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Author Topic: canon 5d mk11 in Antarctica  (Read 143772 times)

Christopher Sanderson

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canon 5d mk11 in Antarctica
« Reply #120 on: February 24, 2009, 12:01:33 pm »

Quote from: chrisgibbs
I realize there's a cut-off switch of some kind in and around the hinging mechanism on the card door, could it be so simple as moisture getting in that moving joint *when cards are changed*?

Again possible... but I never had to change cards outdoors. The 8GB CFs were more than enough for each landing.

schrodingerscat

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« Reply #121 on: February 25, 2009, 11:47:18 pm »

Quote from: chrisgibbs
Chris S.

The card door on the 5Dll cuts power to the camera!  Open the card door and *there's a big black hole* that's NOT weather sealed (we're changing cards too, right)!  What's in there, what cuts the camera power, is it mechanical?

I realize there's a cut-off switch of some kind in and around the hinging mechanism on the card door, could it be so simple as moisture getting in that moving joint *when cards are changed*?

Just a thought, Occam's razor being what it is  

Cheers,
Chris Gibbs
http://www.chrisgibbs.com

There's a detect switch for the CF door. A tab on the door closes this when the door is closed. There's also one for the battery door and both cut power when open. This is true for all Canons. There is also a battery detect switch at the bottom of the battery compartment on the mid and high level SLR's. Care is needed if cleaning the battery contacts to make sure this switch isn't damaged. Most Nikons only have the memory door switch.

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schrodingerscat

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« Reply #122 on: February 26, 2009, 12:13:31 am »

Quote from: PierreVandevenne
I've got a somewhat strange, still somewhat uncertain, issue with my 5D MK II as well. Every time I use it with my 24-70L, the lens focus hunts abruptly, a bit as if it was stuck. It always reaches focus, but not smoothly. If I then put the lens on a 5D or 40D right after removing it from the MK II the problem persists but if I put it on a 1DS2, the lens resumes normal, smooth operation. The issue never starts on the 5D, 40D and 1DS2. The lens hasn't been bumped recently. I first thought it was either a coincidence, or the start of an AF motor failure. But I have been able to repeat the process of creating and solving the issue as described above 4-5 times now. The MKII doesn't have any major focus issue with my other lenses... A bit puzzling.


Not that unusual. This stuff has gotten so sophisticated that I think it's bumping into the complexity barrier. If you have a lens that exhibits this sort of behavior, try twisting it back and forth slightly while mounted on the camera. There's usually a bit of play and some play in the circuit contacts between the lens and body. It's just a matter of finding the place where everything is lined up properly. Also clean the contacts on the body and lenses occasionally.

This has nothing to do with design or build qualities. Both the lenses and bodies are cranked out by the thousands, if not millions, and there is always a chance of bringing two together that will not play nice. Especially true with a mix of equipment from different vintages.

Like spots on the sensor, just the nature of the beast. I'm amazed it all works as well as it does, and the more automation we demand the more problems will rear their ugly heads.
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thecyclists

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canon 5d mk11 in Antarctica
« Reply #123 on: August 23, 2009, 12:35:39 pm »

Just wanted to add my experience with the 5D mkII.

I bought it on June 15h and since then I have used it indoor and outdoor in good weather (no rain at all).

On July 22nd a friend of me and I was going to see a stage of the Tour de France. We drove to the finish area and the plan was to go to the last mountain pass to watch the stage. Before we start walking I put the camera with a 16-35 2.8 L II in a plastic bag, since a thunderstorm was heading in our direction. We had some rain showers on our way to the maintain pass. It cleared up when we stopped (2 hours later). I took the camera out of the plastic bag and turned it on. When I took a picture I noticed that something was wrong with the shutter. The display said "Err 30".

I thought about moisture and removed the batteries, the lens and the CF card, but even days after I still got the same error.

When I returned to Norway the camera was sent for service. Several days later I got the message "All electronics had to be changed due to corrosion". I got some pictures of the damage: 5D damages.

I cannot explain why storing a camera in a plastic bag could cause such damages.

BTW 1: I also got an 3 1/2 year old 30D body, which have been exposed to light rain and wet snow several times without any problems. So if the 5D mkII has "improved weather sealing"... I wonder - compared to what? It does not seem to be as good as the 30D.

BTW 2: My 1DmkIII saved my trip to France.
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ihv

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« Reply #124 on: August 23, 2009, 01:34:11 pm »

I have used a 5D (not Mk2) when climbing on the top of Mount-Blanc without any issues.
As there are quite a few reports with Mk2 failures I started to wondering whether those
weather seals are doing any good, this far seems to be opposite.

Quote from: thecyclists
Just wanted to add my experience with the 5D mkII.

I bought it on June 15h and since then I have used it indoor and outdoor in good weather (no rain at all).

On July 22nd a friend of me and I was going to see a stage of the Tour de France. We drove to the finish area and the plan was to go to the last mountain pass to watch the stage. Before we start walking I put the camera with a 16-35 2.8 L II in a plastic bag, since a thunderstorm was heading in our direction. We had some rain showers on our way to the maintain pass. It cleared up when we stopped (2 hours later). I took the camera out of the plastic bag and turned it on. When I took a picture I noticed that something was wrong with the shutter. The display said "Err 30".

I thought about moisture and removed the batteries, the lens and the CF card, but even days after I still got the same error.

When I returned to Norway the camera was sent for service. Several days later I got the message "All electronics had to be changed due to corrosion". I got some pictures of the damage: 5D damages.

I cannot explain why storing a camera in a plastic bag could cause such damages.

BTW 1: I also got an 3 1/2 year old 30D body, which have been exposed to light rain and wet snow several times without any problems. So if the 5D mkII has "improved weather sealing"... I wonder - compared to what? It does not seem to be as good as the 30D.

BTW 2: My 1DmkIII saved my trip to France.
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eleanorbrown

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canon 5d mk11 in Antarctica
« Reply #125 on: August 23, 2009, 02:15:34 pm »

I took my 5D II kayaking in antarctica where it got splashed and wet from lcy water. no problems.  also a few weeks ago here in Colorado I photographed a parade in Fairplay, CO where we stood in rain and sleet most of the parade.  My 5D II got very wet and still had no problems. Eleanor


Quote from: ihv
I have used a 5D (not Mk2) when climbing on the top of Mount-Blanc without any issues.
As there are quite a few reports with Mk2 failures I started to wondering whether those
weather seals are doing any good, this far seems to be opposite.
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ihv

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canon 5d mk11 in Antarctica
« Reply #126 on: August 23, 2009, 03:07:09 pm »

Nice to hear! I hope these bad examples were quality issues and will be/are sorted out.

Quote from: eleanorbrown
I took my 5D II kayaking in antarctica where it got splashed and wet from lcy water. no problems.  also a few weeks ago here in Colorado I photographed a parade in Fairplay, CO where we stood in rain and sleet most of the parade.  My 5D II got very wet and still had no problems. Eleanor
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thecyclists

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canon 5d mk11 in Antarctica
« Reply #127 on: August 23, 2009, 05:43:28 pm »

Quote from: ihv
Nice to hear! I hope these bad examples were quality issues and will be/are sorted out.

Hope so... but I'm stucked with a damaged house that will not be replaced  
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Pelao

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« Reply #128 on: August 24, 2009, 10:21:04 am »

It would be nice to hear from Canon on all of this, but I suspect this is unlikely. Apparently Nikon had an issue with moisture on some D700's around the lcd, and they too were silent (at least to the best of my knowledge).

From all the reports I have read it seems the 5DII can handle direct water and moisture largely OK - but has a problem with condensation. However, that's just my reading.

I really hope they sort this out. This camera is the logical next step for me, but this issue causes concern. This is one of those times when being invested in one brand's glass leaves you in a tough spot.

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uaiomex

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« Reply #129 on: August 24, 2009, 11:15:49 am »

That would explain what happenned to thecyclist's 5D2. When he said "plastic bag" I thought about that. But still... corroded in 3 hours? Maybe it has to be with the electrical current and the different kind of metals.

[quote name='Pelao' date='Aug 24 2009, 09:21 AM' post='305690']

From all the reports I have read it seems the 5DII can handle direct water and moisture largely OK - but has a problem with condensation. However, that's just my reading.

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harlemshooter

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canon 5d mk11 in Antarctica
« Reply #130 on: August 24, 2009, 11:26:05 am »

Approx what range is your serial number?

Just curious.


Quote from: thecyclists
Hope so... but I'm stucked with a damaged house that will not be replaced  
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eronald

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« Reply #131 on: August 24, 2009, 07:31:03 pm »

The images look like a manufacturing issue unless some really corroding stuff got inot the camera which seems unlikely. Water condensation alone cannot cause the corrosion indicated, I believe. Especially one bit is at a spot which should be prtected by varnish. Or lese there is some corrosive stuff inside the camera which can get picked up by condensation.

I'm an engineer, I still design electronics occasionnally, but I'm no expert - maybe an expert can speak here?

Edmund

Quote from: thecyclists
Just wanted to add my experience with the 5D mkII.

I bought it on June 15h and since then I have used it indoor and outdoor in good weather (no rain at all).

On July 22nd a friend of me and I was going to see a stage of the Tour de France. We drove to the finish area and the plan was to go to the last mountain pass to watch the stage. Before we start walking I put the camera with a 16-35 2.8 L II in a plastic bag, since a thunderstorm was heading in our direction. We had some rain showers on our way to the maintain pass. It cleared up when we stopped (2 hours later). I took the camera out of the plastic bag and turned it on. When I took a picture I noticed that something was wrong with the shutter. The display said "Err 30".

I thought about moisture and removed the batteries, the lens and the CF card, but even days after I still got the same error.

When I returned to Norway the camera was sent for service. Several days later I got the message "All electronics had to be changed due to corrosion". I got some pictures of the damage: 5D damages.

I cannot explain why storing a camera in a plastic bag could cause such damages.

BTW 1: I also got an 3 1/2 year old 30D body, which have been exposed to light rain and wet snow several times without any problems. So if the 5D mkII has "improved weather sealing"... I wonder - compared to what? It does not seem to be as good as the 30D.

BTW 2: My 1DmkIII saved my trip to France.
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mrenters

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« Reply #132 on: August 25, 2009, 07:56:05 am »

My 5D2 failed during the Antarctica 2009 trip and still hasn't recovered completely despite having been a guest at Canon Service for 3.5 months of its life. When I first sent it in after the Antarctica trip they replaced the sensor and a PCB. I got it back 2 months later and then I had multiple Err 70 problems with it.  I sent it in again and after a month and a half they sent it back saying that after "extensive testing" they were unable to find anything wrong with it.  This weekend while shooting studio scenes it again had multiple Err 70 problems.

Martin
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eronald

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« Reply #133 on: August 25, 2009, 12:55:48 pm »

I think at this point it is officially a "lemon" and they have to replace it.

Edmund

Quote from: mrenters
My 5D2 failed during the Antarctica 2009 trip and still hasn't recovered completely despite having been a guest at Canon Service for 3.5 months of its life. When I first sent it in after the Antarctica trip they replaced the sensor and a PCB. I got it back 2 months later and then I had multiple Err 70 problems with it.  I sent it in again and after a month and a half they sent it back saying that after "extensive testing" they were unable to find anything wrong with it.  This weekend while shooting studio scenes it again had multiple Err 70 problems.

Martin
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mrenters

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« Reply #134 on: August 25, 2009, 02:02:28 pm »

Quote from: eronald
I think at this point it is officially a "lemon" and they have to replace it.

Edmund

That would be nice, but unfortunately Canon has chosen not to see it that way.

Martin
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thecyclists

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canon 5d mk11 in Antarctica
« Reply #135 on: August 25, 2009, 04:12:01 pm »

Quote from: harlemshooter
Approx what range is your serial number?

Just curious.

The serial number is 8605xxxxxxx

Today I spoked with someone that work with electronics. They use to test printed circuits boards (PCB) in a "salt fog chamber" (not sure about the english word for this). The damages shown on the pictures are even worse that what they have on bad PCBs. The damages to the PCB in the 5D mkII is probably caused due to a bad cleaned PCB (all PCBs must be cleaned after the components has been soldered to the PCB).

It may take some time before Canon contact me. I'll update this thread when I know more.
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uncommondepth

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« Reply #136 on: August 25, 2009, 09:05:06 pm »

You can add my name to the list of 5D MKII owners with a camera failure of this nature. Similar situation - using the camera in rainy weather (no salt water though) with the camera completely covered. Camera was kept dry but failed anyway. Now I'm on day 4 of a 14 day trip and have no camera. I am very pissed off right now! More like furious!

Haven't completely read through all the posts here to see what Canon is doing, but they better be doing more than what I read in the first few pages. A 50% discount on a new camera, or repair without extended warranty is not going to be good enough.

Roberta
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mrenters

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« Reply #137 on: August 25, 2009, 09:19:12 pm »

Quote from: uncommondepth
You can add my name to the list of 5D MKII owners with a camera failure of this nature. Similar situation - using the camera in rainy weather (no salt water though) with the camera completely covered. Camera was kept dry but failed anyway. Now I'm on day 4 of a 14 day trip and have no camera. I am very pissed off right now! More like furious!

Haven't completely read through all the posts here to see what Canon is doing, but they better be doing more than what I read in the first few pages. A 50% discount on a new camera, or repair without extended warranty is not going to be good enough.

Roberta

At least here in Canada, Canon will tell you that water damage is not covered by the warranty so you're basically out of luck.  They made a special exception for our two cameras, probably because it happened on a well documented trip, but when I sent it in for the Err 70 problem the new service manager told me that they should have never fixed it in the first place.  I can understand them denying warranty if someone dunks their camera in a bucket of water, but using it in a light drizzle should not cause these types of failures in a camera advertised as having "improved weather sealing".  They told me I should have used a 1 series camera.

My original 5D has seen similar usage and hasn't had any problems.

It is good to hear that there are other cases like this. Perhaps if enough people are having this problem they'll take it more seriously.

Martin
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Pelao

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« Reply #138 on: August 26, 2009, 07:24:38 am »

Quote from: mrenters
At least here in Canada, Canon will tell you that water damage is not covered by the warranty so you're basically out of luck.  They made a special exception for our two cameras, probably because it happened on a well documented trip, but when I sent it in for the Err 70 problem the new service manager told me that they should have never fixed it in the first place.  I can understand them denying warranty if someone dunks their camera in a bucket of water, but using it in a light drizzle should not cause these types of failures in a camera advertised as having "improved weather sealing".  They told me I should have used a 1 series camera.

My original 5D has seen similar usage and hasn't had any problems.

It is good to hear that there are other cases like this. Perhaps if enough people are having this problem they'll take it more seriously.

Martin

Really sorry to hear of your troubles. Incredibly disappointing both in the performance of the camera and in Canon's response.

All of this really makes me question my next purchase. I prefer to shoot FF. I am happy with my 5D, but it won't last forever and will likely need to be replaced in the next year. It would be somewhat painful financially to purchase a Nikon (I suppose a D700 or it's successor)  due to my lens investment, but I need some tolerance for dampness.  My 5D seems able to handle it. On the other hand, I only have 2 L lenses and should get decent prices for them.

Anyway, I too hope  that enough people bother Canon that they fix your camera.
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DanLehman

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« Reply #139 on: September 06, 2009, 01:03:43 pm »

Quote
Getting them fixed but being without a warranty on a camera ...

Are warranties transferrable to a buyer if you sold the cameras?
If not, then their lack of such would be a non-issue, per se.
.:.  You could get the repair sans warranty, use and (hope-hope) verify
proper functioning (dry, at least!),
and then sell them.
Maybe that cuts your loss?

--------
To the various testimonies:  we must keep in mind that simply "getting the camera wet"
cannot be equated to another's same situation -- who knows exactly how the wetness
goes, whether it reaches the same places, et cetera.  We could all go walk in the woods,
generally, and have various getting or not getting poison ivy or ticks.  It's not as though
for some collection of cameras all were provided with exactly a 2ml drop of water at
THIS position on the shutter and ... .
So, really, the cases of failure I think speak to a (potential) problem,
notwithstanding those that so far have been without.

To mrenters case:  could your (two) prior usage have been at fault for putting
the cameras into a condition that was then aggravated by the Antarctic conditions?
-- that some moisture effects occurred on a prior time but so far had not the
follow-on moisture to aggravate the condition; but on the trip, got that and so
quickly failed?

--------
How quickly can corrosion form?  I'm thinking:  can one get wetness on the Alpe D'Huez
on Monday with no corrosion (or does it come a quickly from current...?), but by the
time one can deliver the camera to Canon repair, next week +, corrosion has set in?
Of course, in the mean time it should have well dried.

Btw, what was that apparent hair/crack?/wire on the white plastic "PUSH" connector?
(of the thecyclists photos of corrosion damage)  >>> IMAGE #1 <<<
-- a crack, or some bit of <?> ?!  It ran across all of the wire ends.


--dl*
====
« Last Edit: September 06, 2009, 01:06:42 pm by DanLehman »
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