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Author Topic: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera  (Read 21379 times)

Bart_van_der_Wolf

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Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« on: November 18, 2015, 06:31:52 am »

FYI

Development announcement here and here. Hopefully this will not be labeled as FUD again, like it was for the Canon press release. It is just a development announcement.

Cheers,
Bart
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MarkL

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #1 on: November 18, 2015, 06:53:10 am »

Nikon don't normally stoop to this level, they must be feeling the pinch to hit D4s sales.
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Theodoros

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #2 on: November 18, 2015, 07:00:25 am »

Lets hope they'll reduce the size to D800 level this time... and offer the power grip as accessory. Interchange VF would be nice...
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Bart_van_der_Wolf

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #3 on: November 18, 2015, 07:02:49 am »

Nikon don't normally stoop to this level, they must be feeling the pinch to hit D4s sales.

Indeed, these development announcements from Canon and Nikon are more a general information (also for investors) of where development is heading, rather than vaporware announcements that will never materialize. It will be interesting to see what the specifications of the new sensor will be, and if it will be another Sony sensor, and which are the other camera features.

Cheers,
Bart
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Colorado David

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #4 on: November 18, 2015, 07:05:11 am »

I really want it to shoot 4K video.  I hope it isn't a long way off.  I need to buy something to shoot 4K early in 2016 and I was hoping it would be a Nikon.

BernardLanguillier

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #5 on: November 18, 2015, 07:50:47 am »

My personal view is that:
- this announcement is even more lame than the Canon one,
- it probably means that they intended to announce the camera in the coming weeks but are either facing issues of some sort or decided a late spec change,
- the camera won't be the hands of photographers for at least another 6 months and Nikon considers this to be a problem

Cheers,
Bernard

dwswager

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #6 on: November 18, 2015, 08:06:08 am »

FYI

Development announcement here and here. Hopefully this will not be labeled as FUD again, like it was for the Canon press release. It is just a development announcement.

Cheers,
Bart

As long as an  announcement increases the knowledge of the user community, then I see them as a good thing.  If, however, they are not reality based, and are only intended to forestall user switching or purchases, then they are detrimental.  They need to be clear between applied research and functionality already on the schedule for a product release.
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kers

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #7 on: November 18, 2015, 10:44:46 am »

The only interesting information i read in it is that the D5 remains a DSLR camera 

I just worked with a D4s last week and i was suprised how bad the video was compared to the very decent video coming from the D810.
So a D5 with better video quality in combination with the new 24-70 VR lens would be a very nice combination for the press folks
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Pieter Kers
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shadowblade

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #8 on: November 19, 2015, 12:47:51 am »

The announcment, as it stands, is one of the least exciting to come from either Canon or Nikon to date.

It just doesn't seem to introduce anything new. Is there anything it does that the D4s doesn't already do very well? Frame rate? Got it. Top-level AF? Got it. Video? Got it. It seems more like a slight evolution of what is already a very good camera for that it's designed for, not a revolutionary new design.

If the suddenly said that it had a 36-50MP sensor (while retaining the frame rate), on the other hand, it would get a lot more interesting, due to the increased ability to crop for wildlife or field sports.
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Bart_van_der_Wolf

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #9 on: November 19, 2015, 02:50:54 am »

If the suddenly said that it had a 36-50MP sensor (while retaining the frame rate), on the other hand, it would get a lot more interesting, due to the increased ability to crop for wildlife or field sports.

Guess we'll have to wait for more specific info from Nikon, or one of the rumor sites. I think that whatever the specs, it will be telling as to the direction Nikon will be heading in the near future, e.g. stay with Sony, multi-sampling, put more (or less) emphasis on video, etc., or do something radically different.

Cheers,
Bart
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Manoli

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #10 on: November 19, 2015, 03:09:06 am »

Hogan on the Non Announcement :
http://www.dslrbodies.com/newsviews/the-non-announcement.html

" Early this week I wrote that the camera industry hadn’t hit bottom yet. Today I can write that Nikon hasn’t hit bottom yet. "
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Paulo Bizarro

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #11 on: November 19, 2015, 04:13:22 am »

I am curious to see whether or not Lula will also feel the need to diss on this one, as they have dissed on Canon labelling the sensor (re)announcement as FUD...

Indeed, using Canon is not very popular here anymore:)

shadowblade

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #12 on: November 19, 2015, 06:27:17 am »

I am curious to see whether or not Lula will also feel the need to diss on this one, as they have dissed on Canon labelling the sensor (re)announcement as FUD...

Indeed, using Canon is not very popular here anymore:)

Unless one shoots fast action, Canon and Nikon bodies no longer really do a better job than their rivals (primarily Sony). And, for those who shoot fast action, it's hard to substantially improve upon the D4s and 1Dx in terms of high-ISO performance (due to limits of quantum efficiency and photon shot noise) or off-sensor PDAF performance (note that things like eye detection cannot be implemented on SLRs or any other design that doesn't compose and focus through the sensor).

Canon's greatest asset is its lens collection. Nikon's greatest asset is its Sony sensors.

I'd imagine Nikon would be ripe for a takeover by Sony at some stage if the trend continues.

That said, the D810 is probably the best all-round SLR for still photography at the moment - it can do everything pretty well, excels at some things (image quality, although it has recently been overtaken in pure resolution) and doesn't do anything badly. Focuses and tracks quickly and accurately, 5fps is fast enough for most things, high resolution, the most DR of any body out there, excellent low-ISO, decent high-ISO, dual cards, etc.
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Bart_van_der_Wolf

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #13 on: November 19, 2015, 07:00:49 am »

Unless one shoots fast action, Canon and Nikon bodies no longer really do a better job than their rivals (primarily Sony). And, for those who shoot fast action, it's hard to substantially improve upon the D4s and 1Dx in terms of high-ISO performance (due to limits of quantum efficiency and photon shot noise) or off-sensor PDAF performance (note that things like eye detection cannot be implemented on SLRs or any other design that doesn't compose and focus through the sensor).

Maybe, but then these workhorses are usually more rugged, better weather-sealed, have more battery capacity, and in LiveView mode the sensor can equally well see the optical/projected image, and employ whatever technology is suited then.

Features like expose on subject movement, or contrast or on-sensor phase detect focus, or eye focus, face detect and whitebalance, or, ... And it may raise the resolution bar, or add 4x or more multi-sampling capability for higher (color) resolution with reduced aliasing, very useful for product photography and reproductions. Maybe, if not patented, it can employ sensor tilt and shift. Just to name a number of things that are already available in other camera models, let alone additional innovative solutions they can come-up with.

Cheers,
Bart
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Chuck Fan

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #14 on: November 19, 2015, 07:30:02 am »

My personal view is that:
- this announcement is even more lame than the Canon one,
- it probably means that they intended to announce the camera in the coming weeks but are either facing issues of some sort or decided a late spec change,
- the camera won't be the hands of photographers for at least another 6 months and Nikon considers this to be a problem

Cheers,
Bernard

It seems the when Nikon made a "development announcement" for the D4S, the release announcement and actual release followed in less than 2 months later.   This would seem to be a far cry from canon's strategy of promising what it can't deliver for up to 2 years.
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MarkL

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #15 on: November 19, 2015, 08:14:49 am »

The announcment, as it stands, is one of the least exciting to come from either Canon or Nikon to date.

It just doesn't seem to introduce anything new. Is there anything it does that the D4s doesn't already do very well? Frame rate? Got it. Top-level AF? Got it. Video? Got it. It seems more like a slight evolution of what is already a very good camera for that it's designed for, not a revolutionary new design.

If the suddenly said that it had a 36-50MP sensor (while retaining the frame rate), on the other hand, it would get a lot more interesting, due to the increased ability to crop for wildlife or field sports.

Yup. It will be a 20-24MP version that does all the same stuff for an inflated price. Then Nikon will wonder why no one rushes out to buy it.

Maybe we will see a new AF module rather than the CAM3500 thing with a small row of cross sensors they keep tarting up since the D3.
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shadowblade

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #16 on: November 19, 2015, 09:00:21 am »

Maybe, but then these workhorses are usually more rugged, better weather-sealed, have more battery capacity, and in LiveView mode the sensor can equally well see the optical/projected image, and employ whatever technology is suited then.

And that's something I wish Sony would address - a tougher, more powerful all-round mirrorless camera, built around the same great sensor they've developed.

Thing is, it's not an inherent advantage of the D4, 1Dx, D810 or 5D3 - there's no special technology which makes them that way. It's just a matter of size, and something any manufacturer could add if they so desired.

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Features like expose on subject movement, or contrast or on-sensor phase detect focus, or eye focus, face detect and whitebalance, or, ...

All of which requires it to operate in live view mode, where you lose the advantages associated with it being an SLR in the first place, can't hold it up to eye level (i.e. needs to be on a tripod, since you can't realistically hold a D5 with attached lens out at arm's length and keep it steady) and still doesn't use them as well as a native mirrorless camera (due to the lack of an EVF to amplify the advantages of those things).

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And it may raise the resolution bar,

This is probably the best thing it can do.

I see three major breakpoints here - 32MP, 36MP and 54MP.

At 32MP, you have the potential for 8k video. For an action/journalistic camera, that's a very big thing with regards to utility and futureproofing. Go on a wildlife shoot and take some stills and an 8k video sequence all in the same shoot. And, with the battery and processor power of an improved D4-type body, 8k video is probably doable.

At 36MP, you can do a 1.5x crop and still end up with 16MP - a very respectable total which greatly adds to the utility of the camera when shooting wildlife or sports at long distance, where, even with long lenses, you're often focal-length limited and have to crop. It's like having an inbuilt, 1.0-1.5x teleconverter - sacrifice some image quality to have the subject take up more of the frame, and, at 1.5x crop and 16MP, you still end up with acceptable quality. At this resolution, you've effectively got a FF and crop body at the same time, with all the composition advantages of having a bigger frame to play with.

At 54MP, you'd be able to get a 1.5x crop of 24MP - equal to the best crop bodies on the market today.

I'd say a significant increase in resolution (with pixel binning for those concerned about file size and who don't need to print large or crop heavily - which also eliminates moire and colour aliasing artifacts as a side-effect) would be the best thing they could do in a D5 while still retaining an OVF and mirror.

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or add 4x or more multi-sampling capability for higher (color) resolution with reduced aliasing

That would make much more sense in a D820 than a D5 - if you're after resolution and reduced aliasing and your subject doesn't move, why would you go for an action camera with the lowest-resolution sensor Nikon offers, instead of the camera with just about the best IQ on the market at the moment?

Add that technology to the D810, however, and you'd have a beast for product photography.

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Maybe, if not patented, it can employ sensor tilt and shift

I'm sure Sony's already patented that, given that they were talking about z-shift focusing a while back.

In any case, it would be unusable outside of live view, and, hence, would make little sense on an action camera and much more sense on a mirrorless body (or, at least, on a camera like the D810).
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #17 on: November 19, 2015, 09:03:53 am »

note that things like eye detection cannot be implemented on SLRs or any other design that doesn't compose and focus through the...

This isn't correct. The D810 uses its 91,000 pixels exposure sensor to detect faces and the info is shared with AF. It works pretty well.

As far as lenses go, T/S lenses are pretty much the only ones where Canon has a real world advantage at the moment. The rest is pretty much a draw. Go Nikon if you need the best super tele or a stabilized 24-70mm f2.8, go Canon if you need a 11mm f4. It was the exact opposite 2 years ago. ;)

Cheers,
Bernard

shadowblade

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #18 on: November 19, 2015, 09:33:58 am »

This isn't correct. The D810 uses its 91,000 pixels exposure sensor to detect faces and the info is shared with AF. It works pretty well.

Not at the same level as Sony's eye detection, though. You need many more pixels for that, since an eye is so much smaller than a face.

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As far as lenses go, T/S lenses are pretty much the only ones where Canon has a real world advantage at the moment. The rest is pretty much a draw. Go Nikon if you need the best super tele or a stabilized 24-70mm f2.8, go Canon if you need a 11mm f4. It was the exact opposite 2 years ago. ;)

I'd give Canon the edge in superteles, if only for the 200-400 f/4 with inbuilt TC. That's a spectacular lens. The rest of the superteles are pretty much a draw.

Canon 100-400 > Nikon 80-400
Canon 70-200 > Nikon 70-200
Canon 24-70 =< Nikon 24-70
Canon 11-24 = Nikon 14-24 - Canon is wider, Nikon is faster, both are just as sharp
Canon tilt-shifts >>> Nikon tilt-shifts
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shadowblade

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Re: Nikon Announces Development of the Nikon D5 DSLR Camera
« Reply #19 on: November 19, 2015, 10:06:42 am »

I see no reason to move from Canon to Sony. In a studio environment where the light is controlled by me I don't need the shadows recovery and high ISO capability that the Sony sensor provides.

Yet you need the lowest possible noise, even sacrificing DR if need be (since you control the lighting anyway).

Outside of MF, that would be the D810, overexposed by 1-2 stops at ISO 64 and pulled.

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Outdoors under very bright sunlight I found that EVFs are terrible to look at.

How so? It's not like you're squinting at the LCD screen (like on a MFDB or live view) and trying to make out an image in the glare. With an EVF, your eye is pressed into a cup with no outside light leak, and the image itself gives you a true approximation of what the final, unprocessed image will look like - if it looks too bright there, your exposure's probably off.

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It's all about the right tool for the right job, but I still don't see a lot of commercial photographers (except those who shoot architecture) using the Sony cameras.

Plenty of wedding photographers now using them, too. And product photographers, and those who shoot professionally using aerial or submersible drones. Not to mention the pro landscape and macro shooters.
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