Epson P9570 Platen Gap Question

[tharrington]

Hi- Is there a way to determine the platen gap setting on the Epson P9570/7570 when the media setting is set to Auto?  For instance, if I want to change the setting from Auto to a specified value in the EMI, how do I know the value at which I am starting?  Thanks for any insight.  Tripp

[Rand47]

This is a great question.  Unfortunately, Epson provides no help in the User Guide for the 75xx/95xx printers.  One could assume that “auto” is determined by some relationship to the caliper of the media type selected.  What I’ve done is start at the widest setting and work my way down, when creating a custom media type.  A waste of paper, and “testing until you get head strikes” doesn’t seem like a great idea.  But there it is.  Sorry I’m of no help, but I share your question - and for me it’s a frustration.

Rand

[tharrington]

Thank you Rand... I appreciate your response- as always!  That makes me feel a little better as I thought I must surely be missing something  .  Knowing how much testing you've already done I imagine this has been brought to Epson's attention; however, I did send an email to support yesterday.  If Epson provides any helpful information I'll report back.   

[Rand47]

Thank you Rand... I appreciate your response- as always!  That makes me feel a little better as I thought I must surely be missing something  .  Knowing how much testing you've already done I imagine this has been brought to Epson's attention; however, I did send an email to support yesterday.  If Epson provides any helpful information I'll report back.

Thanks!  Be interesting to see if you get a cogent response.

Rand

[rxchaos]

Hi- Is there a way to determine the platen gap setting on the Epson P9570/7570 when the media setting is set to Auto?  For instance, if I want to change the setting from Auto to a specified value in the EMI, how do I know the value at which I am starting?  Thanks for any insight.  Tripp

For quite some time I've been using this chart from BreathingColor.com to determine the platen gap setting.  Here's the link to the article (https://www.breathingcolor.com/blog/third-party-paper-printing/)

Platen Gap Setting      Paper weight in GSM
------------------------------------------------
Narrow (1.2mm)         150gsm
Standard (1.6mm)       190gsm
Wide (1.9mm)            260gsm
Wider (2.1mm)           320gsm
Widest (2.4mm)          500gsm

On the Epson P9000 printers the platen gap was specified as (Narrow, Standard, Wide, Wider and Widest). On the P9570 it is specified numerically in mm. The article does state that there is not an exact correlation between paper weight and its thickness.

[Rand47]

For quite some time I've been using this chart from BreathingColor.com to determine the platen gap setting.  Here's the link to the article (https://www.breathingcolor.com/blog/third-party-paper-printing/)

Platen Gap Setting      Paper weight in GSM
------------------------------------------------
Narrow (1.2mm)         150gsm
Standard (1.6mm)       190gsm
Wide (1.9mm)            260gsm
Wider (2.1mm)           320gsm
Widest (2.4mm)          500gsm

On the Epson P9000 printers the platen gap was specified as (Narrow, Standard, Wide, Wider and Widest). On the P9570 it is specified numerically in mm. The article does state that there is not an exact correlation between paper weight and its thickness.

Very helpful, thanks . . .

Rand

[Richard.Wills]

Back when I ran a 9800, I had a chart of head height settings for working beyond Auto. I'm pretty sure that it was something that Keith Cooper, Northlight, had on his site. Might be worth a look for. My memory suggests that it had not only paper weight, but thickness as well. Fairly sure that's what lead me to get a micrometer. Had remarkably few crashes with the 9800.

[tharrington]

Indeed... all very helpful information.

Epson’s response is noted here: “It will be based on the paper type in that case. If it's a photo paper or plain paper, it should be 1.2. If you have a fine art paper selected or enhanced matte, probably 1.6 or 1.9
the gap will not go lower than 1.2. So to answer your question selecting "auto" the printer will adjust accordingly to the specific paper type you have loaded in the printer.”

[JRSmit]

Paper weight has not a direct relation to paper thickness , at least for fine art papers.
It is about the head clearance relative to the paper surface of the paper being fed over the platen.
Fine art mat papers tend to swell a bit when becoming wet by the ink, specially in dark areas(lots of ink).
Resin papers do not show that swelling. Fine art gloss papers alsook or little swelling.
Also as the platen is not a flat plate but has suction chambers, thus ‘ridges’ in between. The paper will not be flat on the platen, also the paper itself is not flat when coming from a roll, or sheets may not be flat either. With cotton based Fine art papers , because they get a bit soft due to the ink liquid absorbed, these ridges can create slight but visible marks In the paper in the feed length.
What also occurs that the paper when heavily inked begins to warp a bit, because the paper expands a bit. This can start already when still ‘under’ the head.
So , to prevent the head from scraping the paper surface, yet not to strong platen suction to prevent marking or slight deformation of being sucked a bit into the platen chambers, the combination of platen gap and platen suction given a type of paper needs to be determined and set accordingly.
The feed is influenced by these settings (friction) so an feed check and adjustment is needed.
Lastly, the resulting head clearance has an effect on the head alignment. (Accuracy of dot placement) So once set you need to do a head alignment.
With the double head systems this is far more critical.

[arobinson7547]

>the resulting head clearance has an effect on the head alignment. (Accuracy of dot placement) So once set you need to do a head alignment.<

Does this Printer have the ability to store 'multiple' Head Alignments? (linked to various Platen Gap Setting/head clearances)

I ask because once you do a Head Alignment [at whatever height/paper type], since you are most likely going to use different types of paper (thus different head clearances), that would leave you having do to a head alignment every time you change Paper Types.

Paper Settings can include Gap, Suction, etc. but how can you manage 'multiple' Head Alignments'? (be it uni or bi-directional)?

I'm think that the Head Alignment is Global, across all Paper Types

[JRSmit]

>the resulting head clearance has an effect on the head alignment. (Accuracy of dot placement) So once set you need to do a head alignment.<

Does this Printer have the ability to store 'multiple' Head Alignments? (linked to various Platen Gap Setting/head clearances)

I ask because once you do a Head Alignment [at whatever height/paper type], since you are most likely going to use different types of paper (thus different head clearances), that would leave you having do to a head alignment every time you change Paper Types.

Paper Settings can include Gap, Suction, etc. but how can you manage 'multiple' Head Alignments'? (be it uni or bi-directional)?

I'm think that the Head Alignment is Global, across all Paper Types

I believe it is global, so i treat it as global. And on regular basis do head alignment. Especially when the thickness is more than 0.1mm different for the next job.
The SC-P9000 are quite stable .

[deanwork]

Not trying to steer this off topic,  but I’m starting to ask around.

Is there any difference in the performance of the P 9570 heads and the P 9000 heads ( that are apparently the same heads as the 9900s )   in regard to missing nozzles , head cleaning needed, etc.

John

I believe it is global, so i treat it as global. And on regular basis do head alignment. Especially when the thickness is more than 0.1mm different for the next job.
The SC-P9000 are quite stable .

[JRSmit]

Not trying to steer this off topic,  but I’m starting to ask around.

Is there any difference in the performance of the P 9570 heads and the P 9000 heads ( that are apparently the same heads as the 9900s )   in regard to missing nozzles , head cleaning needed, etc.

John

Much less issues with scp9000 printhead, compared to sp9900. Less blocked nozzles, less replacements. I had a scp9500 for 6 months, no difference with the scp9000 w.r.t. clogged nozzles.

[deanwork]

Thanks. Interesting. The heads appear quite different between the two - one with 360 ppi output and the newer ones with 300 ppi. ( 2880 ).

Much less issues with scp9000 printhead, compared to sp9900. Less blocked nozzles, less replacements. I had a scp9500 for 6 months, no difference with the scp9000 w.r.t. clogged nozzles.

[JRSmit]

But double head so twice the amount.
For print quality the scp9000 wins hands down.

[wsegar]

Since I saw th platten gap issue I though I would post my problems with this printer

Hi Everyone I am a photographer that used the P9000 and previously the 9800 so have many years using these printers.

I currently got the P9570, its been running for a couple weeks. I make prints 44x56 inch prints usually

1. seems to run fine on epson glossy paper on canson Lustre rc on normal settings (paper settings) such as suction normal , platten gap auto, and platter gap on the printer standard, settings are slightly different than p9000

2. on Hahnemuhle Fine Art Baryta 325 (lets put it this way its been a nightmare)

. first I got head Many strikes even as inputing the paper thickness @ .41mm and auto platten gap and standard platter gap on there printer

.so I did various test on test strips 44 x 14, figured out the platten gap on the paper setting to maximum 2.9 and on the printer to widest and suction to max 3 since the paper curls so much, it seemed to work perfect ( as in no head strikes and was razor sharp) ,but I was doing 44x 14 inch test strips on the H Fine Art Baryta. I was exited and though I nailed it. So I ran a 44x 56.5 print on those settings with 5 inch white paper borders around the print. When the print came out it was all out of focus. But the more I looked at it were the print started it was in focus and slowly went out of focus. Maybe you can help me out what Is happening ?

I tried too switch the settings but since I had to reload a barely used 44 inch roll paper , the printer has many problems loading the paper, it keeps saying its skewed constantly or does not recognize paper that its loaded , and I have tried like 30 times ( no problem on other regular cheap papers).

Anybody experience these problems, I will state the p9000 has not given me any problems on any of these papers.

I really want to print on the Hahnemuhle Fine Art Baryta 325 its beautiful paper , but this printer can not handle the feeding of it and all the problems mentioned above.

The printer does print way better in BW and in color no question about that and is amazingly faster.

Nice to meet all of you

On top of that they had an epson tec about a week ago and had to replace the cover of where the heads park so the ink does not clog while parked , that part was replaced and that problem of having constant clogged heads fixed in the first week of the printer.He had problems loading the Fine Art Baryta 325. And epson support really does not know much about this printer.

Werner

[JRSmit]

Did you measure the print length in the feed direction?
What you ran into is one of THE issues with the 95xx, the feed is not correct and for the double head this is critical, else ‘out of focus’ results.

[arobinson7547]

Now for the longest time, I was ALSO reading that the 10/20000 had two heads, and someone stated, they don't have TWO (2) physical heads; but two ROWS (or more) of nozzles.

If this is correct than those rows of nozzles are PERMANENTLY fixed 'double head' reads as two physical heads that have to be aligned to each other.

Which is it?

It's pretty standard to print out 3 or 4 feet and measure the length of the print. Any difference, be it positive or negative, is the correction value, that has to be entered somewhere.  (The overall length of the Print is scaled (up/down to account for he difference, so that the length of the adjusted (scaled) print equals the length of what you sent/intended)

example. Print 4 a foot box or ruler (intended size), measure the distance from top to bottom. Let's say it measures 47.4" (actual size). That jobs LENGTH needs  to be scaled 101.267% to compensate (Feed Adjustment)

Do it in your file, the driver, a Rip; but makes sure you do it. It has to be done [if accuracy of the length is desired].

[JRSmit]

Two print heads combined into one printhead. In feed direction sort of one above the other. That is why feed accuracy is critical.

[wsegar]

Did you measure the print length in the feed direction?
What you ran into is one of THE issues with the 95xx, the feed is not correct and for the double head this is critical, else ‘out of focus’ results.

Hi JRSmit thank you for your reply I am starting to understand this since I have not gotten into this problem before of out of focuses on any previous printer.

The paper cut is 44x56.5 I center the print on that cut which is 34 x 45.33 centered on the cut

the canson lustre rc in the printed  feed direction came out to 45.25 (short of 45.33) it looks very sharp in focus. The paper cut came out perfect to 56.5 ( this is standard paper like epson luster 260 pretty much.

the hahnemuhle fine art baryta in the printed  feed direction came out to 44 7/8   (shorter than the 45.33)  very out of focus. The paper cut came out short to 45.5/16 so 3/16 short

I am using colorbyte image print rip latest version for the 7570 I see there is a feed adjustment from -100 to 150 its set to 0

This is what COLORBYTE RIP says

""""Media Feed Adjustment
Many printers also allow for custom adjust- ments to the paper feed controls in addition to the Media Type selection. This is an advanced feature, and should only be used for those willing to experiment to achieve the best results, or who are trying to solve a specific problem with banding or paper feed issues. In most cases, it is unnecessary to adjust this control."""""

Not sure how to calculate do you feed the info into the printer paper settings or rip for the feder adjustment ?

Thank you for your help JRSmit