2011, 12:30:47 am »

I haven't checked lately, but I assume Heidelberg still has profile creation software to go with their printers, I was always pretty happy with the CMYK profiles produced by Printopen version 4. The old license did not allow a profiling service, not sure about any more recent products.

I guess I have some questions when I call Xrite tomorrow, maybe I won't be upgrading after all, seems like too many things missing including scanner profiling (yes I still use film) and not too happy about the remote profiling restrictions.
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Mark D Segal

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #114 on: April 13, 2011, 12:41:56 am »

....................
I guess I have some questions when I call Xrite tomorrow, maybe I won't be upgrading after all, seems like too many things missing including scanner profiling (yes I still use film) and not too happy about the remote profiling restrictions.

Depending on what scanners you are using, you can perhaps profile them with SilverFast's Auto IT8 procedure.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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Rhossydd

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #115 on: April 13, 2011, 03:23:20 am »

The final EULA will be effective in all countries. Just stay put until we resolve this and the new EULA is released. No need to jump to conclusions until then.
I don't think this is correct. The EULA will have to conform to local laws. In Europe we have some strong regulation on unfair contracts and the requirement that terms are made clear and plain to the end licensees, I'm not sure the current X-Rite licence and it's implementation would stand rigorous scrutiny.

Again I doubt attempts at restrospective changes to EULAs of previous products could ever be enforced. At it's most simple, just reinstall the software and you have to agree to the EULA built into the installer.

And yes, people DO need to make a fuss about this now and get it changed, or at the very least clarified.

What's curious about this is that these new clauses didn't just fall into this, someone thought about it and got it written into the EULA. Why ? and to what what ends ? it's certainly very unprofessional of them not to know about the changes at the level where their staff are being questioned on it or having a prepared policy for dealing with the new terms.
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Christopher

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #116 on: April 13, 2011, 06:51:08 am »

Well I can't name the person but I was told, X-Rite is working on a new EULA especially for Europe/Germany, because they know quite well that the current EULA is not legally acceptable in Germany.

Perhaps they just thought they could get through without anybody noticing.
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Christopher Hauser
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Bart_van_der_Wolf

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #117 on: April 13, 2011, 08:52:12 am »

Well I can't name the person but I was told, X-Rite is working on a new EULA especially for Europe/Germany, because they know quite well that the current EULA is not legally acceptable in Germany.

Interesting but, since it's not an official X-rite announcement (nor an independent legal appraisal), the status quo remains unacceptable for many. I for one have not purchased a licence although I intended to do so, as a direct consequence of this EULA (in addition to some doubts as to the features (initially?) left out). The suggestion that they are working on a different EULA would be an insult to those who drafted the current version, and to those who okayed it. 

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Perhaps they just thought they could get through without anybody noticing.

In legal matters, I try to assume as little as possible, but I don't preclude arrogant stupidity either.

Cheers,
Bart
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Rhossydd

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #118 on: April 13, 2011, 08:53:27 am »

Perhaps they just thought they could get through without anybody noticing.
That doesn't make any sense. If they want to apply particular terms in their licence hiding it away has no point, they need their licensees to be aware of those particularities and conform to them.
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Greg_E

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Re: New X-Rite i1Profiler software available now
« Reply #119 on: April 13, 2011, 09:45:18 am »

Well... I was given a nice upgrade deal, and I just put it on hold. The clause in the license that says Xrite has permission to remotely connect to my computer at any time can not be allowed! I think someone that bought this needs to send the EULA to the EFF.org and let them have fun with it. Not only is it a privacy issue but it is a security issue. Assuming there is an open port or a phone home that opens a port, there is a way for an exploit to get in. How fast do you think they will patch it when someone exploits this? The answer is not use a good firewall, the answer is to not have it present.

http://www.eff.org/
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