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Author Topic: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine  (Read 33193 times)

Manoli

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1360 on: April 22, 2021, 05:15:22 am »

... perhaps it would have been fair to quote the reason for such a post? Namely, what in Jeremy’s earlier posts prompted Alan to say what he said. Which, to me, without seeing Jeremy’s arguments, sounds like an inference or conjecture, a reaction to the claim that certain state voting laws are designed to limit voting rights by requiring an ID. If so, Alan’s position shouldn’t be seen as  personally offensive to Jeremy ...

If you feel the need to comment, it would be best to have read the relevant posts first.

You, inadvertently, hit the nail on the head when you say ‘inference or conjecture’. Alan is, free to  infer as he in his wisdom thinks. What he is NOT free to do is to transpose his inference then falsely and perniciously attribute them to others - in this case Jeremy.

IF Alan had said  'I infer from your post ...' it would have been but another 'Alan' post. He did not. What he wrote and subsequently refused to retract or at the very least amend was:

So you think Black Americans are ignorant.  That they're still picking cotton and don't know how to get an ID when ID's are required to get into an office or public building, drive, have a bank account,  or to get welfare or food stamps if they're poor.  Maybe we should stick black people's thumbs into purple ink after they vote as they did in Iraq to prevent double-voting since they're incapable of showing identity and signing their names on the voting list at the voting place like white people do.  Do you realize how insulting and racist your opinion of black people is

Words are important, 'You think' and 'your opinion' are definitive statements and, yes, they are offensive when falsely attributed.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2021, 06:01:22 am by Manoli »
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1361 on: April 22, 2021, 05:30:06 am »

If you feel the need to comment, it would be best to have read the relevant posts first.

I can infer. As I did. Turns out, quite correctly.

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You, inadvertently, hit the nail on the head when you say ‘inference or conjecture’.

Advertently.


Quote
Words are important, 'You think' and 'your opinion' are definitive statements and, yes, they are offensive when falsely attributed.

Here I would agree with you. The words should have been chosen more carefully. However, since I know there is no mean bone in Alan's body*, I know he didn't mean it to offend, but rather rhetorically.

* After all, I have never seen another member of this forum so stoically accepting the constant barrage of personal insults from you et al, while remaining gentlemanly and polite all the time like Alan.

Manoli

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1362 on: April 22, 2021, 05:45:19 am »

Here I would agree with you. The words should have been chosen more carefully. However, since I know there is no mean bone in Alan's body*, I know he didn't mean it to offend, but rather rhetorically.

In which case if, as you say, 'he didn't mean to offend', all that would have been needed was a simple correction, an amendment or retraction - any one would have put this to bed long ago.
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1363 on: April 22, 2021, 06:12:04 am »

In which case if, as you say, 'he didn't mean to offend', all that would have been needed was a simple correction, an amendment or retraction - any one would have put this to bed long ago.

Again, I agree.

Manoli

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1364 on: April 22, 2021, 06:20:12 am »

Again, I agree.

Proof that, 'there's always a first time for everything' ... [/levity]
« Last Edit: April 22, 2021, 01:51:57 pm by Manoli »
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Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1365 on: April 22, 2021, 06:43:04 am »

Demanding that a particular race should get special voting advantages is just as racist to the remaining races as would be denying them the same advantages granted  to other races. Everyone should be treated equally. 

Arguing that black voters aren't capable of meeting ID requirements that whites can handle is a put down of black people.  The fact is they are capable of meeting these reuqirements.  Some Democrats are using that excuse because they want to cheat with the vote. 

Manoli

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1366 on: April 22, 2021, 06:47:58 am »

Demanding that a particular race should get special voting advantages is just as racist to the remaining races as would be denying them the same advantages granted  to other races. Everyone should be treated equally. 

Arguing that black voters aren't capable of meeting ID requirements that whites can handle is a put down of black people.  The fact is they are capable of meeting these reuqirements.  Some Democrats are using that excuse because they want to cheat with the vote. 

This thread is meant to be focused on the Coronavirus vaccines.
Time to get back on-topic.
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JoeKitchen

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1367 on: April 22, 2021, 07:13:29 am »

This will be my last word on this or any subject on Lula:

Alan, you claimed I said certain things, as quoted above. You didn't say "suggested", or "implied" or anything of that sort which would have served to qualify your claim. You made a statement of fact, which was false, and served to impugn me. Your words fit any definition of 'libel'.  Instead of apologising and retracting your claims, you have restated your position.

Josh, you seem to want to run this website as a free fire zone where Klein can make any claims he wants, valid or false, without constraint. You may imagine that the internet is some magic land where the laws of libel do not apply.  I assure you that it isn't. I am an elderly person and I don't plan to spend the last years of my life pursuing satisfaction over this issue. One day you may encounter a poster who has more leisure to do so, and at that point you will regret this policy.

Regardless, I am done here. I thank those who have entertained and informed, and wish you fair light and full frames.

We've heard this before. 

Anyone want to do an over/under bet on how long it will before Jeremy posts again?  Let's put the timeframe at, say, 14 days. 
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Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1368 on: April 22, 2021, 07:31:12 am »

Update.

Johnson & Johnson’s COVID Vaccine Was Immunizing Homeless People. Then It Was Put On Pause
https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/stephaniemlee/covid-vaccine-johnson-homeless-pause

faberryman

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1369 on: April 22, 2021, 07:42:17 am »

I'll repeat what I said. It's demeaning if not racist for white people to think that blacks are incapable of getting ID's as white people do.

No. I'll repeat what you said:

So you think Black Americans are ignorant.  That they're still picking cotton and don't know how to get an ID when ID's are required to get into an office or public building, drive, have a bank account,  or to get welfare or food stamps if they're poor.  Maybe we should stick black people's thumbs into purple ink after they vote as they did in Iraq to prevent double-voting since they're incapable of showing identity and signing their names on the voting list at the voting place like white people do.  Do you realize how insulting and racist your opinion of black people is?

Like Jeremy, this will be my last post on LuLa.

Josh, you are not running a website. You are running a sewer.
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James Clark

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1370 on: April 22, 2021, 08:30:17 am »

No. I'll repeat what you said:

Like Jeremy, this will be my last post on LuLa.

Josh, you are not running a website. You are running a sewer.

C'mon Frank (and Jeremy).  I get your frustration, but ultimately if someone bugs you, I think you have to make a choice to simply not engage, and if you do, you pretty much know what you're gonna get, right?  Head over to the greener pastures of the photography threads and let's talk about art.

I, for one, appreciate Josh's lighter, mindful moderation style.  If certain people take advantage, to my mind that's the price we pay, but such is the tragedy of the commons ;).

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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1371 on: April 22, 2021, 02:20:32 pm »

Our own Jim Kasson published this on his Facebook.

Harry Potter and The Curious Case of Missing Flu (my title)



josh.reichmann

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1372 on: April 22, 2021, 04:25:20 pm »

No. I'll repeat what you said:

Like Jeremy, this will be my last post on LuLa.

Josh, you are not running a website. You are running a sewer.

This thread may contain sewage but it is in the appropriate spot, near the bottom, and for many/most users not even on the radar. We can return to zero politics if the hand-full of those engaging here all agree that it will clean up the site (?)

I reiterate this quarterly; the articles often now see upward of 30k views after 6weeks, compared to 800 to 2k before I jumped on... those readers, the users of buy and sell and the many thousands of monthly people learning from the photo-threads- rarely spend time here. I leave it going because life is political and this forum is online homebase for some.
It's your guys smoking pit. I can sweep it up, but history has shown that people find another place to smoke and I'd prefer it not be in the lab etc.
In any case - please do always feel empowered to report things you believe are beyond the pale, and I'll judge.

Josh
« Last Edit: April 22, 2021, 04:56:17 pm by josh.reichmann »
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Chris Kern

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1373 on: April 22, 2021, 06:04:11 pm »

Harry Potter and The Curious Case of Missing Flu (my title)

The New York Times published a piece on the "missing 'flu" today:

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“We do not know when it will come back in the United States, but we know it will come back,” said Sonja Olsen, an epidemiologist at the C.D.C.

Experts are less certain about what will happen when the flu does return. In the coming months — as millions of people return to public transit, restaurants, schools and offices — influenza outbreaks could be more widespread than normal, they say, or could occur at unusual times of the year. But it’s also possible that the virus that returns is less dangerous, having not had the opportunity to evolve while it was on hiatus.

“We don’t really have a clue,” said Richard Webby, a virologist at the St. Jude Children’s Research Hospital in Memphis. “We’re in uncharted territory. We haven’t had an influenza season this low, I think as long as we’ve been measuring it. So what the potential implications are is a bit unclear.”

Scientists do not yet know which public health measures were most effective in eradicating the flu this season, but if behaviors like mask-wearing and frequent hand-washing continue after the coronavirus pandemic is over, they could help to keep influenza at bay in the United States.

Much also depends on the latest flu vaccines, their effectiveness and the public’s willingness to get them. The recent drop in cases, however, has made it difficult for scientists to decide which flu strains to protect against in those vaccines. It’s harder to predict which strains will be circulating later, they say, when so few are circulating now.

Apparently, several manufacturers are looking into feasibility of developing products that would combine coronavirus and influenza vaccines.  "One shot (or jab) fits all" (my title).

Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1374 on: April 22, 2021, 06:33:48 pm »

Our own Jim Kasson published this on his Facebook.

Harry Potter and The Curious Case of Missing Flu (my title)




I predicted this flu situation last year because everyone was isolating and wearing masks.  It's one of the reasons my wife and I didn't take the flu shot.  I suspect the common cold cases are also down.  We both haven't had a cold in twelve months when we average one or two a year each.  How did you and others make out with getting colds?

Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1375 on: April 23, 2021, 10:03:16 am »

J&J vaccine update:

White House writes off Johnson & Johnson vaccine after string of production failures
The chaos has disappointed the Biden team, which once argued that the company’s one-dose vaccine would be central to turning the tide of the pandemic.

LesPalenik

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1376 on: April 23, 2021, 01:38:27 pm »

I predicted this flu situation last year because everyone was isolating and wearing masks.  It's one of the reasons my wife and I didn't take the flu shot.  I suspect the common cold cases are also down.  We both haven't had a cold in twelve months when we average one or two a year each.  How did you and others make out with getting colds?

I predicted it, too and I didn't get flu nor common cold. Apparently, number of STD cases is also down, although some public health officials believe many cases are going undetected as clinics close during the pandemic and testing supplies are diverted to coronavirus screening. Well, maybe we should stay at home every winter (or wear protection devices permanently like many Chinese do).
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James Clark

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1377 on: April 23, 2021, 05:35:51 pm »

J&J vaccine update:

White House writes off Johnson & Johnson vaccine after string of production failures
The chaos has disappointed the Biden team, which once argued that the company’s one-dose vaccine would be central to turning the tide of the pandemic.


Is the CDC not in Biden's pocket this week?  Or was that last week?  It's all so confusing :/

CDC recommends resumption of J&J vaccinations
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Chris Kern

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1378 on: April 23, 2021, 06:58:14 pm »

You're finished with COVID-19, but is it finished with you?

An early but interesting retrospective study of patients treated by the U.S. Veterans Administration*, based on data from a large cohort of 87,000 COVID-19 patients and a comparison group of almost five million others, indicates that the coronavirus survivors had a significantly higher risk of death in the six months following their recovery, even those whose symptoms were considered mild and did not require hospitalization:

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The results suggest that beyond the first 30 days of illness, people with COVID-19 are at higher risk of death, health care resource utilization, and exhibit a broad array of incident pulmonary and extrapulmonary clinical manifestations including nervous system and neurocognitive disorders, mental health disorders, metabolic disorders, cardiovascular disorders, gastrointestinal disorders, and signs and symptoms related to poor general wellbeing including malaise, fatigue, musculoskeletal pain, and anemia. Increased risk of incident use of several medication classes was also observed including pain medications (opioids and non-opioids), antidepressants, anxiolytics, antihypertensives, anti-hyperlipidemics, oral hypoglycemics, insulin, and other medication classes. Our analyses of pre-specified outcomes complement the high dimensional approach to identify specific post-acute sequalae with greater diagnostic resolution and reveal two key findings: a) the risk and associated burden of post-acute sequalae is evident even among those whose acute disease was not severe enough to necessitate hospitalization — the segment that represents the majority of people with COVID-19, and b) the risk and associated burden increases across the severity spectrum of the acute COVID-19 infection (non-hospitalized, hospitalized, admitted to intensive care). Our comparative approach to examine post-acute sequalae in those hospitalized with COVID-19 vs. seasonal influenza (using a high dimensional approach and through examination of pre-specified outcomes) suggests substantially higher burden of a broad array of post-acute sequelae in those hospitalized with COVID-19 vs. seasonal influenza — providing differentiating fea-tures of post-COVID-19 (both in magnitude of risk and breadth of organ involvement) from a post-influenza viral syndrome. The constellation of evidence suggests that 30-day survivors of COVID-19 exhibited increased risk of death and health resource utilization, and substantial burden of health loss (spanning pulmonary and several extrapulmonary organ systems) and highlights the need for a holistic and integrated multidisciplinary long-term care of COVID-19 survivors.

The authors of the study note that "[t]he mechanism(s) which underly the post-acute and chronic manifestations of COVID-19 are not entirely clear.  Some of the manifestations may be driven by a direct effect of the viral infection and may be putatively explained by several hypotheses including persistent virus in immune-privileged sites, aberrant immune response, hyperactivation of the immune system, or autoimmunity.  Indirect effects including changes in social (e.g. reduced social contact and loneliness), economic (e.g. loss of employment), and behavioral conditions (e.g. changes in diet and exercise) that may be differentially experienced by people with COVID-19 may also shape health outcomes in COVID-19 survivors. . . . "

———
*The Veterans Administration manages a network of government-operated hospitals that provide medical services to former members of the military services of the United States.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2021, 07:25:07 am by Chris Kern »
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Robert Roaldi

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #1379 on: April 23, 2021, 10:07:06 pm »

The 7-day moving average US deaths per day seems to have stopped decreasing recently https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/ and has been hovering around 800 per day. I hope that's either a data anomaly or because the vaccine effect hasn't fully kicked in yet. Until recently, deaths per day was decreasing slowly, but decreasing. 800 per day is about 290,000 per year, which is much higher that the average deaths from flu (40,000 or so, if I remember the discussions from last year), which would not be a comfortable base line. Hope that changes soon.
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