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Author Topic: canon 5d mk11 in Antarctica  (Read 143619 times)

soboyle

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canon 5d mk11 in Antarctica
« Reply #100 on: February 15, 2009, 04:29:23 pm »

Quote from: Rickard Hansson
"Dry snow" is never a problem as it has not turned into water.
Bear in mind that my camera was warm when I took it out, so the snow immediately started to melt on contact, I can assure you, it was very wet by the time it went back inside.
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Christopher Sanderson

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« Reply #101 on: February 15, 2009, 05:14:25 pm »

Again speculation, but I have wondered if the extra heat generated by Live View & movie shooting doesn't increase the relative humidity inside the camera which then on cooling leads to condensation...

Ed Bacon

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« Reply #102 on: February 15, 2009, 06:58:33 pm »

I was one of the 6 failures. My camera did recover; mine is in the range of suspect serial numbers, which I reported to Canon Tech Support. My 40D had far greater exposure to the elements than my 5D II. One day I never took the 5D out of the bag, I only changed lenses on the 40D in the field and the 40D often came back on the zodiac completely exposed. Both where used about equally (when functioning), but went through the same regime and care, yet the 40D did not skip a beat.

It snowed last night and I took some photos this morning and noticed my breath condensing on the LCD, should I be worried? ... just kidding.

What I find incredible is how this topic has taken shape on the web and in various forums. The Nikon fan boys use this to trash Canon. The Canon fan boys question the sanity or behavior of we who have failures. Well, 6 out of 25 is not a statistically significant sample of all the 5D Mark II manufactured prior to January. It is significant if you consider the approximately 160 cameras on the trip, or cameras made with ids 032010xxxx (maybe 7,000).

I am going with a bad manufacturing run and not something systemic to the 5D Mark II.
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DavidB

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« Reply #103 on: February 15, 2009, 07:31:19 pm »

I do feel for Martin and the others who had problems on this trip, but I'm still very happy and confident in my 5DmkII (which was on the same trip).  I had no problems.

FWIW, when off the boat I carried my gear in a SlingShot 300AW.  I had a 40D and a 5DmkII, and on shore most of the time one had a 100-400mm lens, the other had a 24-105mm.  I also had a 17-40mm that got used on shore a couple of times.  The bodies were stowed in the bag with the lenses attached.  I did change lenses on shore a couple of times.

On the early landings we had with lots of rain, I was using a single body at a time, with a simple Optech Rainsleeve bag over it.  I did use the cameras uncovered in the rain a couple of times, but only for light rain and wiped the rain off soon or put the bag on (drying the camera first of course).  Some landings I left the SlingShot on the beach, but not when there was rain.  When traversing the ocean in a zodiac, the SlingShot was on its side in a Seal Line WideMouth Duffle between my feet (a waterproof bag which should even float if it goes overboard).  This arrangement allowed me to open the duffle, reach in, open the side of the SlingShot and extract/insert a camera with lens if I was shooting from the zodiac.  I did also have a G9 with UW housing which I used over the side of the zodiacs and for general shooting where water might have been an issue.  I'm sure I missed some opportunities when my SLRs were buried away (and I'll probably operate slightly differently next time ) but overall I'm happy with the result.

I usually also had a small towel inside the duffle.  When on shore the duffle was left with the lifejackets/etc above the beach.  On the early landings where it was steadily raining I used the AW cover over the SlingShot on my back.  The bag did still get damp from the rain running down my back (outside my jacket).  When a camera went into the SlingShot the Rainsleeve was removed.  There was always some moisture inside the sleeve from condensation, even when out in the cold wind for ages.

I was generally impressed by the Kata raincovers, thinking I should have taken one.  I don't know if some people left their raincovers on all the way back onto the ship and into their cabins without drying off the internal moisture?  Lots of similar operational issues were surely factors, as well as any construction issues.

I don't think I "mollycoddled" my cameras, and I think they performed very well.  But then for years I've been using EOS bodies (D30, 10D, 20D, 350D, 30D, 40D) in environments such as the Serengeti, outback Australia, pelagic birding trips (small fishing boats on the open ocean), tropical jungles and mountains in Borneo/Laos, etc and have never had a body failure (apart from a loose connector inside the D30, BG-E2 failures on the 20D [but that was a P.O.S.], an issue with dust around the hotshoe of the 20D blocking use of the internal flash, and one time I dropped the 30D).  Dust, snow, rain, humidity, dew (think star trails), etc.  Maybe it's because I'm lucky.  But the 5DmkII didn't disappoint.

Maybe a manufacturing issue with a batch of cameras was a factor.  Mine has a reasonably different serial number than the failures identified so far.
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bernivd

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« Reply #104 on: February 16, 2009, 06:40:25 am »

just to ad a "no problem" to this topic:
I really badly synchronised my shooting dates with the weather  : Just back from a couple of days shooting in heavy snowfall and temperatures between 0 - -15 C in the swiss alps. From time to time the mk2 got totally covered with snow and was wet all over the place. I didn't take to much care, because I relied on the the extra weather sealing (hadn't read the Antarctica report untill now  ). Made stills and videos.
Care: outdoors I "dried" the camera with my shirt or a little lens cleaning towel, tried to avoid condensation when entering heated buildings.  Sometimes it was hanging uncovered over my shoulder, sometimes sitting in a semiclosed lowepro toploader on the side of my backpack. The camera worked without any problem. And now I'm looking forward to use the camera also in sunny weather   .
Cheers
Bernard
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Jerry Clement

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« Reply #105 on: February 16, 2009, 08:46:08 am »

I have been following along with interest, as I am planning on purchasing a 5D mkII shortly. I was somewhat surprised when I read about the issues with moisture doing a number on the various 5d mkI's on the Antarctia expedition. I am out in the back country of the Alberta Rockies weekly in the past year and at no time have I had issues with my 40d that has taken tumbles (should see the LCD), and been through a lot of rain laiden days with no protection for the camera. It has performed flawlessly and I would have expected the 5d mkII to give at least as good. I would hope it was just a bad batch of 5d mkII bodies and Canon has resolved the problem. We shall see.

Pelao

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« Reply #106 on: February 16, 2009, 12:41:04 pm »

A general comment...

One of the reasons I like the LL forums is the opportunity to learn from experienced photographers. Many of the other forums feature posturing, some hysteria and what seems to be called 'fan-boy' behaviour. Kind of funny / disturbing to read, but utterly useless. When do these people find time to make photographs?

This thread illustrates my point. Generally, the comments are well informed, and so in turn informative. The 5DMK2 is an important camera , but especially so for photographers invested in Canon glass. Some of those posting here have had an intensely irritating experience: a heavy investment in something that did not work as expected. Yet most are reasoning their way through the experience, while others are adding useful suggestions as to what they problem might be.

As someone who is in the exact target market for this camera, I appreciate  everyone taking the time to contribute to the discussion.


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chrisgibbs

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« Reply #107 on: February 16, 2009, 09:21:04 pm »

Quote from: Chrissand
Again speculation, but I have wondered if the extra heat generated by Live View & movie shooting doesn't increase the relative humidity inside the camera which then on cooling leads to condensation...

Makes one wonder Chris!

On a side note; most of us who live and work in cold/wet climates have gotten a feel for the importance of keeping kit *well aired*...........  

I could see your theory about the heat generated by the sensor with live view OR chimping becoming a problem if the kit is kept in a poor environment.  Yet, what constitutes a poor environment (for the 5Dll) has to yet be established!

I'm working with a 5Dll in pretty bad conditions (and on a daily basis) too.  Going in and out of a vehicle/studio, kit is just left in a ThinkTank case, unless I'm shooting or pulling a card etc, no problems to report so far.

On a side note; I'm not chimping (check the first frame/histogram), not using live view (or video) and rarely does the camera sit atop a tripod.  Camera is pulled from the  bag, used, then wiped down with a cloth (that's always kept in pocket so it never freezes) then camera returned to bag and I move on to the next shot.  I've tried, covers, ziplocks etc. but to be honest they always cause as many problems as they solve.

Kind of makes you think, KISS and carry a backup, just like we always did way back when!

Regards,
Chris Gibbs
Alaska

http://www.chrisgibbs.com
« Last Edit: February 16, 2009, 09:24:20 pm by chrisgibbs »
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Christopher Sanderson

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« Reply #108 on: February 17, 2009, 02:00:28 pm »

Quote from: chrisgibbs
Camera is pulled from the  bag, used, then wiped down with a cloth (that's always kept in pocket so it never freezes) then camera returned to bag and I move on to the next shot.
Just what I was doing for those first three days - except I was shooting lots of video.  

chrisgibbs

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« Reply #109 on: February 17, 2009, 05:55:59 pm »

Quote from: Chrissand
Just what I was doing for those first three days - except I was shooting lots of video.  

I suppose the 64,000 dollar question(s) is:

1.  Who had a failure of the 5Dll *AND DIDN'T* shoot video
2.  Any Nikon D90 (daily and main camera) video shooters on the trip

Plekto

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« Reply #110 on: February 18, 2009, 12:28:32 am »

If you're shooting video, it requires you to press and hold the shutter, right?

If there's current flowing through the circuitry, then that would explain it.  Video mode plus marine environment=fail/defect.
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SteveBlack

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« Reply #111 on: February 18, 2009, 01:58:50 pm »

Another 5dm2 user from the trip with no problems.  My shooting summary:

- Used Kata rain cover with any significant rain
     - it did get drops on it from time to time, wiped off with hand / towel
     - but when using a rain cover, didn't seal the bottom of it so there wasn't a risk of condensation due to temperature differential
- Had a battery grip on it the whole time
- Shot quite a bit of video on top of stills
- tried to be cautious moving from outside to inside - but there were really only 2 days where the differential was great enough to cause condensation
- changed lenses frequently, but never when raining

Certainly a surprising number of failures - though thankfully everyone had backups.  I would've been incredibly frustrated if my brand new camera failed and I had to go back to a few year old 40d - especially in conditions that are mild compared to what my 40d has seen!

Great camera, but worrying set of issues from a small sample.

Steve


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canlogic

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« Reply #112 on: February 18, 2009, 02:53:20 pm »

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Bill in WV

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« Reply #113 on: February 19, 2009, 03:32:45 am »

I've been reading the entire thread and found myself wondering about the serial numbers and possible assembly points or different suppliers for different manufacturing runs before the serial numbers were even mentioned. These points also have occurred to me:

I see an awful lot of Canon hardware on the sidelines at NFL games where the weather is at least as bad as these travelers encountered.

Those arguing that this is a camera less able to encounter day to day climatic changes because it is not in the 1Dxx class must be somewhat daft; this 5DII is running $2,700 for the body alone, I'm sorry but in my neighborhood, that is well out of the consumer catagory and it should be well up to professional use standards. Even the  30D, 40D, and 50D are making their professional owners a lot of money.

Chris S., where does your serial number fall in this collection? And did the failed 5DIIs appear to come from any single region? In the thread it seems like a lot of them were from Canada.

I have D60 which I bought used off eBay in 2005 and have to converted to IR, a 30D (which I have managed to drop once without a problem), an Xsi, and a G9. Too many lenses with only one "L" and I'd really like to have a 5DII sometime soon. I'm afraid it may have to wait a year or so but that may be a good thing with all this going on.

One last comment; Moose Peterson in a recent video on Kelby Training says that he always just covers his cameras with a towel until they are up to room temperature. I can see a certain logic in that as it allows the camera to breathe and the condensation to be captured in the towel and evaporated before it gets to the camera. He says it works for him.

Bill in WV
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Christopher Sanderson

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« Reply #114 on: February 19, 2009, 09:54:05 am »

Quote from: Bill in WV
Chris S., where does your serial number fall in this collection? And did the failed 5DIIs appear to come from any single region? In the thread it seems like a lot of them were from Canada.

Here is the link to that thread. I am not certain that anything definitive can be concluded from the serial #s of the cameras that failed.

Wayne Fox

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« Reply #115 on: February 20, 2009, 01:43:52 pm »

Quote from: Plekto
If you're shooting video, it requires you to press and hold the shutter, right?

If there's current flowing through the circuitry, then that would explain it.  Video mode plus marine environment=fail/defect.

No. You press the button on the back inside the adjustment dial to start video capture.  You press again to stop. The shutter release takes a still image if pressed during video capture.

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Plekto

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« Reply #116 on: February 20, 2009, 05:37:23 pm »

Thanks for clarifying that.  So it appears as if it's just a design problem.
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PierreVandevenne

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« Reply #117 on: February 20, 2009, 06:37:56 pm »

I've got a somewhat strange, still somewhat uncertain, issue with my 5D MK II as well. Every time I use it with my 24-70L, the lens focus hunts abruptly, a bit as if it was stuck. It always reaches focus, but not smoothly. If I then put the lens on a 5D or 40D right after removing it from the MK II the problem persists but if I put it on a 1DS2, the lens resumes normal, smooth operation. The issue never starts on the 5D, 40D and 1DS2. The lens hasn't been bumped recently. I first thought it was either a coincidence, or the start of an AF motor failure. But I have been able to repeat the process of creating and solving the issue as described above 4-5 times now. The MKII doesn't have any major focus issue with my other lenses... A bit puzzling.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2009, 06:39:12 pm by PierreVandevenne »
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chrisgibbs

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« Reply #118 on: February 22, 2009, 03:51:46 pm »

Quote from: Chrissand
Here is the link to that thread. I am not certain that anything definitive can be concluded from the serial #s of the cameras that failed.

Chris S.

The card door on the 5Dll cuts power to the camera!  Open the card door and *there's a big black hole* that's NOT weather sealed (we're changing cards too, right)!  What's in there, what cuts the camera power, is it mechanical?

I realize there's a cut-off switch of some kind in and around the hinging mechanism on the card door, could it be so simple as moisture getting in that moving joint *when cards are changed*?

Just a thought, Occam's razor being what it is  

Cheers,
Chris Gibbs
http://www.chrisgibbs.com

acktdi

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« Reply #119 on: February 23, 2009, 06:21:58 pm »

I just returned from Antarctica on the Quark ship Lyubov Orlova, it was the 12 day Classic Antarctica trip.  I brought a 5dm2, 40d, 100-400, 17-40, 70-200f2.8l, 580exii.  We had light drizzle on the way there, through the Drake Passage.  It was sunny the rest of the time, temps between 25-45F.  I shot while on the zodiac and didn't take any precautions about salt spray other than wiping it off from time to time.

I would usually leave my camera in my bag after an outdoor shoot to let it stabilize in temperature, but there were times where I went directly inside and opened up the battery and CF door.  I only had 1 glitch, where the camera stopped responding - I had to reseat the battery, it was after taking 9000 continuous shots for a time lapse, using the canon remote timer.

I even dropped the 5dm2 with 100-400 attached from a height of 4ft onto the metal deck of the ship when I forgot to tighten the tripod quick release knob of my acratech ballhead.  It bounced a couple times, left a scuff on the lens hood and corner of the camera but was still 100% functional.

My cabin mate also had a 5dm2, his camera became unresponsive after recording a movie.  When he reseated the battery, the movie file was missing but no other issues were encountered.

Alvin
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« Last Edit: February 23, 2009, 06:24:06 pm by acktdi »
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