How to Execute my Workflow in Lightroom

[dwswager]

I have finally capitulated to the Adobe Photography CC Extortion Plan and will be moving from Photoshop CS6.  Considering the plan includes Photoshop and Bridge I could maintain my workflow as is using ACR for NEF conversion.  But, if I was to try Lightroom, I am trying to figure out how to work LR's catalogue into my workflow.  I've read the PDF LR manual/help files on import.

My Workflow
1. Download Files from Card to Directory structucture on my computer
2. Review and select files
3. Delete files I know I will never use (I'm an apostate)
4. Use ACR to "develop" the raw file storing setting in XMP files
5. Move the files to my Server and backup to BD-M Disk
6. Delete from Main computer where originally downloaded.

Since to use the files in LR they must be imported into the catalog, I would have to use LR to move them to server or Delete them from LR and re import them from the server.

1. Is this correct?

2. Is there a mechanism in LR catalog for it to know where on the server while silmultaneously knowing the BD-M disk where the image is stored?  That is, can LR understand that the same photograph is in 2 different locations or must I create 2 different instances of the same photograph?

Thanks,
Dave

[bassman51]

1.  You are more or less correct.   
2.  AFAICT, LR assumes each image file is in only one place. 

However, you might want to rethink some of your workflow when using LR.  Part of the beauty of LR is that the image files are never modified.   So you could either use LR to directly import them into its catalog and move them to your server, or modify your process in step 4 to use LR to import and move  the non-deleted files to the server, then use LR to "develop" your files. It is the same engine as ACR, just with a different UI. 

You can also have LR make a second copy of the image files at import time.  These are renamed the same way as with the catalogued files, but never appear in the catalog or are referenced by LR.  This could be your backup. 

[aduke]

If you are talking about moving the developed files (.tif or .jpg) to your server, then you can do this by using the Export function. It will, quite happily, have two entries in the catalog that point to two different but identical copies of an image.

LR tries to protect you from having two copies of a raw image in two different folders, but that is a different case.

Alan

[luxborealis]

Some things to consider...

• You don't need to acquiesce to the Adobe Extortion Plan. You could purchase a standalone version of LR. There are more than a few of us here who hardly, if ever, use PS any more.
• Quit cold turkey and build your workflow from the ground up using LR.

• Import your images using the LR Import module. LR will know where your images are right away.
• Do all the things you are used to doing in ACR but do them in LR.

It's as simple as that!

Notes:
If you back up your computer drive regularly, then you don't need to have a separate BU for your photos.
LR can only keep track of one location for each file. To move files off my main computer,  I plug in my external drive and, from within LR, I navigate to that drive using the left Library panel, the click-hold-and-drag the folders(s) of images and move them from my computer to the drive. That way LR keeps track of where they are.

When that external HD is not plugged in, it is greyed out, but LR still has all the data for each image, plus a thumbnail, plus a Smart Preview, if I've made one. So my whole photo collection is still at my fingertips and can be searched, updated, key worded - even processed if you have Smart Previews - without the drive actually being plugged in.

This is part of the beauty of quitting cold turkey and going exclusively with LR as your digital asset management system (and raw processor and printer...).

If you think LR is not up to the task, you may be in for a surprise as its capabilities are far greater than many give it credit for. I cannot remember the last time I used PS.

[dwswager]

Thanks for the help.

I consider undeveloped to be the out of camera RAW files.  Developed may be just the RAW conversion settings.  I figure beyond that point, especially with some of the additions to the conversion processors that have been added, to be "finalized" or "targeted" but I can see where people would consider those non raw states as a developed state.

And I understand LR can replace ACR.  In fact, if it didn't I would't even consider it at all. 

My server is for storage (with backup on BD-M). These files date back even prior to my start on digital an include film scans.  These files may be revisited and include undeveloped RAW files, Developed RAW files and Developed PSD or TIFF files.  My goal is never to have to go back to the BD-M disks.

My main computer is where I do everything for current files and things I am working on at the time.

Since LR requires use of the catalog and backup (at least 2 copies of the same file) is not only a best practice, but a real necessity with digital storage, LR really needs to be upgraded to deal with this. It would actually make the catalog much more useful.

[fdisilvestro]

What I would do (all in LR):

1.- Download Files from Card directly to the final destination in the Server, building 1:1 previews (these reside on your main computer)
2.- Review, select, rate, delete in the LR library (the 1:1 previews will be really useful here)
3.- Process the desired images in the "Develop module". You can also build "smart previews" to be able to edit the images without being connected to the server where the images reside.

I would use a dedicated external application to take care of the backup to the BD-M disk. One example is CrashPlan (free for local backups), which will monitor your original files and backup only what has changed/added completely unattended, to one or more backup destinations.

Notes:
a) When you import an image in the LR catalog you are just creating a reference to the image in the folder/hard disk. Think that instead of having one XMP file for each image you have one record in a database with the same (and more) information as in the XMP file.

b) You can set up the expiration time for the 1:1 previews in the catalog settings if you are worried about the space in your local computer

My Workflow
1. Download Files from Card to Directory structucture on my computer
2. Review and select files
3. Delete files I know I will never use (I'm an apostate)
4. Use ACR to "develop" the raw file storing setting in XMP files
5. Move the files to my Server and backup to BD-M Disk
6. Delete from Main computer where originally downloaded.

Since to use the files in LR they must be imported into the catalog, I would have to use LR to move them to server or Delete them from LR and re import them from the server.

1. Is this correct?

2. Is there a mechanism in LR catalog for it to know where on the server while silmultaneously knowing the BD-M disk where the image is stored?  That is, can LR understand that the same photograph is in 2 different locations or must I create 2 different instances of the same photograph?

Thanks,
Dave

[aduke]

I agree with all of Francisco's points. Let LR do everything possible. If you use Photoshop or LR extensions by NIK or others, LR will allow you to keep the references to the developed files in the catalog, whereever you've put them in the file system.

Both the catalog and the developed files should be backed up from their known positions so that if there is a disk failure in any of the disks, the only problem will be to restore them from the backup.

In my situation, I do not even backup the previews, LR will restore them whenever necessary.

Alan

[luxborealis]

Since LR requires use of the catalog and backup (at least 2 copies of the same file) is not only a best practice, but a real necessity with digital storage, LR really needs to be upgraded to deal with this. It would actually make the catalog much more useful.

Not sure I'm following you on this... A back-up is just that - an exact copy of the original. It doesn't make sense for LR to keep track of both the original and the back-up as you would only ever want to edit the original, which then gets backed up. Imagine the problems if, mistakenly, you edit the back-up because it is accessible through LR.

[dwswager]

Not sure I'm following you on this... A back-up is just that - an exact copy of the original. It doesn't make sense for LR to keep track of both the original and the back-up as you would only ever want to edit the original, which then gets backed up. Imagine the problems if, mistakenly, you edit the back-up because it is accessible through LR.

First, the backup is the original.  The image on the SD, CF, XQD card is the original.  It gets copied to the computer as an original and then it gets backed up as an original.  That is the point of the backup...to have a 2nd copy of the original file.

The point of the catalog is to keep track of where files are located.  It is a tremendous amount of hassle and computer cycles to achieve this location service.  If you have a single file or directory or disk go bad, does it not make sense to know where those files that are bad are located in your backups?

[dwswager]

What I would do (all in LR):

1.- Download Files from Card directly to the final destination in the Server, building 1:1 previews (these reside on your main computer)
2.- Review, select, rate, delete in the LR library (the 1:1 previews will be really useful here)
3.- Process the desired images in the "Develop module". You can also build "smart previews" to be able to edit the images without being connected to the server where the images reside.

I would use a dedicated external application to take care of the backup to the BD-M disk. One example is CrashPlan (free for local backups), which will monitor your original files and backup only what has changed/added completely unattended, to one or more backup destinations.

Notes:
a) When you import an image in the LR catalog you are just creating a reference to the image in the folder/hard disk. Think that instead of having one XMP file for each image you have one record in a database with the same (and more) information as in the XMP file.

b) You can set up the expiration time for the 1:1 previews in the catalog settings if you are worried about the space in your local computer

Hmm...this sounds like a decent option.  My only downside is the 100MB ethernet connection to the server because of the distance from the server (near my router, cable modem and Home Theater PC) to my computer and the Cat5+ wiring in my house.  Gigabit ethernet would be more suitable for downloading the 32GB cards.  Been meaning to update my wiring and setup.

I just loaded LR CC on my laptop and it is asking about "upgrading the catalog".  OK, how should it be setup if I have a laptop as a 2nd LR computer and my Desktop as my main LR computer?  Do you have 2 catalogs or share a catalog somehow.  With Bridge, I had it export the Cache to the folder and so no matter what computer I used it just read the cache from folder.

Just had my first fail.  Tried to import one image from a card to play with it and lightroom decided it wanted to import the whole card.  Took the card out cause I'm afraid lightroom will delete the file from the card if I delete the file.

[aduke]

On import, if  you use the copy function, LR will copy the image from the card to your disk and forget about the card and its content. If you never erase the card, you have a copy of the image until it decays on the card.

I import images from the card to my hard disk, into a folder in the chain LR Images, year, year-month-day. I do not erase the card until my backup software creates a copy of the image from its location in the hard disk. If the image in the hard disk becomes damaged, I can restore it from backup. LR will not notice or care that the image was restored, all of the change instructions are kept in the catalog, rather than the image.

Generally I have, at most, three versions of an image, the RAW, sometimes a TIF, and for printed images, a soft-proof virtual copy. Since I only print to one printer, only one soft-proof virtual copy is required.

This structure works well on a fairly recent Dell desktop running Windows managing the 28000 total images in my catalog.

Alan

[Rhossydd]

lightroom decided it wanted to import the whole card.

No, you have a choice over that.

Before getting stuck into a radical change of workflow, watch the tutorial videos on Lightroom on Lula and the 'where are by *** are my photos' video by Michael and Seth.
Then you should have a better understanding of what is good practice and how to simplify your workflow.

[fdisilvestro]

My only downside is the 100MB ethernet connection to the server because of the distance from the server (near my router, cable modem and Home Theater PC) to my computer and the Cat5+ wiring in my house.  Gigabit ethernet would be more suitable for downloading the 32GB cards.  Been meaning to update my wiring and setup.

If your connection to the server is slow then it makes sense to initially have the images locally in your computer while you edit them and later move them to the long term archival destination. You can manage this from inside the LR Library.

I just loaded LR CC on my laptop and it is asking about "upgrading the catalog".  OK, how should it be setup if I have a laptop as a 2nd LR computer and my Desktop as my main LR computer?  Do you have 2 catalogs or share a catalog somehow.  With Bridge, I had it export the Cache to the folder and so no matter what computer I used it just read the cache from folder.

The point of the catalog is to keep track of where files are located.  It is a tremendous amount of hassle and computer cycles to achieve this location service.  If you have a single file or directory or disk go bad, does it not make sense to know where those files that are bad are located in your backups?

I think you are asking too much for a rather inexpensive tool. LR uses a SQLite database, which is intended as a single user & local database, so just trying to work with two computers with the same catalog is out of the original scope.

Detecting that a file/folder/disk is broken and redirect to the backup is a rather sophisiticated functionality which not even expensive mission-critical enterprise grade applications have at the database/application level. This is usually handled by specialized tools and redundant storage arrays.

On the other hand, the LR catalog is much more than a tool "to keep track of where the files are located" and it is really not that resource consuming as you might think.

Before getting stuck into a radical change of workflow, watch the tutorial videos on Lightroom on Lula and the 'where are by *** are my photos' video by Michael and Seth.
Then you should have a better understanding of what is good practice and how to simplify your workflow.

I agree, this is a good advice

[dwswager]

No, you have a choice over that.

Before getting stuck into a radical change of workflow, watch the tutorial videos on Lightroom on Lula and the 'where are by *** are my photos' video by Michael and Seth.
Then you should have a better understanding of what is good practice and how to simplify your workflow.

Thanks all for the help!

Yes, I think a bit of instruction and learning is in order.  And it looks like if I choose to go with LR, I will need to alter my workflow to suit LR.  I tried LR 4 some time ago with this same issue.  I've been using Photoshop since version 2 and Bridge and ACR since they appeared.

I must say, however, that the develop instructions can be written into the RAW file, into a sidecar xmp and apparently lightroom rights it into the catalog.   Which, of course, means that the corruption of the single catalog file would result in the loss of years worth of effort.  That downright terrifies me.

[Rhossydd]

I must say, however, that the develop instructions can be written into the RAW file, into a sidecar xmp and apparently lightroom rights it into the catalog.   Which, of course, means that the corruption of the single catalog file would result in the loss of years worth of effort.  That downright terrifies me.

You really do need to take a pause to understand how LR works.

Firstly; Lightroom won't alter original RAW files.(excepting a few obscure time stamp changes you can choose)

Allowing LR to have xmp sidecars means that even if you loose the LR catalogue, the develop settings and edits will be easy to recover from the side car files and may be usable by other converters (But make the effort to understand how that decision might change your workflow, eg backing up the xmps as they change).

LR has several options to automatically backup the catalogue when quitting LR. The catalogue is overall pretty small, so takes up little HDD space. It's a no brainer to enable this and will ensure you're never far behind if disaster strikes.

[john beardsworth]

I must say, however, that the develop instructions can be written into the RAW file, into a sidecar xmp and apparently lightroom rights it into the catalog.   Which, of course, means that the corruption of the single catalog file would result in the loss of years worth of effort.  That downright terrifies me.

Well, it happens very rarely indeed, and has no impact if you back up your catalogue as you should do. The catalogue contains all your work - xmp doesn't.

On the other hand,  the catalogue provides great benefit such as allowing alternative versions of your images to be created without extra disc usage ("virtual copies") and allows a range of other features such as retention of Develop history steps (so you can undo years later, or do before-after comparisons against previous versions). A catalogue also records what should be on your hard drive, so it safeguards your images in a way that's beyond the ability of a glorified Explorer/Finder like Bridge.

John

[aduke]

I use the LR catalog backup functionality to guard against catalog corruption. This means that the catalog is optimized and copied by LR every time I exit LR. The Lr catalog backups are not backed up by my file backup process.

If I open LR some day and find the catalog has been corrupted, I can use the LR-backup catalogs to restore functionality and content back to what it was yesterday or, if necessary, a few days before.

Alan

[Rhossydd]

The Lr catalog backups are not backed up by my file backup process.

Seems a potentially short sighted approach.

[aduke]

But the catalog and images are, so I'm willing to risk two failures, one on the disk (writing to the catalog file) and a total failure of the disk.

I've been in the computer business for over 50 years and, although multiple independent failures are not unknown, they are quite rare.

Alan

[fdisilvestro]

I'm with Rhossydd here, I do backup the LR catalog backups too. One important step that LR does when creating the catalog backup is the integrity check, which helps detect any potential issues.

although multiple independent failures are not unknown, they are quite rare.

After having experienced not one but two multiple independent failures in mission-critical systems, I think I developed a computer-PSTD, so my comment is: There is no such thing as too many backups.