US Elections 2020 (geopolitics, informed debate, no ad hominems)

Biden

14 (66.7%)

Trump

7 (33.3%)

Total Members Voted: 21

Voting closed: November 02, 2020, 06:25:59 pm

[Alan Klein]

Great write up by Jonathan Turley on the Biden email scandal. 

Jonathan Turley: Hunter Biden's laptop and the Facebook, Twitter censorship scandal – watch these 3 things

Essentially if the store was fabricated, you would expect three things to happen within hours of it breaking. 

1.  A denial that that computer was Hunter Biden's.  You have to assume as soon as the story broke, Hunter was contacted and asked if this was his computer.  If he said no, we would have heard about it the day of, but have not. 

2.  Even if the computer was Hunter's, it could be that the emails and photos were fabricated, and if so, that would be a crime.  Again, nothing; no denial that any of the emails were fabricated. 

3.  The Biden teams has many lawyers under the campaign belt, and if this story was not authentic, it would be defamation and you would expect to see "intent to sue" letters going out.  Crickets it is. 

And now ... it appears that Fox News has verified the authenticity of the emails from someone on one of the email chains.  He also confirmed that "The Big Guy" refers to Joe Biden in the email about "H" holding onto "10 for the Big Guy." 

Source on alleged Hunter Biden email chain verifies message about Chinese investment firm

So, it is looking like Biden used his influence to both enrich his son and himself, through his son.  This is serious and a violation of the law.  This shows me that Biden is unfit for the presidency. 

Trump certainly has many personal foibles, but there is no evidence he has ever done anything corrupt.  It is now obvious Biden is corrupt. 


PS, for as much as some on here talk about how smart Biden is, he sure does like using talking points for morons, such as cops shooting people in the legs.  My God, and you try to convince us this guy really is intelligent.  No, Joe Biden, Cops Can't Just Shoot People in the Leg

Considering Hunter's drug and drinking problems, he may have no recollection of any of it.  So they don't know what to say afraid they'll get caught in a lie.  Meanwhile the anti-Trump press hasn't said much considering all they had to say about the Russians and Trump for four years.  They'll keep protecting Biden.

[Alan Goldhammer]

Infowars?  I have never heard of Infowars until just now. 

Exactly what is Infowars and what issues do you have with them?

Surely you are joking.

[Alan Goldhammer]

The left media is in complete cover their butt and candidate mode.  They can't report on this story honestly. They have invested four years and untold dollars to working to oust Trump.  It has been an utter failure for them.  Now with their final gambit in play, they can't let their work be undone in the final hours.  Truth be damned.  No matter that it sure looks like Joe is a crook, he's their crook.  The Chinese own Biden and that is not a good thing for America.  I don't care if you hate Trump with a passion, this story should give any reasonable American the willies.

According to QAnon, this is just another massive cover up by the Deep State.  I am Q and I vouch for the veracity of this statement.

[faberryman]

From a friend of the computer repair guy.

https://turcopolier.typepad.com/sic_semper_tyrannis/2020/10/yes-the-hunter-biden-emails-are-authentic-by-larry-c-johnson.html

So as I read that account, the FBI has had the computer since sometime in late November or early December, 2019. Is there a coverup or something?

It seems to me like the story would have broken someplace other than the tabloids. I mean I read my share of stuff in the tabloids when I am waiting in line at the grocery store checkout. I think most of it is a bit far-fetched, but it is a fun way to spend a few minutes when you are trapped between grocery carts.

Of course the other thing is Giuliani is involved. He's whackadoodle.

[Alan Klein]

Why doesn't he support abortion rights?  I don't know of any social liberal who doesn't.

Not everyone thinks alike on all subjects.  I believe his position is abortion OK for health of woman, rape and incest.  But honestly, I don't think he cares at all about it.  Roe vs Wade will never be overturned.  Rules will be implemented at the margins.  Frankly, this shouldn't have been a national issue as it isn't a US constitutional issue.  It should have been left up to the states the way it was.  Most states today would not make it illegal.  I believe he's not against gay marriage and some LGBTQ rights although again, these are not US constitutional issues although the courts have made it so. 

[faberryman]

Surely you are joking.

Well, it possible. For example, the only thing Trump knows about QAnon is that they like him and are against pedophilia. I don't remember what Pence knows about QAnon. He has given a couple of different answers when asked. In truth, I don't think his wife will let him read anything about it.

[Manoli]

That's right, you can only use News sources you like to verify stories, lol.   Do you pre-dig the holes to bury your head in, or is it a more in the moment thing? 

Well, unless the AP are a bunch of left wing commie extremists, they are but one of many :

AP - The FBI is investigating whether emails that were published this week by the New York Post related to Joe Biden’s son, Hunter, and his purported dealings in Ukraine are connected to a possible Russian influence operation in an effort to spread disinformation ahead of the 2020 presidential election.  The New York Post report is being investigated by the FBI as a possible Russian influence operation. The authenticity of the emails remained unclear as of Friday.

In August, U.S. intelligence officials said that its believed Russia is using a variety of measures to denigrate Biden ahead of the 2020 election, and that individuals linked to the Kremlin are boosting Trump's reelection bid. A fifth and final report from the Republican-led Senate intelligence committee on the Russia investigation also concluded that the Trump campaign's interactions with Russian intelligence services during the 2016 presidential election posed a “grave” counterintelligence threat.

[Alan Klein]

The left media is in complete cover their butt and candidate mode.  They can't report on this story honestly. They have invested four years and untold dollars to working to oust Trump.  It has been an utter failure for them.  Now with their final gambit in play, they can't let their work be undone in the final hours.  Truth be damned.  No matter that it sure looks like Joe is a crook, he's their crook.  The Chinese own Biden and that is not a good thing for America.  I don't care if you hate Trump with a passion, this story should give any reasonable American the willies.

From a friend of the computer repair guy.

https://turcopolier.typepad.com/sic_semper_tyrannis/2020/10/yes-the-hunter-biden-emails-are-authentic-by-larry-c-johnson.html

Yes, The Hunter Biden Emails Are Authentic by Larry C Johnson

A couple of select passages.  Read the whole thing, its quite interesting.

...

This story is very simple–Hunter Biden dropped off three computers with liquid damage at a repair shop in Wilmington, Delaware on April 12, 2019. The owner, John Mac Issac, examined the three and determined that one was beyond recovery, one was okay and the data on the harddrive of the third could be recoverd. Hunter signed the service ticket and John Paul Mac Issac repaired the hard drive and down loaded the data. During this process he saw some disturbing images and a number of emails that concerned Ukraine, Burisma, China and other issues. With the work completed, Mr. Mac Issac prepared an invoice, sent it to Hunter Biden and notified him that the computer was ready to be retrieved. Hunter did not respond. In the ensuing four months (May, June, July and August), Mr. Mac Issac made repeated efforts to contact Hunter Biden. Biden never answered and never responded. More importantly, Biden stiffed John Paul Mac Issac–i.e., he did not pay the bill.

...

John Paul Mac Issac is not responsible for the emails, images and videos recovered from Hunter Biden’s computer. He was hired to do a job, he did the job and submitted an invoice for the work. Hunter Biden, for some unexplained reason, never responded and never asked for the computer. But that changed last Tuesday, October 13, 2020. A person claiming to be Hunter Biden’s lawyer called John Paul Mac Issac and asked for the computer to be returned. Too late. That horse had left the barn and was with the FBI.

So the left and anti-Trump crowd destroyed our security with Russia with the false Trump collusion claims and now destroyed our security and commercial interests with China with VP payoffs.  The first with Obama's Secretary of State's phony dossier.  And now with fraudulent business deals with his VP.  What a fiasco. At least the fake news press was more honest about Hillary's emails and server before the election.  There's silence from them with Biden's corruption. 

[Alan Klein]

According to QAnon, this is just another massive cover up by the Deep State.  I am Q and I vouch for the veracity of this statement.

I don't know anything about QAnon or Infowars either.  Maybe you can get us all up to date with a brief description of each.

[Craig Lamson]

According to QAnon, this is just another massive cover up by the Deep State.  I am Q and I vouch for the veracity of this statement.

It would be quite easy to find out.  Let the FBI tell us what is on the hard drive they have had in their possession for months. 

But it sure does look like a massive coverup by the deep state and their partners in the left media.

So you are not interested to know if the emails, which have now been corroborated by one of those on the email chain are true? Or do you just hate Trump so much nothing else matters?

[Alan Klein]

So as I read that account, the FBI has had the computer since sometime in later November or early December, 2019. Is there a coverup or something?

They've been busy trying to destroy Trump.  There's only so much time doing coup d'etats.

[Craig Lamson]

So as I read that account, the FBI has had the computer since sometime in later November or early December, 2019. Is there a coverup or something?

It seems to me like the story would have broken someplace other than the tabloids. I mean I read a lot of stuff in the tabloids when I waiting in line at the grocery store checkout line. I think most of that is a bit far-fetched, but it is a fun way to spend a few minutes when you are trapped between grocery carts.

Of course the other thing is Giuliani is involved. He's whackadoodle.

It will only show up if the media decides to print it.  They won't even investigate.

Rudy, brought down the mob and saved New York twice.  Quite the whackadoodle.

[Alan Klein]

Well, unless the AP are a bunch of left wing commie extremists, they are but one of many :

AP - The FBI is investigating whether emails that were published this week by the New York Post related to Joe Biden’s son, Hunter, and his purported dealings in Ukraine are connected to a possible Russian influence operation in an effort to spread disinformation ahead of the 2020 presidential election.  The New York Post report is being investigated by the FBI as a possible Russian influence operation. The authenticity of the emails remained unclear as of Friday.

In August, U.S. intelligence officials said that its believed Russia is using a variety of measures to denigrate Biden ahead of the 2020 election, and that individuals linked to the Kremlin are boosting Trump's reelection bid. A fifth and final report from the Republican-led Senate intelligence committee on the Russia investigation also concluded that the Trump campaign's interactions with Russian intelligence services during the 2016 presidential election posed a “grave” counterintelligence threat.

Well, the biased press didn't handle similar news about Trump and Russian collusion the same way.  They went after him for political reasons for four years, day after day after day.  Pravda would have been proud of them.

[Craig Lamson]

Well, unless the AP are a bunch of left wing commie extremists, they are but one of many :

AP - The FBI is investigating whether emails that were published this week by the New York Post related to Joe Biden’s son, Hunter, and his purported dealings in Ukraine are connected to a possible Russian influence operation in an effort to spread disinformation ahead of the 2020 presidential election.  The New York Post report is being investigated by the FBI as a possible Russian influence operation. The authenticity of the emails remained unclear as of Friday.

In August, U.S. intelligence officials said that its believed Russia is using a variety of measures to denigrate Biden ahead of the 2020 election, and that individuals linked to the Kremlin are boosting Trump's reelection bid. A fifth and final report from the Republican-led Senate intelligence committee on the Russia investigation also concluded that the Trump campaign's interactions with Russian intelligence services during the 2016 presidential election posed a “grave” counterintelligence threat.

The FBI has had these emails for months.  What have they been doing?  They have been corraborated by one of Hunters partners and they have the email chain directly from his gmail account to prove  it.  These are Hunter Bidens emails.  It was his computer.  No Russian made him drop it off and never go back to collect it. 

The question becomes, will the media do its job and investigate the material or cover it up. So far they are in cover up mode.

Here is the cover page from the NBC News website right now.  How many stories do you see about anything related to the Biden Computer and where is it located on the page?

https://www.nbcnews.com/

How about CNN

https://www.cnn.com/

CBS

https://www.cbsnews.com/

New York Times

https://www.nytimes.com/

Or Fox?

https://www.foxnews.com/

[Alan Klein]

The FBI has had these emails for months.  What have they been doing?  They have been corraborated by one of Hunters partners and they have the email chain directly from his gmail account to prove  it.  These are Hunter Bidens emails.  It was his computer.  No Russian made him drop it off and never go back to collect it. 

The question becomes, will the media do its job and investigate the material or cover it up. So far they are in cover up mode.

If Biden gets elected, the FBI will drop the laptop in the Potomac River.  If he loses, no one will care. 

[Alan Goldhammer]

The FBI has had these emails for months.  What have they been doing?  They have been corraborated by one of Hunters partners and they have the email chain directly from his gmail account to prove  it.  These are Hunter Bidens emails.  It was his computer.  No Russian made him drop it off and never go back to collect it. 

If any of this was the least bit true don't you think Attorney General Barr would have been visiting the FBI and demanded that this be given top priority? 

If you want to continue to believe in fairy tales go ahead.  Rudy Giuliani has been discredited so many times that I have lost count.

The Washington Post has fact checked what we know to date:  https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/10/14/hunter-bidens-alleged-laptop-an-explainer/

Columnist David Ignatius has a piece on this in today's paper:  https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-truth-behind-the-hunter-biden-non-scandal/2020/10/16/798210bc-0fd1-11eb-8074-0e943a91bf08_story.html

You can call fake news and I can too.  Unless you have a good response to the question I ask, this conversation is over.

[James Clark]

The FBI has had these emails for months.  What have they been doing?  They have been corraborated by one of Hunters partners and they have the email chain directly from his gmail account to prove  it.  These are Hunter Bidens emails.  It was his computer.  No Russian made him drop it off and never go back to collect it. 

The question becomes, will the media do its job and investigate the material or cover it up. So far they are in cover up mode.

Here is the cover page from the NBC News website right now.  How many stories do you see about anything related to the Biden Computer and where is it located on the page?

https://www.nbcnews.com/

How about CNN

https://www.cnn.com/

CBS

https://www.cbsnews.com/

New York Times

https://www.nytimes.com/

Or Fox?

https://www.foxnews.com/

why should anyone be covering a “scandal” that literally amounts to “Presidential Candidate’s idiot kid was lobbyist.”

[Manoli]

The FBI has had these emails for months.  What have they been doing?  They have been corraborated by one of Hunters partners and they have the email chain directly from his gmail account to prove  it.  These are Hunter Bidens emails.  It was his computer.  No Russian made him drop it off and never go back to collect it. 

The question becomes, will the media do its job and investigate the material or cover it up. So far they are in cover up mode.

If I’m to align myself with your and Alan’s interpretation of the status quo, then I’m to believe that the FBI (and by association the CIA) are incompetent / politically motivated / corrupt - any one or all three. Not exactly within the competence bounds of the press.

Given that this all stems from a ‘Giuliani got suckered’ foot-in-mouth moment, I’d tend to believe the US Intelligence services - as and when they report on what, so far, is a non-issue. Prima facie it seems the NY Post and Giuliani have a lot more to answer for than Joe Biden’s son.

[faberryman]

So you are not interested to know if the emails, which have now been corroborated by one of those on the email chain are true? Or do you just hate Trump so much nothing else matters?

I understand that Fox News has said it has verified the emails.  I went to the Fox News website and didn't find much other than an opinion piece by David Bossie that it's a left wing cover up. Maybe Fox is working on a big expose and I just need to be patient.

I switched on Fox News. I have been watching for a while.  They said that the FBI is investigating whether the Hunter Biden laptop story is Russian disinformation. They also said Senate GOP members are going to subpoena the CEOs of Twitter and Facebook next week. Fair enough. Why aren't they going to subpoena the color-blind computer repair guy? It seems like he would know more about this than Zuckerberg and Dorsey. Then Trump's campaign communication guy comes on and is saying the same stuff that was in the New York Post story a couple of days ago and raising his eyebrows a lot. Even the Fox News guy is chuckling and shaking his head. That's not really helping a lot.

Has Fox News flipped and is now pro-Biden and aiding and abetting the cover-up? Now there's a story.

I'll keep looking for stuff. Maybe it is all on the dark web with the rest of the conspiracy stuff.  Maybe my son will be able to help me navigate over there so I can find out.

[Alan Klein]

If any of this was the least bit true don't you think Attorney General Barr would have been visiting the FBI and demanded that this be given top priority? 

If you want to continue to believe in fairy tales go ahead.  Rudy Giuliani has been discredited so many times that I have lost count.

The Washington Post has fact checked what we know to date:  https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/10/14/hunter-bidens-alleged-laptop-an-explainer/

Columnist David Ignatius has a piece on this in today's paper:  https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-truth-behind-the-hunter-biden-non-scandal/2020/10/16/798210bc-0fd1-11eb-8074-0e943a91bf08_story.html

You can call fake news and I can too.  Unless you have a good response to the question I ask, this conversation is over.

It would have been nice if you were as circumspect with the Trump dossier known to be produced and paid for by Hillary Clinton.