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Author Topic: Creative Cloud or Creative Control  (Read 26131 times)

john beardsworth

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #20 on: January 31, 2016, 11:04:07 am »

John, no offence, but you have spent too much time on the internet.

Believe it or not, there are still people who do not want to "prove" (as you put it, using quotes) anything, but who are simply asking questions. Like me. And they are asking questions to get answers, real answers.

I'll try once again.

My case is indeed very simple. By the time I understood I had to let LR go, I had about 13 years worth of images (mostly JPEGs) stored using a particular catalog structure, <year>/<month>/<day>. A LOT of images; about 10% of them (on average) retouched in LR. So, when I say "export", I mean what LR normally calls "export"; that is, with all edits applied. I do not want to lose my edits, I want to get images with edits applied; this is what being able to export means. And this is what export of individual files does. But not bulk export -- if one wants to retain folder structure.

Now, with LR I only saw two ways to do bulk export:

1) To export into a catalog. When you do this, Lightroom just copies sources files with no edits applied, and copies metadata for the edits into new .lrcat database. So we're back to square 1 -- no luck.

2) To export selected files. If you select multiple folders, all of them will be exported. BUT whatever options you choose in the export dialog, all your folder structure will be flattened.

When I figured that I could only retain either folder structure or edits, I chose the former. And now when browse images in ACDSee and stumble upon a decent (for me) formerly edited in LR image and am in the mood, I just edit it again in ACDSee. I'm not a pro, I could afford losing those edits... And I did. Otherwise, I'd have to go folder by folder, and I do not want to do this cr@p. Do you really think I lost my edits so that to be able to cry foul? Seriously?

So, what am I missing? What magical way of doing bulk export retaining folder structure exist in LR that I do not know about?

Then read my answer again so I don't spend more time on the internet than I need.
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Zorki5

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #21 on: January 31, 2016, 11:51:02 am »

Then read my answer again so I don't spend more time on the internet than I need.

OK, I gave Jeffrey's Tree Publisher plug-in a try. It's now superseded by Folder Publisher by the same author, so I installed that Folder Publisher, configured, filled its "smart collection" with images from several months, and "published".

It actually works, and does exactly what I needed. Donated $10 and registered. I wish I discovered it earlier...

Thanks for the heads up, and, if I sounded harsh -- my apologies. Please understand I was genuinely frustrated.
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john beardsworth

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #22 on: January 31, 2016, 11:54:54 am »

Thanks for the heads up, and, if I sounded harsh -- my apologies. Please understand I was genuinely frustrated.

Sorry equally - I assume the worst of people using pseudonyms ;)

Having such a varied range of plugins is one of Lightroom's big strengths, and Jeffrey is undoubtedly the best provider of them.

John
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razrblck

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #23 on: January 31, 2016, 12:37:40 pm »

Awesome, Zorki. Glad you finally found a solution!
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smahn

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #24 on: January 31, 2016, 12:44:32 pm »

Sorry equally - I assume the worst of people using pseudonyms ;)


That's one of my favorite canards. I've seen more threads here locked because of the excesses of real name users than not. I can only assume it's because they feel the need to go to the wall to protect their professional reputations, however bad they may look in doing so.
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john beardsworth

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #25 on: January 31, 2016, 02:02:57 pm »

That's one of my favorite canards. I've seen more threads here locked because of the excesses of real name users than not.

Since most people are identifiable, that's hardly surprising. If you get a snarky comment from someone hiding behind a pseudonym, why give them the benefit of the doubt?
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Isaac

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #26 on: January 31, 2016, 02:51:09 pm »

So how do I export 13 years worth of digital images, retaining carefully built folder structure (<year>/<month>/<event>)?

That would have been a good question to post in Adobe Lightroom Q&A.

I'm happy if you now have a useful answer.
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smahn

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #27 on: January 31, 2016, 02:57:31 pm »

Since most people are identifiable, that's hardly surprising. If you get a snarky comment from someone hiding behind a pseudonym, why give them the benefit of the doubt?

Again, I think the concept of pseudonyms being the problem is a ruse. Most threads get locked because two or more real named people can't back off.

I suspect you'll disagree to no end, so please take no offense if I leave you with the last word early in the game.
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #28 on: January 31, 2016, 03:01:40 pm »

... I suspect you'll disagree to no end...

We might disagree or not, but what matters is that the site moderators' official policy is to have less tolerance for forum transgressions by pseudonyms.

smahn

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #29 on: January 31, 2016, 03:07:16 pm »

We might disagree or not, but what matters is that the site moderators' official policy is to have less tolerance for forum transgressions by pseudonyms.

Indeed, we all prefer transgressions by real named participants - they're much higher spectacle, IMO.
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Eigil Skovgaard

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #30 on: February 01, 2016, 07:34:22 pm »

Well, this is a coffee shop, and among returning coffee drinkers no discussion will ever be to long or finished - only rested for a while - in between.

Personally I find the Cloud concept intimidating and I have to address businesses that works only one way - in this case to make Adobe earn disproportionally more for largely the same product that was earlier offered as a one buy.

In practical life it doesn't matter if I buy the right to use an intellectual property or I think I buy the property - as long as the property is physically present - as when handed over to me the day I paid for it - or it was downloaded and is now stored on my hard disk in an executable and portable quality. I can use it whenever I like, and nobody can hinder me.

When I use my Ps CS5 on my computer nobody ask for more money. That is good. That is what property feels like. Nobody can interfere with my work, not Adobe, not the Internet operator, nobody.

When I use Ps Cloud I have to pay more for largely the same product. I have to pay without any limit. If I stop paying, Ps CC stops working. So, somebody must be monitoring if my payments are synchronized with my use of the product. If the Internet should stop, caused by a temporary war somewhere, I would be hindered to pay, so I would be unable to work. This principle is an obvious threat to anyone's business - and the bizarre reality is, that we have to pay more for a higher risk - much more. In fact we all have to pay for ever, if it wasn't for the fact, that some of us can calculate.

Two years renting and I have paid for the product for the rest of my life - or so it was earlier. Now Adobe wants to earn more for the same value, and who is asked - you? - or me? No, nobody from the paying mob was ever asked. Adobe just recognized that their product had reached a state of irreplaceability around the world, so the time had come for exorbitant demands.

And it seems to work. As long as people say: "Like it or not, Cloud has come to stay ..."  Adobe can go on playing their pay-or-go-away-game and laugh all the way to the bank.

Luckily, as I mentioned earlier, Adobe's products are circulated for free, not legally of course, but if you want to run a minor risk, you can have the most used CC 2015 applications without the Cloud. Even I don't like it. Why can't Adobe get enough? Why do they have to squeeze their customers until they are ready to "crack"? To day an army of crackers are ready to crack every new release, and it will not be possible to stop them, as long as the code runs on several million computers around the world. Why is Adobe pushing honest customers into the arms of the crackers?
Greed or blindness? Anyway, this policy has harmed my view on Adobe. Arrogance is not my cup of coffee.

Until Adobe gets wiser - more than a few should raise their voices against the Cloud insanity. Otherwise we have not yet seen the end of the squeezing game.
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digitaldog

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #31 on: February 01, 2016, 08:37:21 pm »

Until Adobe gets wiser - more than a few should raise their voices against the Cloud insanity. Otherwise we have not yet seen the end of the squeezing game.
From Adobe's perspective, they are super wise.

"Adobe’s Creative Cloud has been available for 3½ years now and continues to gain strong adoption in the marketplace, the latest published figures show.

Paid membership continues to accelerate – adding a record 833,000 new subscribers in the past quarter (almost 65,000 new customers each week) – which means that total number of subscribers has now surpassed 6.1 million since the CC product line replaced Creative Suite in June 2013".

http://prodesigntools.com/creative-cloud-one-million-paid-members.html December 11th, 2015

As to wise consumers, subscribe, don't subscribe. No one's holding a guy to your head. The numbers above appear to indicate a lot of consumers feel they are wise by subscribing. Or it's a group of 6.1 million rubes?
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amolitor

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #32 on: February 01, 2016, 10:56:13 pm »

There are excellent reasons that subscription models increase revenues. A big one is that consumers are not rational actors.

An argument based on the assumption that consumers are rational actors is ludicrous and instantly dismissable. You might as well support your argument with the assertion that the earth is flat.
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #33 on: February 02, 2016, 12:11:53 am »

What would rational consumers do in this case?

amolitor

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #34 on: February 02, 2016, 12:46:07 am »

I don't know what the options are at the moment so I can't answer that. I'm not an Adobe customer..

I do know that, in general, consumers prefer a small monthly payment over a larger lump sum almost regardless of the actual financial calculations in play. Partly because truly comparing the costs in these two cases is surprisingly difficult, and partly because future expenses are weighted far too lightly by humans.

Subscriptions often also come, often, with the convenience of automatic billing, which again helps consumers make poor choices. There are entire industries that rely on automatic billing and the psychological grease this provides, for survival.
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Eigil Skovgaard

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #35 on: February 02, 2016, 04:06:44 am »

If I was Adobe and ran x million sucking tubes into a equivalent number of bank valves owned by unconscious users, I would let somebody write about the success of the Cloud machine. "A large number of new users join every day," I would write (even if it was a lie), and I would spread the message to be used by willing communicators everywhere.

Using such messages as an argument for how sound the Cloud madness has become, is like ufo enthusiasts proving the existence of green men (could such guys be holding a "guy" against my head during my sleep? - really weird threats ...)

What would rational consumers do?
Get conscious, get organized, make user groups on dedicated sites, tell Adobe that a greedy behaviour is not the way ahead. And if Adobe wouldn't listen - organize hidden lending of their software, yes - crack and use for free. Adobe is touchable on their economy and reputation.

Many prefer to pay small amounts ... Oh yes, the psychological effects of the machinery has been carefully investigated, before the principle was ever released. But the principle only works with unconscious users, the category that also prefer automatic billing. Automatic this and that is rarely serving the consumer, and automatic billing and the Cloud principle are money machines without comparison. In my opinion it is only possible along with reduced education, which is an existing and growing threat to the ability of independent thinking - opposite letting Adobe think for you. I am talking about arrested development in the whole western society.

The Cloud principle is gradually extended to serve any need you might have - at the distance - out of your reach and out of your control and totally dependent of the presence of the Internet. Private people and even businesses are urged to send their confidential data to "the cloud" and the sellers pretend to maintain security by mean of their own encryption. Yes, we are all one happy gang.

You can also "share" which is another principle these days. Share your photos with everybody, your family story, your economy, your needs - its quite innocent, but soon you receive accomodated offers online.

The possibilities with unconscious users are endless.
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Zorki5

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #36 on: February 02, 2016, 04:48:51 am »

Adobe just recognized that their product had reached a state of irreplaceability around the world, so the time had come for exorbitant demands.

As always, things are more complicated than they seem...

From companies' standpoint, many products reached the state of maturity and, if not subscription schemes, less and less customers would feel the need to upgrade to a new major version. Other than compatibility with new operating systems and cameras, what else it out there that existing PS or LR customers really need? I'd argue that not much, if anything at all.

The "cloud" thing in Adobe subscription scheme is purely a marketing trick: make people think that they are actually getting something extra. A convenient buzzword.

In the software development world we are going through a very similar exercise with JetBrain's products... BUT -- just subscription model, no "cloud" talk.
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Zorki5

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #37 on: February 02, 2016, 04:50:38 am »

What would rational consumers do in this case?

If I was a pro, I'd have to subscribe. There are no other choices currently, at all.

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Alan Goldhammer

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #38 on: February 02, 2016, 08:52:07 am »

Amazing how long this whining about CC continues.  Adobe is doing the right thing by moving to a subscription model and the pricing is not all that out of line compared to the previous upgrade path that we were all on.  Complaining about this is just a dead end.  If all these whiners would organize a kickstarter campaign and raise money for a new software product I would have more sympathy.  I haven't seen anyone taking this step at all so I suggest to all the whiners, put your money where your mouth is and work towards an alternative software product.
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pegelli

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Re: Creative Cloud or Creative Control
« Reply #39 on: February 02, 2016, 09:06:51 am »

Amazing how long this whining about CC continues. 
I agree Alan, and even Adobe is still offering Lightroom only perpetual licenses for people who don't need the latest/greatest Photoshop (I still use CS3, does all I need), so that's what I got. If you were on the bi-yearly upgrade path for both the CC model is about break-even. So whatever way you look at it it's a lot to do about nothing.

On the other hand if C1 gets their file management system and other features like keywording in order then Lightroom will have a serious competitor. I think their raw conversions are slightly better, the flexible interface is handy but some of the other things Lightroom is really good at are still a let-down.
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