Luminous Landscape Forum
Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Adobe Lightroom Q&A => Topic started by: dwswager on March 26, 2016, 12:45:05 pm
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I have finally capitulated to the Adobe Photography CC Extortion Plan and will be moving from Photoshop CS6. Considering the plan includes Photoshop and Bridge I could maintain my workflow as is using ACR for NEF conversion. But, if I was to try Lightroom, I am trying to figure out how to work LR's catalogue into my workflow. I've read the PDF LR manual/help files on import.
My Workflow
1. Download Files from Card to Directory structucture on my computer
2. Review and select files
3. Delete files I know I will never use (I'm an apostate)
4. Use ACR to "develop" the raw file storing setting in XMP files
5. Move the files to my Server and backup to BD-M Disk
6. Delete from Main computer where originally downloaded.
Since to use the files in LR they must be imported into the catalog, I would have to use LR to move them to server or Delete them from LR and re import them from the server.
1. Is this correct?
2. Is there a mechanism in LR catalog for it to know where on the server while silmultaneously knowing the BD-M disk where the image is stored? That is, can LR understand that the same photograph is in 2 different locations or must I create 2 different instances of the same photograph?
Thanks,
Dave
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1. You are more or less correct.
2. AFAICT, LR assumes each image file is in only one place.
However, you might want to rethink some of your workflow when using LR. Part of the beauty of LR is that the image files are never modified. So you could either use LR to directly import them into its catalog and move them to your server, or modify your process in step 4 to use LR to import and move the non-deleted files to the server, then use LR to "develop" your files. It is the same engine as ACR, just with a different UI.
You can also have LR make a second copy of the image files at import time. These are renamed the same way as with the catalogued files, but never appear in the catalog or are referenced by LR. This could be your backup.
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If you are talking about moving the developed files (.tif or .jpg) to your server, then you can do this by using the Export function. It will, quite happily, have two entries in the catalog that point to two different but identical copies of an image.
LR tries to protect you from having two copies of a raw image in two different folders, but that is a different case.
Alan
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Some things to consider...
- You don't need to acquiesce to the Adobe Extortion Plan. You could purchase a standalone version of LR. There are more than a few of us here who hardly, if ever, use PS any more.
- Quit cold turkey and build your workflow from the ground up using LR.
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- Import your images using the LR Import module. LR will know where your images are right away.
- Do all the things you are used to doing in ACR but do them in LR.
It's as simple as that!
Notes:
If you back up your computer drive regularly, then you don't need to have a separate BU for your photos.
LR can only keep track of one location for each file. To move files off my main computer, I plug in my external drive and, from within LR, I navigate to that drive using the left Library panel, the click-hold-and-drag the folders(s) of images and move them from my computer to the drive. That way LR keeps track of where they are.
When that external HD is not plugged in, it is greyed out, but LR still has all the data for each image, plus a thumbnail, plus a Smart Preview, if I've made one. So my whole photo collection is still at my fingertips and can be searched, updated, key worded - even processed if you have Smart Previews - without the drive actually being plugged in.
This is part of the beauty of quitting cold turkey and going exclusively with LR as your digital asset management system (and raw processor and printer...).
If you think LR is not up to the task, you may be in for a surprise as its capabilities are far greater than many give it credit for. I cannot remember the last time I used PS.
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Thanks for the help.
I consider undeveloped to be the out of camera RAW files. Developed may be just the RAW conversion settings. I figure beyond that point, especially with some of the additions to the conversion processors that have been added, to be "finalized" or "targeted" but I can see where people would consider those non raw states as a developed state.
And I understand LR can replace ACR. In fact, if it didn't I would't even consider it at all.
My server is for storage (with backup on BD-M). These files date back even prior to my start on digital an include film scans. These files may be revisited and include undeveloped RAW files, Developed RAW files and Developed PSD or TIFF files. My goal is never to have to go back to the BD-M disks.
My main computer is where I do everything for current files and things I am working on at the time.
Since LR requires use of the catalog and backup (at least 2 copies of the same file) is not only a best practice, but a real necessity with digital storage, LR really needs to be upgraded to deal with this. It would actually make the catalog much more useful.
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What I would do (all in LR):
1.- Download Files from Card directly to the final destination in the Server, building 1:1 previews (these reside on your main computer)
2.- Review, select, rate, delete in the LR library (the 1:1 previews will be really useful here)
3.- Process the desired images in the "Develop module". You can also build "smart previews" to be able to edit the images without being connected to the server where the images reside.
I would use a dedicated external application to take care of the backup to the BD-M disk. One example is CrashPlan (free for local backups), which will monitor your original files and backup only what has changed/added completely unattended, to one or more backup destinations.
Notes:
a) When you import an image in the LR catalog you are just creating a reference to the image in the folder/hard disk. Think that instead of having one XMP file for each image you have one record in a database with the same (and more) information as in the XMP file.
b) You can set up the expiration time for the 1:1 previews in the catalog settings if you are worried about the space in your local computer
My Workflow
1. Download Files from Card to Directory structucture on my computer
2. Review and select files
3. Delete files I know I will never use (I'm an apostate)
4. Use ACR to "develop" the raw file storing setting in XMP files
5. Move the files to my Server and backup to BD-M Disk
6. Delete from Main computer where originally downloaded.
Since to use the files in LR they must be imported into the catalog, I would have to use LR to move them to server or Delete them from LR and re import them from the server.
1. Is this correct?
2. Is there a mechanism in LR catalog for it to know where on the server while silmultaneously knowing the BD-M disk where the image is stored? That is, can LR understand that the same photograph is in 2 different locations or must I create 2 different instances of the same photograph?
Thanks,
Dave
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I agree with all of Francisco's points. Let LR do everything possible. If you use Photoshop or LR extensions by NIK or others, LR will allow you to keep the references to the developed files in the catalog, whereever you've put them in the file system.
Both the catalog and the developed files should be backed up from their known positions so that if there is a disk failure in any of the disks, the only problem will be to restore them from the backup.
In my situation, I do not even backup the previews, LR will restore them whenever necessary.
Alan
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Since LR requires use of the catalog and backup (at least 2 copies of the same file) is not only a best practice, but a real necessity with digital storage, LR really needs to be upgraded to deal with this. It would actually make the catalog much more useful.
Not sure I'm following you on this... A back-up is just that - an exact copy of the original. It doesn't make sense for LR to keep track of both the original and the back-up as you would only ever want to edit the original, which then gets backed up. Imagine the problems if, mistakenly, you edit the back-up because it is accessible through LR.
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Not sure I'm following you on this... A back-up is just that - an exact copy of the original. It doesn't make sense for LR to keep track of both the original and the back-up as you would only ever want to edit the original, which then gets backed up. Imagine the problems if, mistakenly, you edit the back-up because it is accessible through LR.
First, the backup is the original. The image on the SD, CF, XQD card is the original. It gets copied to the computer as an original and then it gets backed up as an original. That is the point of the backup...to have a 2nd copy of the original file.
The point of the catalog is to keep track of where files are located. It is a tremendous amount of hassle and computer cycles to achieve this location service. If you have a single file or directory or disk go bad, does it not make sense to know where those files that are bad are located in your backups?
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What I would do (all in LR):
1.- Download Files from Card directly to the final destination in the Server, building 1:1 previews (these reside on your main computer)
2.- Review, select, rate, delete in the LR library (the 1:1 previews will be really useful here)
3.- Process the desired images in the "Develop module". You can also build "smart previews" to be able to edit the images without being connected to the server where the images reside.
I would use a dedicated external application to take care of the backup to the BD-M disk. One example is CrashPlan (free for local backups), which will monitor your original files and backup only what has changed/added completely unattended, to one or more backup destinations.
Notes:
a) When you import an image in the LR catalog you are just creating a reference to the image in the folder/hard disk. Think that instead of having one XMP file for each image you have one record in a database with the same (and more) information as in the XMP file.
b) You can set up the expiration time for the 1:1 previews in the catalog settings if you are worried about the space in your local computer
Hmm...this sounds like a decent option. My only downside is the 100MB ethernet connection to the server because of the distance from the server (near my router, cable modem and Home Theater PC) to my computer and the Cat5+ wiring in my house. Gigabit ethernet would be more suitable for downloading the 32GB cards. Been meaning to update my wiring and setup.
I just loaded LR CC on my laptop and it is asking about "upgrading the catalog". OK, how should it be setup if I have a laptop as a 2nd LR computer and my Desktop as my main LR computer? Do you have 2 catalogs or share a catalog somehow. With Bridge, I had it export the Cache to the folder and so no matter what computer I used it just read the cache from folder.
Just had my first fail. Tried to import one image from a card to play with it and lightroom decided it wanted to import the whole card. Took the card out cause I'm afraid lightroom will delete the file from the card if I delete the file.
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On import, if you use the copy function, LR will copy the image from the card to your disk and forget about the card and its content. If you never erase the card, you have a copy of the image until it decays on the card.
I import images from the card to my hard disk, into a folder in the chain LR Images, year, year-month-day. I do not erase the card until my backup software creates a copy of the image from its location in the hard disk. If the image in the hard disk becomes damaged, I can restore it from backup. LR will not notice or care that the image was restored, all of the change instructions are kept in the catalog, rather than the image.
Generally I have, at most, three versions of an image, the RAW, sometimes a TIF, and for printed images, a soft-proof virtual copy. Since I only print to one printer, only one soft-proof virtual copy is required.
This structure works well on a fairly recent Dell desktop running Windows managing the 28000 total images in my catalog.
Alan
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lightroom decided it wanted to import the whole card.
No, you have a choice over that.
Before getting stuck into a radical change of workflow, watch the tutorial videos on Lightroom on Lula and the 'where are by *** are my photos' video by Michael and Seth.
Then you should have a better understanding of what is good practice and how to simplify your workflow.
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My only downside is the 100MB ethernet connection to the server because of the distance from the server (near my router, cable modem and Home Theater PC) to my computer and the Cat5+ wiring in my house. Gigabit ethernet would be more suitable for downloading the 32GB cards. Been meaning to update my wiring and setup.
If your connection to the server is slow then it makes sense to initially have the images locally in your computer while you edit them and later move them to the long term archival destination. You can manage this from inside the LR Library.
I just loaded LR CC on my laptop and it is asking about "upgrading the catalog". OK, how should it be setup if I have a laptop as a 2nd LR computer and my Desktop as my main LR computer? Do you have 2 catalogs or share a catalog somehow. With Bridge, I had it export the Cache to the folder and so no matter what computer I used it just read the cache from folder.
The point of the catalog is to keep track of where files are located. It is a tremendous amount of hassle and computer cycles to achieve this location service. If you have a single file or directory or disk go bad, does it not make sense to know where those files that are bad are located in your backups?
I think you are asking too much for a rather inexpensive tool. LR uses a SQLite database, which is intended as a single user & local database, so just trying to work with two computers with the same catalog is out of the original scope.
Detecting that a file/folder/disk is broken and redirect to the backup is a rather sophisiticated functionality which not even expensive mission-critical enterprise grade applications have at the database/application level. This is usually handled by specialized tools and redundant storage arrays.
On the other hand, the LR catalog is much more than a tool "to keep track of where the files are located" and it is really not that resource consuming as you might think.
Before getting stuck into a radical change of workflow, watch the tutorial videos on Lightroom on Lula and the 'where are by *** are my photos' video by Michael and Seth.
Then you should have a better understanding of what is good practice and how to simplify your workflow.
I agree, this is a good advice
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No, you have a choice over that.
Before getting stuck into a radical change of workflow, watch the tutorial videos on Lightroom on Lula and the 'where are by *** are my photos' video by Michael and Seth.
Then you should have a better understanding of what is good practice and how to simplify your workflow.
Thanks all for the help!
Yes, I think a bit of instruction and learning is in order. And it looks like if I choose to go with LR, I will need to alter my workflow to suit LR. I tried LR 4 some time ago with this same issue. I've been using Photoshop since version 2 and Bridge and ACR since they appeared.
I must say, however, that the develop instructions can be written into the RAW file, into a sidecar xmp and apparently lightroom rights it into the catalog. Which, of course, means that the corruption of the single catalog file would result in the loss of years worth of effort. That downright terrifies me.
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I must say, however, that the develop instructions can be written into the RAW file, into a sidecar xmp and apparently lightroom rights it into the catalog. Which, of course, means that the corruption of the single catalog file would result in the loss of years worth of effort. That downright terrifies me.
You really do need to take a pause to understand how LR works.
Firstly; Lightroom won't alter original RAW files.(excepting a few obscure time stamp changes you can choose)
Allowing LR to have xmp sidecars means that even if you loose the LR catalogue, the develop settings and edits will be easy to recover from the side car files and may be usable by other converters (But make the effort to understand how that decision might change your workflow, eg backing up the xmps as they change).
LR has several options to automatically backup the catalogue when quitting LR. The catalogue is overall pretty small, so takes up little HDD space. It's a no brainer to enable this and will ensure you're never far behind if disaster strikes.
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I must say, however, that the develop instructions can be written into the RAW file, into a sidecar xmp and apparently lightroom rights it into the catalog. Which, of course, means that the corruption of the single catalog file would result in the loss of years worth of effort. That downright terrifies me.
Well, it happens very rarely indeed, and has no impact if you back up your catalogue as you should do. The catalogue contains all your work - xmp doesn't.
On the other hand, the catalogue provides great benefit such as allowing alternative versions of your images to be created without extra disc usage ("virtual copies") and allows a range of other features such as retention of Develop history steps (so you can undo years later, or do before-after comparisons against previous versions). A catalogue also records what should be on your hard drive, so it safeguards your images in a way that's beyond the ability of a glorified Explorer/Finder like Bridge.
John
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I use the LR catalog backup functionality to guard against catalog corruption. This means that the catalog is optimized and copied by LR every time I exit LR. The Lr catalog backups are not backed up by my file backup process.
If I open LR some day and find the catalog has been corrupted, I can use the LR-backup catalogs to restore functionality and content back to what it was yesterday or, if necessary, a few days before.
Alan
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The Lr catalog backups are not backed up by my file backup process.
Seems a potentially short sighted approach.
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But the catalog and images are, so I'm willing to risk two failures, one on the disk (writing to the catalog file) and a total failure of the disk.
I've been in the computer business for over 50 years and, although multiple independent failures are not unknown, they are quite rare.
Alan
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I'm with Rhossydd here, I do backup the LR catalog backups too. One important step that LR does when creating the catalog backup is the integrity check, which helps detect any potential issues.
although multiple independent failures are not unknown, they are quite rare.
After having experienced not one but two multiple independent failures in mission-critical systems, I think I developed a computer-PSTD, so my comment is: There is no such thing as too many backups.
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But the catalog and images are, so I'm willing to risk two failures, one on the disk (writing to the catalog file) and a total failure of the disk.
I've been in the computer business for over 50 years and, although multiple independent failures are not unknown, they are quite rare.
Given the very modest size of the catalogue back ups, it seems churlish not to add them to the bu list.
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I have finally capitulated to the Adobe Photography CC Extortion Plan and will be moving from Photoshop CS6. Considering the plan includes Photoshop and Bridge I could maintain my workflow as is using ACR for NEF conversion. But, if I was to try Lightroom, I am trying to figure out how to work LR's catalogue into my workflow. I've read the PDF LR manual/help files on import.
My Workflow
1. Download Files from Card to Directory structucture on my computer
2. Review and select files
3. Delete files I know I will never use (I'm an apostate)
4. Use ACR to "develop" the raw file storing setting in XMP files
5. Move the files to my Server and backup to BD-M Disk
6. Delete from Main computer where originally downloaded.
Since to use the files in LR they must be imported into the catalog, I would have to use LR to move them to server or Delete them from LR and re import them from the server.
1. Is this correct?
2. Is there a mechanism in LR catalog for it to know where on the server while silmultaneously knowing the BD-M disk where the image is stored? That is, can LR understand that the same photograph is in 2 different locations or must I create 2 different instances of the same photograph?
Thanks,
Dave
Rather than answering your questions directly it might be better to just answer by showing my workflow using Lightroom.
I have a single machine (MacBook Pro 15" with an external monitor in my office). My images are spread across the internal drive on the MBP for the newest images and an external LaCie drive for the rest.
Backup is done via TimeMachine (TM) for the MBP itself and for the LaCie drive it is synchronized with two other drives in my office. The MBP and the external drive is also backed up in the cloud using Backblaze.
On my travels I have a copy of the LaCie drive on a portable 3TB drive and I have two portable drives for TM backup. Before any trip the two IM backups are run so that I always have a backup at home if I get all stolen on a trip.
For each trip I create a new folder on the internal drive on the MBP with the standard <year>.<month> <trip name>
After the first shoot on a new trip I will during import create and select the new folder name and import the images directly from the SD card reader in the MBP to that folder. On import I have a preset that I apply that sets my default sharpening for landscapes (fine detail), lens correction and the camera profile I want. I also generate 1:1 previews so that I quickly can check images for sharpness, focus etc. I also have a day folder selected below the main folder.
For subsequent imports they images are imported into the same folder and the day folders below are automatically created by Lightroom for each new day.
After import I will run the TimeMachine backups. On my trip the cloud backup is disabled as rarely is there a WiFi that can handle this bandwidth. I keep the two TM backups in different places.
On a trip I rarely delete any files, but I will do some rating and processes some of the pictures. I also apply keywords and I also geotag all my files.
Back home in my office I will typically not delete any files until several months has passed and I have looked at the images with fresh eyes. Then I will do the rating process and delete anything that has not reached a certain level of star rating. In this way I can keep the volume of files down rather than keeping everything.
To protect my catalog I will regularly make a Lightroom catalog backup which also gets backed up by the TM backups. I have never lost a Lightroom catalog.
I do not create any pixel level files unless I need to edit in Photoshop or any other external application that does the edits on pixels. More than 95% of my entire collection of images only lives as a RAW file with edits in Lightroom. I do printing directly from Lightroom with shot proofing as needed in Lightroom. I upload images to my websites hosted by Smugmug and Zenfolio using the publish feature in Lightroom. For posting of images elsewhere I export small JPG files which I upload manually (Facebook page, G+, 500px, etc.)
Notice I have a copy of all my images with me on a trip, so if I need to send a file to somebody I can change the folder settings in Lightroom to point to the portable drive folders instead of the LaCie drive in my office. When back in office I switch the folder locations back to the Lacie drive. This is done by having all my trip folders under one or two folders which makes switching easy as I only have to tell Lightroom the location of the "superfolder(s)" and not all the trip folders (as they are below the superfolder).
I hope this is usefull :D
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I'm with Rhossydd here, I do backup the LR catalog backups too. One important step that LR does when creating the catalog backup is the integrity check, which helps detect any potential issues.
After having experienced not one but two multiple independent failures in mission-critical systems, I think I developed a computer-PSTD, so my comment is: There is no such thing as too many backups.
I agree as I have written in another post following yours. I have 4 TimeMachine backups for my main machine (2 in the office and 2 on the road). I have 2 backups (synchronized) from my main external LaCie drive in my office and one portable for the road. In addition a clouds backup of everything. I have spent 20 years in the fault tolerant computer business so I also developed some nerdy habits ;D ;)
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Wanted to add an update and thanks for advice. I have now joined the Adobe CC Photography plan at $7.99/ month. The benefits of ACR 9.5 (both from bridge and lightroom) became too compelling over verion 7.1.
1. Lightroom cannot supplant Bridge. For most sports shoots, I do a first cull to about 10%-15% and I do it from the Memory Card. Lightroom can't do this due to Adobe's limitation of having to move images when importing from a card.
2. I have not fully embraced lightroom, but it will take 2 catalogs. A "working" catalog and a "Historical" catalog. No way around that due to the limitations of LR.
3. While the DAM functionality of LR surpasses Bridge, if you keep your images in a single directory tree, Bridge gets you almost all the way there and has additionally functionality LR does not. The benefit of LR is precisely that it can draw from varied locations and maintains the location without you having to know or keep track. LR also allows the "artificial" collections that Bridge lacks.
4. The use of some plugins seem clunky within LR versus natural in Photoshop. I suppose this is because LR is a RAW converter at heart while Photoshop is designed for working with the converted file and most plug-in also need to work with the converted file.
5 I have come to see the wisdom of the Photography plan including Bridge, LR and PS. If you use LR alone, you have either changed or designed your workflow around it's limitations. With the entire set, you can take the shortest path, if you are willing to study the map.
Thanks for all the help.
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Lightroom can't do this due to Adobe's limitation of having to move images when importing from a card.
So you still haven't understood the import process and options then.
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So you still haven't understood the import process and options then.
Yes, I understand. Adobe instituted a limitation in LR that if the photos to be imported are on a memory card, the images must be moved or copied. If the images are on a hard drive, you can simply import them to catalog and leave them where they are. I understand the overall logic of this choice, but it means I cannot do a first cull (using flags, ratings or labels) of say 1200 RAW files down to say 250 without downloading of the card. While I will eventually download the remaining 250 images, there is no point of downloading the other 950, especially when I am doing it from a wireless laptop designed for portability and not speed. This is a task Bridge handles with aplomb.
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When you're in the IMPORT dialog you can view photos from any connected device and that includes a CF or SD card. That allows you to do the culling BEFORE actual import simply by unchecking the photos you don't want to import.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYKzz2a5Mts&feature=youtu.be
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When you're in the IMPORT dialog you can view photos from any connected device and that includes a CF or SD card. That allows you to do the culling BEFORE actual import simply by unchecking the photos you don't want to import.
Yes, I can bend my workflow to make that work. However, I do not want to eventually import those items to my laptop. Hence, when I have checked/unchecked the images based on this first call, it has bought me nothing. I could copy the files to my deskop, but the wireless connection to the router and then 100MB Ethernet connection to the desktop would make this extremely tedious.
Here is how I work. I shoot the images. I come home, plop my equipment down. Take the memory card, pop it into my laptop and plant my backside into an Ekones Stressless Chair in front of my 60 inch TV. I then do a first pass through the images selecting those and possibly adding labels/ratings. All non passing images are deleted from the card. At some later time, I take the card to my desktop and import them into LR "Working Catalog" copying the images to a set of mirrored drives on my desktop. When I have worked them, I then move them to my server and import them into the LR "Historical Catalog".
My larger point is that I have access to Bridge, Photoshop and LR through the Adobe CC Photography Plan. In this case Bridge is, by far, the best tool for the job. If all I had was LR (the original genesis of this topic), then I would probably do it different and directly on the desktop. But I don't have to bend my will to LR because I have access to Bridge!
If the only tool you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail!
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You have chosen your specific workflow that you don't want to alter and that's fine. If Bridge is your choice that's fine as well.
Just don't assume that your workflow is based on flaws or shortcomings in Lightroom. Many of us are doing shoots with a thousand photos that need culling and use Lightroom successfully. We also put photos on multiple redundant arrays and use more than one Lightroom catalog. All that without the use of Bridge.
We're all happy that you find Adobe CC Photography is adaptable to your needs.
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Here is how I work. I shoot the images. I come home, plop my equipment down. Take the memory card, pop it into my laptop and plant my backside into an Ekones Stressless Chair in front of my 60 inch TV. I then do a first pass through the images selecting those and possibly adding labels/ratings. All non passing images are deleted from the card.
I understand your workflow and I agree that LR is not a good tool if you want to cull the images in the memory card. Moreover, culling in the LR import dialog is next to useless. In any case I would consider using FastRawViewer for that job and you can assign ratings there too at at much higher speed
I take the card to my desktop and import them into LR "Working Catalog" copying the images to a set of mirrored drives on my desktop. When I have worked them, I then move them to my server and import them into the LR "Historical Catalog".
I don't understand this part of the workflow. Unless you need to have two simultaneous users, one in the "working" and another in the "Historical", I see no reason to split the library this way, at least there is no technological reason to do so.
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2. I have not fully embraced lightroom, but it will take 2 catalogs. A "working" catalog and a "Historical" catalog. No way around that due to the limitations of LR.
I fail to understand this statement. I have used only a single LR catalog since day 1.
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First, I wish to apologize if any took offense, especially since the original intent of this topic was precisely how to execute my workflow in LR vice Bridge/PS. While I could develop a workflow based only on LR that would work, it would be less efficient and effective for me. And since I now that have access to all 3 via the photography CC plan, I don't need to do that either.
Let me be clear, LR and Bridge have different strengths and weaknesses and entirely different operating paradigms. There will be some workflows (or parts thereof) and tasks better handled in one versus the other. The trick is knowing which is better suited. Hence why I see the wisdom of the photography plan versus LR CC alone. Adobe apparently understood this. Those that work solely in Bridge probably have tasks better handled via LR and vice versa.
I don't understand this part of the workflow. Unless you need to have two simultaneous users, one in the "working" and another in the "Historical", I see no reason to split the library this way, at least there is no technological reason to do so.
This is based on how I work. I import to my local desktop to do the work. Once that has occurred and I've used the images for their initial intended purposes, they get moved to my server for storage and alternate use at a later date. I could do this in a single catalog, but it is just easier to separate them and work in smaller ones. I also have Lightroom and Bridge output xmp to the individual folders. I also have Bridge/PS/LR on my laptop, but only use that when away from home because the laptop is small and slow and lacks a great screen (though it is kept calibrated). It was bought for it's 12hr battery life.
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I fail to understand this statement. I have used only a single LR catalog since day 1.
And you designed your workflow around that. I have 12 years of Photoshop/Bridge history around which my workflow was developed and the paradigm of having to import images into a "catalog" does not lend itself to that workflow. If LR allowed catalog sharing and placement on a network access (and the network was fast enough), then I could also use a single catalog. The catalog approach allows more functionality than simply writing the "develop instructions" into XMP. It is what allows collections and snapshots and history in LR that is not available in Bridge/ACR. It also means one has to have access to the catalog versus just the RAW file and it's associated sidecar .XMP file.
I have read numerous articles that recommend keeping your images on an external hard drive. That is a LR limitation mitigation strategy. It works well for some and is not suited to others.
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Dave,
First of all, please take no offense as none is intended.
I have read through this thread several times, including your very first post, to understand your motivation.
As background I have taught quite a few people to use LR, including individually and done presentations for large groups. I admit to being a huge fan, and I'm also a lifelong DB guy for my day job (both as a a programmer and also as a designer). Been a user since V2. I have 210,341 images in my main catalog. Just so you understand my bias.
In helping people attempt to adapt their workflow to LR, I have had several that are thinking like you do. They HAVE a workflow. Lightroom WILL conform to MY workflow. Generally these people are not successful making the jump.
Since computer programs are developed like people, programs have their way of doing things, kind of an ethos. The developers decide to have the application process information in various ways. Sometimes certain individuals don't care for the process implemented. (In my day job, someone last week told us we are doing stores inventory backordering wrong, and we have been doing it this way for 25+ years with thousands of users and hundreds of organizations.)
It doesn't make the developer right nor the individual wrong. It just is.
I had one friend that I helped out, he resisted mightily. I basically gave up on him. About a month later he told me he had rethought things, tried my WF and was enjoying LR. He told me "it was like I was trying to make one of those flourless chocolate cakes, putting the flour in and then taking it back out."
You are wed to your WF and it works for you. It ain't gonna work for LR, it's the wrong hammer for your nail, using your phrase. Some of us think LR kicks ass. Some people think it sucks ass compared to PS. To each his own.
If you were on of the people I teach, I would say take your pick - use a WF suitable for LR, or don't use LR.
All the best! Bob.
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I agree wholeheartedly. The original post was made because I was intending to give up PS CS6 because ACR would no longer be updated and I figured I would move to LR permanent licence. Since I opted instead for the Adboe CC Photography plan, I no longer have that problem. I am currently still using Bridge/ACR CC while trying to understand and learn LR.
There are things LR can do as far as DAM that Bridge cannot. And things that Bridge can do that LR cannot. Not sure long term which route would be better yet. To change my workflow to go with LR or keep it and stay with Bridge.
Dave,
First of all, please take no offense as none is intended.
I have read through this thread several times, including your very first post, to understand your motivation.
As background I have taught quite a few people to use LR, including individually and done presentations for large groups. I admit to being a huge fan, and I'm also a lifelong DB guy for my day job (both as a a programmer and also as a designer). Been a user since V2. I have 210,341 images in my main catalog. Just so you understand my bias.
In helping people attempt to adapt their workflow to LR, I have had several that are thinking like you do. They HAVE a workflow. Lightroom WILL conform to MY workflow. Generally these people are not successful making the jump.
Since computer programs are developed like people, programs have their way of doing things, kind of an ethos. The developers decide to have the application process information in various ways. Sometimes certain individuals don't care for the process implemented. (In my day job, someone last week told us we are doing stores inventory backordering wrong, and we have been doing it this way for 25+ years with thousands of users and hundreds of organizations.)
It doesn't make the developer right nor the individual wrong. It just is.
I had one friend that I helped out, he resisted mightily. I basically gave up on him. About a month later he told me he had rethought things, tried my WF and was enjoying LR. He told me "it was like I was trying to make one of those flourless chocolate cakes, putting the flour in and then taking it back out."
You are wed to your WF and it works for you. It ain't gonna work for LR, it's the wrong hammer for your nail, using your phrase. Some of us think LR kicks ass. Some people think it sucks ass compared to PS. To each his own.
If you were on of the people I teach, I would say take your pick - use a WF suitable for LR, or don't use LR.
All the best! Bob.