Leaf Aptus-II 12

[bradleygibson]

Yeah, lots of folks (even journalists) have been getting that backwards.   From Leaf's specs it is 1.5 seconds per frame or 0.67fps.

[Guy Mancuso]

Yea we are talking MF here folks not rocket Canons. We don't speak FPS. LOL

[bradleygibson]

 

[yaya]

I don't doubt that was the case.

What was interesting was that despite the obvious poor image quality there was still a positive reaction to them on GetDP1. It seems that folk were seeing what they expected or wanted to see rather than what was actually staring them in the face.

Perhaps I'm missing something here and the folk over on GetDPI were looking at different versions or even the RAW files?

Keith I'm back in UK next week with a working unit if you would like to see it for yourself just let me know. Apologies for my poor photographic skills, I'll try harder next time around

Cheers

yair

ysh@leaf-photography.com

[Dick Roadnight]

Keith I'm back in UK next week with a working unit if you would like to see it for yourself just let me know. Apologies for my poor photographic skills, I'll try harder next time around

Cheers

yair

ysh@leaf-photography.com

That is quick ... last I heard, ¿months? after they started shipping there were two H4D-60 in the UK!

¿Perhaps, when I get my hands on an H4D-60, we can meet up for a comparison shootout?

[AndreasSchmidt]

But.. the 'R' version is also available : "On the Leaf Aptus-II 12R you can change from landscape to portrait orientation with a simple turn of the Leaf Verto internal sensor rotation dial. Enjoy the comfort of keeping the camera upright, rotating just the sensor."

What camera would that be useful for apart from the AFi? (Ok, the Hasselblad V is the only other possibility but I find it hard to believe they designed the R version for the Hass V - it is very unlikely there is any customer using this combination.)

Well, it's also nice on view cameras (without need for turning adapters or remounting) - but I definetely will go there at Photokina tomorrow and ask them about AFI-mount (I just got an AFI-II 7 - OK, I really do not need more nor I have the money, but it would be nice to know that the AFI-platform is supported with new developments in future...). So let's wait and see...

Andreas - [OT]not longer flying to Tallinn, airbase movement area finalized...[/OT]

[adammork]

Dear Yair, or any body else with the knowledges - you have my attention  - maybe it's time to retire my faithful A75.

But, could you please answer this two basic questions - they have beed asked before in this thread, but I can't find the answers:

Long exposure? (it's more than 30 sec'.... right?  - as an AP 60 sec will mean a great deal, clean 60 sec)

The LCD? (it's better than the current one, aptus-II 7... right?...  please tell me so)

Looking forward to give this back a spin.

Very best,
Adam

[yaya]

Dear Yair, or any body else with the knowledges - you have my attention  - maybe it's time to retire my faithful A75.

But, could you please answer this two basic questions - they have beed asked before in this thread, but I can't find the answers:

Long exposure? (it's more than 30 sec'.... right?  - as an AP 60 sec will mean a great deal, clean 60 sec)

The LCD? (it's better than the current one, aptus-II 7... right?...  please tell me so)

Looking forward to give this back a spin.

Very best,
Adam

Hi Adam,

Long exposure performance (32 sec limit) are expected to be similar or a bit better than the Aptus-II 10
The screen is the same screen as in all the other Aptus-II backs

Still worth a spin IMO, I think it will impress you a lot

Best

Yair

[adammork]

Hi Adam,

Long exposure performance (32 sec limit) are expected to be similar or a bit better than the Aptus-II 10
The screen is the same screen as in all the other Aptus-II backs

Still worth a spin IMO, I think it will impress you a lot

Best

Yair

Thanks Yair, that was swift 

I hope it will impress me - I had just hoped for a bit more than just a new censor, however good it might be.

Any chance of getting a demo to Denmark ? yes I know it's Phase an HBlad land.... but I like the Leaf UI a lot - it really deserves a better LCD....

/adam

[dergiman]

i´d like one for the Hy6/AFi.

I guess the people that have Hy6 and Afi-cameras are more eager to spend money for a new back so that the can have the best camera again and to have a wider view with the 40mm lens.

[Guy Mancuso]

I don't doubt that was the case.

What was interesting was that despite the obvious poor image quality there was still a positive reaction to them on GetDP1. It seems that folk were seeing what they expected or wanted to see rather than what was actually staring them in the face.

Perhaps I'm missing something here and the folk over on GetDPI were looking at different versions or even the RAW files?

Keith that is the case i know the settings on the forum because we set them up for certain sizes and if bigger it will compress them down to the limits WE set . If he used a BBC code from the Gallery it would not have been the case and clearly I can prove this go here click on a thumbnail the preview will come up at 1200 pixels wide than click it again and magic it is 3000 pixels wide. Pick a thumbnail and try it http://forum.getdpi.com/gallery/browseimages.php?c=9&userid=  these are test images from the New 55mm LS lens I just bought. Now if you just upload as a attachment which Yair did there isa limit and if bigger it will compress them to the size limit. His crops also seem to appear larger than at 100 percent view. The night shot I agree something maybe off there, have to see this in real test conditions as well.

Next time Yair just let me know and I will personally walk you through the process on how to use the Gallery. BTW thanks for posting them  

[tho_mas]

It seems that folk were seeing what they expected or wanted to see rather than what was actually staring them in the face.
Perhaps I'm missing something here and the folk over on GetDPI were looking at different versions or even the RAW files?

Yair showed me the RAW-files in Leaf Capture at Photokina. There was a still life scene shot with the Aptus II 12 and with the Aptus II 10... so the same scene shot with both the backs. Naturally the Apt.10 is also great but you could clearly see the superiority of the Apt.12... especially regarding moire and color artifacts.
At the moment I am not thinking about an upgrade. So I did not expect anything from the files or hoped to see magic things that are actually not there. The Apt.12 files simply looked great.

[feppe]

Guy, tho_mas, as I said, I don't doubt that the forum compression was at fault. I don't doubt that the Aptus-11 12 is capable of producing stunning results. My issue is with manufacturers and reps hastily uploading files and software that makes matters worse.

The other issue I have is with folk - such as those who commented favourably on the uploads to GetDPI - who, it would seem, see what they expect or want to see rather than what is in front of their face. The images as they appeared on GetDPI were particularly poor and yet the reaction to them was glowing.

Go figure.

That's why all proper scientific studies are done as double-blind studies, and why most discussions about IQ without quantifiable comparisons are largely worthless. Unfortunately double-blinding is difficult, infeasible or impossible when comparing IQ between cameras or systems. Even when quantification has been done (such as DXOMark), they are often dismissed with hand-waving - just look at any discussion about dynamic range.

Result being there's a lot of mis- and disinformation about IQ, and anyone genuinely trying to find out what the differences are get inundated with subjective opinion unsupported by evidence, or worthless views unhinged from reality.

[tho_mas]

Guy, tho_mas, as I said, I don't doubt that the forum compression was at fault. I don't doubt that the Aptus-11 12 is capable of producing stunning results. My issue is with manufacturers and reps hastily uploading files that don't do the products justice.

The other issue I have is with folk - such as those who commented favourably on the uploads to GetDPI - who, it would seem, see what they expect or want to see rather than what is in front of their face. The images as they appeared on GetDPI were particularly poor and yet the reaction to them was glowing.

Go figure.

ah, okay. So I did get you wrong. Apologize!

[Guy Mancuso]

Guy, tho_mas, as I said, I don't doubt that the forum compression was at fault. I don't doubt that the Aptus-11 12 is capable of producing stunning results. My issue is with manufacturers and reps hastily uploading files that don't do the products justice.

The other issue I have is with folk - such as those who commented favourably on the uploads to GetDPI - who, it would seem, see what they expect or want to see rather than what is in front of their face. The images as they appeared on GetDPI were particularly poor and yet the reaction to them was glowing.

Go figure.

I think part of that glowing comments is more to do with how far they are cropped in. Too me they look more like at 200 percent than 100 which does look degraded. I do understand your comment completely. End of day we all know it will produce very well. Questions obviously will be noise , long exposures and the like. I do think we are all smart enough though to understand until we get these things in our hands or someone really sits down to run real tests that they are just nice to see at this point. I think the message is it is real it is here and you can buy one and in the MF world that is worth something than just a announcement and wait a year. LOL

Just one more message and I know folks want the real images and such but I do want to say that Yair, Doug , Steve and a host of other reps and such deserve a lot of credit in the first place being on the forums and helping people and giving us data on there products. This is a very confusing market and I know i spend a lot of my time explaining it on the forums to help people. Each OEM has all kinds of data that needs to get in our hands as users and i know these folks have helped me so I certainly don't want them to stop giving us the data. Where big boys and we know how to sort out the data. It may not be perfect but it is so much better than us guessing. Sorry went OT there but I always like to see what is going on regardless if it is just snapshots. It's all a puzzle and we just need to put all the pieces in place. Thanks

[BJL]

I am having trouble quoting, so
a) I can see how multiple shots at steps of 1/2 pixel width in each direction can increase resolution, but since each pixel still covers the 9 micron pixel size of the sensor, with lots of overlap, so I would expect less resolution than with 88 million photosites on the same sensor area, meaning 4.5 micron pixel spacing. Conversion between pixel counts and resolution get messier and messier!

b) Hassleblad is about to offer 200MP by that counting with an upgrade to its 50MP MS back:
http://www.imaging-resource.com/NEWS/1285307096.html

[Guy Mancuso]

Is this a 5.4 or 5.7 micron sensor. I have not seen that data or I missed it

[tho_mas]

Is this a 5.4 or 5.7 micron sensor. I have not seen that data or I missed it

5.2

[bcooter]

snip . . . . reps and such deserve a lot of credit in the first place being on the forums and helping people and giving us data on there products.

I agree that these people can be of help and two of the three I know pretty well and appreciated their assistance.    Still be VERY realistic that these reps and some of their associates and associated forum owners come on "this" forum to have a presence and aggressively move product and/or services. 

When they post photos to "move" product  they should put their best foot forward.   

Be honest,  if a camera salesman/rep/technician posts a signature of a dozen brand names then it should be pretty obvious what the intent is.

BC

[Guy Mancuso]

I agree that these people can be of help and two of the three I know pretty well and appreciated their assistance.    Still be VERY realistic that these reps and some of their associates and associated forum owners come on "this" forum to have a presence and aggressively move product and/or services. 

When they post photos to "move" product  they should put their best foot forward.   

Be honest,  if a camera salesman/rep/technician posts a signature of a dozen brand names then it should be pretty obvious what the intent is.

BC

Won't see me arguing that. LOL