PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political

[faberryman]

For example, the new additional  $500 billions the US Congress just passed provides no funding to states that are going broke, including my state of NY who my wife and I depend on for pensions and security retirement plans.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-usa-states-idUSKCN2242U7

"McConnell, in a radio interview, said Republicans would not support giving state and local governments more money in future coronavirus aid legislation, saying those funds could end up being used to bail out state pensions."

There is still time to change your party affiliation before the primary.

[Alan Klein]

How is that worse than being dead?

Fortunately, this old fart's only job is to try to stay alive.  I'll leave the working part to the younger folk. 

[Alan Klein]

Why wouldn't they have a job? When people feel safe doing so, they'll flood to restaurants and bars. People will start buying things again, driving manufacturing. It might take a while, but things will bounce back...they always have before.

All the people I talked with are not concerned about getting a job or returning to their existing job...it's they are still scared of the virus. For things to get back on track, people need to feel safe...and that's when we have a vaccine. If we see this virus raise its head again in the fall for a second round...that is when major shit hits the fan.

I hope you're right.  But I think you're being too optimistic.  Your friends are concentrating on the virus.  But how many just won't have jobs when it's over?  They just don't know about that yet.  The US was slated for a recession before the virus hit.  We've been living in a bubble of low interest rate debt.  That's why the Fed lowered interest rates and the US government was one trillion in debt for just this year.  The virus was the pin that broke the bubble.  Not too sure how Canada was doing so you may be in better shape.  But there's a lot of cross border wealth and jobs that's going away.  Canada is a huge oil exporter that's going to take a big hit as we will.  Here's an article on poverty:

Coronavirus pandemic | A gloomy prediction on how much poverty could rise in the US
Researchers suggest the poverty rate may reach the highest levels in half a century, hitting African-Americans and children hardest.[/i]
[/i][/i]https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/world/coronavirus-pandemic-a-gloomy-prediction-on-how-much-poverty-could-rise-in-the-us-5160841.html

[Alan Klein]

Close one door and another opens, or destroy one kind of park and create a totally different one. 

California skate park filled with sand to enforce social distancing backfires as dirt bikers show up

I for one did not see this coming. 

Although I did feel it was a stupid thing for LA to do, I did realize that there was no way a few skateboarders would be able to remove 37 tons of sand and thought that would be it for the park.  The law of unintended consequences at work. 

When you're stuck with lemons, make lemonade.

[James Clark]

So what. So someone over reacted and screwed up. What else is new? If I were them, I'd hang on to that structure for when a second wave comes along.

Is it as big a waste of money as several generations of over-redundant nuclear weapon systems no one ever intended to use?

If you want to start documenting all the dumb things people have done over the years, you'd better stock up on a lot of coffee.

I spent $1,314 dollars on health insurance last month, and didn't get coronavirus yet.  Money wasted.  Probably oughta cancel it

[chez]

I hope you're right.  But I think you're being too optimistic.  Your friends are concentrating on the virus.  But how many just won't have jobs when it's over?  They just don't know about that yet.  The US was slated for a recession before the virus hit.  We've been living in a bubble of low interest rate debt.  That's why the Fed lowered interest rates and the US government was one trillion in debt for just this year.  The virus was the pin that broke the bubble.  Not too sure how Canada was doing so you may be in better shape.  But there's a lot of cross border wealth and jobs that's going away.  Canada is a huge oil exporter that's going to take a big hit as we will.  Here's an article on poverty:

Coronavirus pandemic | A gloomy prediction on how much poverty could rise in the US
Researchers suggest the poverty rate may reach the highest levels in half a century, hitting African-Americans and children hardest.[/i]
[/i][/i]https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/world/coronavirus-pandemic-a-gloomy-prediction-on-how-much-poverty-could-rise-in-the-us-5160841.html

Everyone of the restaurants are open for delivery or pickup...they seem just as busy as ever, people at home for the day don't want to cook everyday. Grocery stores have been hiring help. Hardware store parking lots are full. Banks have reduced hours, but are open. Garden centres never had this much business, some are hiring. So it's not all doom and gloom.

I agree some businesses will go belly up...but many of those businesses maybe should not have been in business in the first place. I'm a firm believer that things in life gravitate to the norm...it might take a bit longer, but we'll all get back to the norm.

We survived the 18% mortgage rates of the early 80's. We survived the market crash of 87. We survived the dot.com bubble burst. We survived the bank crash of 2008. We'll survive the corona crash of 2020.

[chez]

I spent $1,314 dollars on health insurance last month, and didn't get coronavirus yet.  Money wasted.  Probably oughta cancel it

Might as well cancel your house insurance as its a waste...your house didn't burn down. What about your car insurance...yearly waste as you had no crashes.

And the gov spending all that money on nuclear warheads without ever firing them...waste of money.

[JoeKitchen]

Is anyone else thinking Bill De Blasio is loosing it? 

First he insisted on not shutting down the subway and having New Yorkers live their lives normally, until he shut it down.  Then he insisted the schools did not need to be shut down, then did.  Then he shut down the city, but he still went about his business without PPE, went to the gym (he closed down), has been seen walking around outside, etc.  Then he started asking New Yorkers to fink on their neighbors (with most of the pics being sent in being Hitler memes on him and dick pics, which I must admit is pretty funny).  Then he announces that he is surprised that criminals being released from jail, which he was responsible for, committed crimes when back on the street. 

And now he is calling for a city wide parade to celebrate healthcare workers when the city opens up, first thing BTW.     Is he totally nuts? 

Now, I want people to get back to work sooner then many here, but I have never called for large public gatherings, especially not a parade.  He may be the most incompetent mayor in history. 

And you people are on concentrating on Trump for this.  You should be looking at De Blasio to blame for the majority of the deaths.

[BernardLanguillier]

No, these are countries, mine was 50 U.S. states, which should have more similarities than countries around the world.

Be consistent.

You cannot at the same time deny that more interactions cause an increase of contagion and claim that States without highly populated urban centers are comparable to NY or LA.

The timing of lock down is relevant because lock down reduces interactions. If you have fewer interactions in the first place because cities are less populated and concentrated, because there is fewer public transportation, because there is less economic activity then you would expect a much slower spread of the virus.

This isn’t rocket science.

In case you can read French, this study demonstrates pretty convincingly that the confinement has reduced dead toll by a factor of 4 in hospitals in France.

https://www.lemonde.fr/planete/article/2020/04/23/coronavirus-plus-de-60-000-morts-evites-en-france-grace-au-confinement_6037474_3244.html

Cheers,
Bernard

[BernardLanguillier]

Is anyone else thinking Bill De Blasio is loosing it? 

First he insisted on not shutting down the subway and having New Yorkers live their lives normally, until he shut it down.  Then he insisted the schools did not need to be shut down, then did.  Then he shut down the city, but he still went about his business without PPE, went to the gym (he closed down), has been seen walking around outside, etc.  Then he started asking New Yorkers to fink on their neighbors (with most of the pics being sent in being Hitler memes on him and dick pics, which I must admit is pretty funny).  Then he announces that he is surprised that criminals being released from jail, which he was responsible for, committed crimes when back on the street. 

And now he is calling for a city wide parade to celebrate healthcare workers when the city opens up, first thing BTW.     Is he totally nuts? 

Now, I want people to get back to work sooner then many here, but I have never called for large public gatherings, especially not a parade.  He may be the most incompetent mayor in history. 

And you people are on concentrating on Trump for this.  You should be looking at De Blasio to blame for the majority of the deaths.

It’s lucky he is nowhere near being President. Even if he proposed a parade after the pandemic is resolved.

Think what damage would be done if the President encouraged uncontrolled deconfinment.

Wouldn’t that be of criminal nature?

Oh wait... he just did that 2 days ago when he tweeted « liberate Michigan » hours after his own administration outlined perfectly reasonable guidelines stating very clearly that a 2 weeks decrease of infections was needed to start reopening.

I assume you’ll agree that Trump is « the most incompetent President in history »?

Cheers,
Bernard

[LesPalenik]

Is anyone else thinking Bill De Blasio is loosing it? 

First he insisted on not shutting down the subway and having New Yorkers live their lives normally, until he shut it down.  Then he insisted the schools did not need to be shut down, then did.  Then he shut down the city, but he still went about his business without PPE, went to the gym (he closed down), has been seen walking around outside, etc.  Then he started asking New Yorkers to fink on their neighbors (with most of the pics being sent in being Hitler memes on him and dick pics, which I must admit is pretty funny).  Then he announces that he is surprised that criminals being released from jail, which he was responsible for, committed crimes when back on the street. 

And now he is calling for a city wide parade to celebrate healthcare workers when the city opens up, first thing BTW.     Is he totally nuts? 

Not so surprising for a career politician. Incompetent and flip-flopping decisions, unaccountable. emphasis on photo-ops. 

[JoeKitchen]

It’s lucky he is nowhere near being President.

Think what damage would be done if the President encouraged uncontrolled deconfinment.

Wouldn’t that be of criminal nature?

Oh wait... he just did that 2 days ago when he tweeted « liberate Michigan » hours after his own administration outlined perfectly reasonable guidelines stating very clearly that a 2 weeks decrease of infections was needed to start reopening.

I assume you’ll agree that Trump is « the most incompetent President in history »?

Cheers,
Bernard

Ummm, ... no. 

Trump allowed the system to work, aka federalism.  I said you are coming close to understanding it, but maybe you should hit the books again.  On top of that, he has not expanded the federal government, a real plus.  And all governors have been praising the responce of the federal government. 

As I was talking with a business associate in the Netherland yesterday, I just dont think you can efficient govern a large geographic mass with a strong central government.  The government needs to be local, mostly, to work.  He agreed with me, fyi. 

But back to De Blasio, yes thank god his campaign was a joke.  I am sure many New Yorkers cant wait until he exits his post into obscurity. 

[MattBurt]

all governors have been praising the responce of the federal government. 
 

Where do you get your news again? Or was this a sarcastic remark?

[JoeKitchen]

Where do you get your news again? Or was this a sarcastic remark?

The news, the governors' remarks.   

It's all public.  You can look it up. 

[armand]

It does not take an expert to recognize that in many cases, it took a long time to come up with the vaccines we take for granted today. 

You really need to get off your experts are always right wagon.  They have more intelligence about a narrow subject range, but not anymore wisdom then you or I.  Not to mention, at first they told us wearing masks did nothing and now they do. 

But as I said before, it is a legitimate time to think about what we do if we just dont get one.

Right, it took you longer than I expected to come up with this so I'll give you credit here.

They have more intelligence about a narrow subject range

Except the narrow subject range is exactly what you doubt.

but not anymore wisdom then you or I

That is true for some here, but you forget the vice versa is true also.

Not to mention, at first they told us wearing masks did nothing and now they do.

Explained why multiple times, but don't let that stand in the way of a good argument.

[JoeKitchen]

Right, it took you longer than I expected to come up with this so I'll give you credit here.

Except the narrow subject range is exactly what you doubt.

That is true for some here, but you forget the vice versa is true also.
Explained why multiple times, but don't let that stand in the way of a good argument.

Exactly explain that vise versa.  Are we talking about the converse, inverse, contrapositive? 

And yes, explained why, many times, but why does that make them right now?  And why does that not compromise their authority, especially when you insist we should listen to them always?  (PS, it doesn't.) 

Last, why did you so long to start talking about it?  Seems like you purposely ignored that until someone brought it up.  So what do we do if no solution is found to this?  Just stay inside and become like all of government run countries, or actually get out there and just have the courage to deal with it? 

[armand]

...
There's a new report out that the virus apparently causes blood clots that are killing many people, and that can apparently be handled with blood thinners. And there are other aspects of the disease that are being tracked down.
...

Yes, they seem to have more clotting issue than the average. It's unclear if it's the virus itself or the population demographics that's more affected by it.
One particularity though is that the usual blood thinners don't work too well on these patients and that's another problem in itself.


And one more time, maybe it will sink in for those who refuse to get it:
It's not just another flu.

Even if the mortality turns out to be similar, the sheer number of cases, severe cases in particular, that reach the hospital/week is much higher than any season of flu had for a very long time.
The fact that we get less cases now it's because the distancing works, and not because it's a hoax that dissipated in thin air. I know it's appealing to keep saying it that to yourself to justify whatever political objectives that you might have, but it gets old.

[armand]

Exactly explain that vise versa.  Are we talking about the converse, inverse, contrapositive? 

And yes, explained why, many times, but why does that make them right now?  And why does that not compromise their authority, especially when you insist we should listen to them always?  (PS, it doesn't.)

You can try to be a smartass but you know what I meant. They might not be wiser than you but chances are neither are you in comparison to them.

[JoeKitchen]

You can try to be a smartass but you know what I meant. They might not be wiser than you but chances are neither are you in comparison to them.

So you dont know the difference between a converse, inverse and contrapositive?  Not very reassuring, because vise versa could be either of those three. 

Really, be more specific, otherwise your statement has no weight. 

[Peter McLennan]

So you dont know the difference between a converse, inverse and contrapositive?  Not very reassuring... 

At least, however, he knows the difference between "loose" and "lose".