Innova Exhibition Photo Baryta 310gsm

[elliot_n]

I have had a print up of gloss baryta when it was made by Harman and it shows no yellowing. It has been up several years. So I don't know how much the obas affect this paper.

I'd be very interested in hearing from anyone who has experienced discolouring issues with the Hanhemuhle Gloss Baryta or its Harman predecessor. I've been using the paper since its inception, and I've never had any problems. But it's possible I haven't been looking hard enough.

[mearussi]

I'd be very interested in hearing from anyone who has experienced discolouring issues with the Hanhemuhle Gloss Baryta or its Harman predecessor. I've been using the paper since its inception, and I've never had any problems. But it's possible I haven't been looking hard enough.

It could also vary from batch to batch depending on how they're made. There are different quality grades of OBAs with some fading faster (or yellowing sooner) than others. If they use a cheaper grade one time and a more expensive another you could easily get that kind of variation in yellowing.

[BrianWJH]

It could also vary from batch to batch depending on how they're made. There are different quality grades of OBAs with some fading faster (or yellowing sooner) than others. If they use a cheaper grade one time and a more expensive another you could easily get that kind of variation in yellowing.

That's possible but one would hope that any reputable paper manufacturer would have quality standards that test batches to those quality standards for comformity.

Brian.

[mearussi]

That's possible but one would hope that any reputable paper manufacturer would have quality standards that test batches to those quality standards for comformity.

Brian.

Depends on who is making the manufacturing decisions at the moment, the designers or the bean counters. If the designers are in charge then you're right, the quality will be maintained, but if it's the bean counters the the first thing they usually do is to see how much they can lower the quality in order to boost quarterly profits (and thereby their bonuses). I've seen this happen too many times in the companies I've worked for--it's not a pretty sight.   

[JRSmit]

I can only report to folks the actual color of the paper, expressed in well known L* a* b* colorimetric terms.

Hold IFA-45 next to a sheet of Canson Platine in good light. You will immediately see the warmth of this paper compared to the more neutral appearing Canson Platine.

cheers,
Mark
http://www.aardenburg-imaging.com

This is true, in an A-B test or comparison. But once not directly compared such differences may no longer be observed.
Also one can tone the image prior to printing to compensate, be it only minor, and obviously not the white parts.

Canson  Platine, produced by Schoeller, has had its variations in whiteness over time / batches, check Ernst Dinkla’s SpecrtumViz app for this. By the way this particular paper is no longer mentioned in the Schoeller catalog, or website for that matter.

The human perception of white is dependent on the amount of light and its color temperature, check the diagram of Arie Andries Kruithof. It shows our capability to perceive white as white, but also when this no longer is the case.

[Alan Goldhammer]

Canson  Platine, produced by Schoeller, has had its variations in whiteness over time / batches, check Ernst Dinkla’s SpecrtumViz app for this. By the way this particular paper is no longer mentioned in the Schoeller catalog, or website for that matter.

Schoeller True Rag silk Satin seems to be a very close version of the Canson paper in the current Schoeller on-line listing.  I'm trying to find a replacement for Museo Silver Rag now that it has been discontinued.  I profiled Canson Plantine yesterday on my Canon Pro-1000 and it looks quite nice.  I'm running some comparisons now with the new batch of Moab Juniper Rag Baryta which is a slightly warmer paper than the Canson. 

[JRSmit]

Schoeller True Rag silk Satin seems to be a very close version of the Canson paper in the current Schoeller on-line listing.  I'm trying to find a replacement for Museo Silver Rag now that it has been discontinued.  I profiled Canson Plantine yesterday on my Canon Pro-1000 and it looks quite nice.  I'm running some comparisons now with the new batch of Moab Juniper Rag Baryta which is a slightly warmer paper than the Canson.

Not really the b value is about +2.2 , therefore warmer than the j23000 which had an b value of about 0. Also the texture and surface sheen is different.

[BrianWJH]

Alan, custom profiles generated for both Canson Platine and J24000 TRUE rag silk Satin 310 and the printed results for both papers appear identical to me on an Epson 9890.

Brian.

[Alan Goldhammer]

Not really the b value is about +2.2 , therefore warmer than the j23000. Also the texture and surface sheen is different.

I was just interested whether they were comparable.  I don't think Felix Schoeller papers are available in the US.  They are not carried by the companies I usually deal with/

[mshea]

I'm about ready to throw in the towel with Hahnemuhle Photo Gloss Baryta, due to the curling issues. Since working with my new P800 with the roll feeder, I've had problems with concentric white lines about 1/16" apart on the leading edge of the image. This seems to be happening on approx. the last 1/3 to 1/4 of the roll. Laying out a 35" to 40" sheet and uncurling it does solve the problem, but it's still a nuisance. I also have to uncurl my last sheets of 17 X 25". Otherwise, I get paper jambs (odd that this never happened with my 3880).

Aside from that, I love the quality of the Hahn prints. From what I've been reading, the Innova Exhibition Photo Baryta IF A69 looks like it might come pretty close to the Hahn, and it wouldn't have the curling problems. Is that the general consensus?

Innova doesn't make 17 X 25 sheets, so Red River seems to be the other option. Is there anything in RR that comes close to the Hahn?

Thanks for your thoughts.
Merrill

[mearussi]

I'm about ready to throw in the towel with Hahnemuhle Photo Gloss Baryta, due to the curling issues. Since working with my new P800 with the roll feeder, I've had problems with concentric white lines about 1/16" apart on the leading edge of the image. This seems to be happening on approx. the last 1/3 to 1/4 of the roll. Laying out a 35" to 40" sheet and uncurling it does solve the problem, but it's still a nuisance. I also have to uncurl my last sheets of 17 X 25". Otherwise, I get paper jambs (odd that this never happened with my 3880).

Aside from that, I love the quality of the Hahn prints. From what I've been reading, the Innova Exhibition Photo Baryta IF A69 looks like it might come pretty close to the Hahn, and it wouldn't have the curling problems. Is that the general consensus?

Innova doesn't make 17 X 25 sheets, so Red River seems to be the other option. Is there anything in RR that comes close to the Hahn?

Thanks for your thoughts.
Merrill

Any paper can have curling issues. I've been having this problem with Innova Art's IFA-45 that has sever curl. My understanding is that it's caused by the paper base absorbing the humidity from the air and swelling on the uncoated side causing it to expand and therefore curl. Some paper manufacturers are trying to combat this with double sided papers that are coated on both sides. I recently bought BC's River Stone Satin Rag and it seems to stay fairly flat so far (it does curl a bit when printed on one side, though). It's the only OBA free 2x coated PK paper I know of.

I'm also going to buy a few more 2x coated papers and see how they behave. I'm finding it a good idea in this day of paper shortages to have a knowledge of which papers are similar so if one is out I can order another.

BTW, yesterday I made a direct comparison using my IPF6400 between the BC's River Stone Rag, Hah's PR Pearl and Baryta and Innova's IFA-45 and found virtually no difference in appearance using their canned profiles and the color test chart with the graduated balls of color at the bottom (there were minor differences in how they rendered the balls):
http://www.digitaldog.net/tips-and-tricks.html (the gamut test file).

[mshea]

I've purchased a pack of Exhibition Photo Baryta for testing on my P-800. What paper type should I choose?

[Randy Carone]

The paper type to use is in the profile name (Innova_Epson-SC-P800_IFA69(PLPP)_PK_1440). The PLPP means Premium Luster Photo Paper, which is the setting you should use, along with the dpi used to make the profile.

[mshea]

The paper type to use is in the profile name (Innova_Epson-SC-P800_IFA69(PLPP)_PK_1440). The PLPP means Premium Luster Photo Paper, which is the setting you should use, along with the dpi used to make the profile.

I figured that might be the setting, since luster is the setting for Hahn Photo Gloss Baryta.

[SharonVL]

I'd be very interested in hearing from anyone who has experienced discolouring issues with the Hanhemuhle Gloss Baryta or its Harman predecessor. I've been using the paper since its inception, and I've never had any problems. But it's possible I haven't been looking hard enough.

I have gone back to using this paper as I have had no issues either and I love the surface. However, I'm having trouble finding it now. I hope it isn't another discontinued paper.

[mshea]

I checked with IT Supplies on Friday and they said Innova has it in stock, so I ordered a roll.

[dkaufman]

I recently ordered some Innova Exhibition Photo Baryta, both from Adorama and directly from Innova North America. Ordering from Innova directly is fairly fast (I am in Toronto, so there is customs to deal with which adds a couple of days to shipping) but more expensive for shipping. Adorama took more than six weeks to fill my order although Innova North America says it has a warehouse with plenty of stock in all sizes. B&H at the time I ordered also said it would take 2-4 weeks to get the order into its warehouse. So that's a bit of a mystery. The situation may have improved since then.

The good news is that Innova Exhibition Photo Baryta seems to be a near dead ringer for the original Canson Baryta Photographique and Epson's Legacy Baryta now discontinued. Innova claims there are no OBAs in its version, which I sort of doubt but have no ability to test, since the three papers are so similar as to be virtually impossible to tell apart. They all have fine-toothed luster finishes, the same paper base and thickness, and white colour that  is identical or nearly identical to the eye. With custom profiles, prints look the same on all three papers. There may be very slight differences in whiteness and sheen but they are not easily seen. In my communication with Innova there is no indication that this paper is discontinued unlike the other two, so for now it seems the Innova paper is a worthy replacement.

David Kaufman
www.davidkaufmanphotography.com

[MHMG]

The good news is that Innova Exhibition Photo Baryta seems to be a near dead ringer for the original Canson Baryta Photographique and Epson's Legacy Baryta now discontinued. Innova claims there are no OBAs in its version, which I sort of doubt but have no ability to test, since the three papers are so similar as to be virtually impossible to tell apart. They all have fine-toothed luster finishes, the same paper base and thickness, and white colour that  is identical or nearly identical to the eye. With custom profiles, prints look the same on all three papers. There may be very slight differences in whiteness and sheen but they are not easily seen. In my communication with Innova there is no indication that this paper is discontinued unlike the other two, so for now it seems the Innova paper is a worthy replacement.

David Kaufman
www.davidkaufmanphotography.com

Innova Exhibition Photo Baryta definitely has OBAs, otherwise it wouldn't be a "near dead ringer" for Canson Baryta Photographique (now replaced by Baryta Photographique II which differs) and Epson's Legacy Baryta (apparently now discontinue as well). I have a box of Innova Exhibition Photo Baryta here in my lab, and have personally confirmed the presence of OBAs with a UV LED as well as M0, M1, and M2 spectrophotometer measurements.

kind regards,
Mark
http://www.aardenburg-imaging.com

[JRSmit]

To my knowledge the innova paper that is available today is a new version. Basiscally the same as canson baryta photographiaue 2 .

[SharonVL]

I was referring to the Hahnemuhle Photo Gloss Baryta. I really love the surface. It seems to be in limited supplies.