Sorry but my head is mince right now Leica S or Hasselblad H5D 50c

[Neil Williams]

Guys,
I am getting off the rig on Thursday and will be back in KL on Friday. I have had many offers for the Leica 006 (New and Second Hand) and had set my mind up to get the Leica 006 when I get home until two hours ago when I was offered a fantastic deal on a New 007 with the 120mm CS lens also allowing me to trade in my Leica M gear to reduce the cash outlay.
Ten minutes ago I have now been offered a fantastic deal on a new Hasselblad H5D 50c that will be roughly the same price as the Leica 007.

If I am going to dump over 25k into a camera system I don't want to buy A and then 3 months later wish I bought B if you know what I mean.

So my question is how good is the Hasselblad H5D 50c and will it be okay for;
Studio
Outside portraiture
Landscape
The odd street stuff

Any feedback on the H5D 50c compared to the Leica 007 would be much appreciated

Neil

[Neil Williams]

And while you folk are at it perhaps you could recommend what I would like for dinner.

Seriously, Neil, if you are considering laying out 25k on a system you really need to get your hands on the systems and decide for yourself.

Planned already for a hands-on with the Hasselblad H5D 50c
I am just trying to get feedback from people that have it and use it on a daily basis...............I have been to these hands-on jobbies before and you are having to deal with second hand car salesmen during your 30 minute slot

[ErikKaffehr]

Hi,

Some points to consider:

• Hasselblad has 50c sensor tha has been around quite a while
• The Hasselblad sensor is a little bit larger than the Leica sensor and has more pixels. The crops are different.
• The 50c and the other Sony based backs have a proven track record
• S (type 007) deliveries are scheduled for October at earliest
• Leica can use a lot of different lenses, with Hasselblad there is only the H-series

Keep in mind that those are very different systems. The Leica S is a big DSLR while the Hasselblad comes in the classical MF camera gestalt.

I would add that it seems that Leica is on the go, lots of development is going on. With Hasselblad, little is known.

Best regards
Erik

Ps. Keith has a very good point, below.

And while you folk are at it perhaps you could recommend what I would like for dinner.

Seriously, Neil, if you are considering laying out 25k on a system you really need to get your hands on the systems and decide for yourself.

Guys,
I am getting off the rig on Thursday and will be back in KL on Friday. I have had many offers for the Leica 006 (New and Second Hand) and had set my mind up to get the Leica 006 when I get home until two hours ago when I was offered a fantastic deal on a New 007 with the 120mm CS lens also allowing me to trade in my Leica M gear to reduce the cash outlay.
Ten minutes ago I have now been offered a fantastic deal on a new Hasselblad H5D 50c that will be roughly the same price as the Leica 007.

If I am going to dump over 25k into a camera system I don't want to buy A and then 3 months later wish I bought B if you know what I mean.

So my question is how good is the Hasselblad H5D 50c and will it be okay for;
Studio
Outside portraiture
Landscape
The odd street stuff

Any feedback on the H5D 50c compared to the Leica 007 would be much appreciated

Neil

[Go Go]

Hi Niel,

Don't spend any money on any camera gear until you have had a chance to shoot a body and three or four lenses in your required focal length for at the least 3/4 days.

I would suggest that you need at least a week shooting and processing files to really know if you like the gear. I don't know what you are shooting for subject matter? I photograph people, I have been shooting the H system for more than 5 years. Recently I switched over to a Leica 006 which I really like but I did't shoot the 006 on real work for 3 months while I got used to it and built up my lens collection.

If you don't have a dealer who can get you a demo kit for a few days you need to find someone else to buy the gear from. Seriously.

PM me if you need some names.

And yes I demo'd the 50c last summer and it's a great camera for shooting people under a lot of different lighting conditions.

Ciao

[voidshatter]

You get the best sensor from the H5D-50C for landscape, outside portrait and street photography.

However you might want to consider the Phase One XF system for presumably better auto-focus system as well as the waist level option, in addition to the flash sync advantages and technical camera flexibility. A Credo 50/IQ150/IQ250/IQ350 offers the same sensor suitable for these kind of photography that you shoot with available light. A Pentax 645Z will also offer the same sensor but you lose the wide angle options as well as high speed flash sync.

If you mostly shoot inside a studio with carefully setup light then a CCD sensor could be tempting, but personally I don't see much point of heavy investment into CCD in year 2015.

[eronald]

You get the best sensor from the H5D-50C for landscape, outside portrait and street photography.

However you might want to consider the Phase One XF system for presumably better auto-focus system as well as the waist level option, in addition to the flash sync advantages and technical camera flexibility. A Credo 50/IQ150/IQ250/IQ350 offers the same sensor suitable for these kind of photography that you shoot with available light. A Pentax 645Z will also offer the same sensor but you lose the wide angle options as well as high speed flash sync.

If you mostly shoot inside a studio with carefully setup light then a CCD sensor could be tempting, but personally I don't see much point of heavy investment into CCD in year 2015.

I looked at the Phase AF, it  is not as good, by far, as the Hasselblad's True Focus which is exceptional. See this thread. Of course, the Phase may get better with time, but that remains to be proven.


Edmund

[Neil Williams]

Edmond....would you consider a H5D 50c an all-round camera that would be okay for street photography and is the H5D weather sealed??

[voidshatter]

I looked at the Phase AF, it  is not as good, by far, as the Hasselblad's True Focus which is exceptional. See this thread. Of course, the Phase may get better with time, but that remains to be proven.

Edmund

"Focus then recompose" is not of my taste because you lose the capability for focus tracking in continuous shots, which is critical for street photography as well as other kind of photography. This is why I never liked True Focus.

The new AF system in the Phase One XF camera body uses CMOS for AF, which means that the AF performance could be boosted in low-light when compared against previous products. This could be helpful for street photography.

[eronald]

Edmond....would you consider a H5D 50c an all-round camera that would be okay for street photography and is the H5D weather sealed??

The Hassy is huge, and *much, much* slower than an SLR, but a very good camera. You need to be a bit more thoughtful than with an SLR I don't know about weather-sealed, although the Leica is weather-sealed, and close to a large SLR in size and shape.

If you are going to use a medium format camera in a hurry, you MUST test it first. It's not like Nikon and Canon which have close-together shooting experiences, the MF cameras are really different in the way they behave.

Edmund

[eronald]

"Focus then recompose" is not of my taste because you lose the capability for focus tracking in continuous shots, which is critical for street photography as well as other kind of photography. This is why I never liked True Focus.

The new AF system in the Phase One XF camera body uses CMOS for AF, which means that the AF performance could be boosted in low-light when compared against previous products. This could be helpful for street photography.

The XF AF might improve one day. For all I know, they could do focus off the main sensor in liveview, and mount an iPhone viewfinder on top, when my grandma buys a unicycle. For now, I would call it close to the usual Phamiya experience, which some like, others don't. The XF for the moment has ONE focus point/area at the center AFAIK, so it forces focus and recompose anyway, but with the inevitable focus shift which the Hassy sidesteps in a really neat way.

I am NOT going to recommend an XF for anyone wanting to take quick real-world images. Studio is a different story, I think it is a really excellent studio camera for Phase shooters. There is a reason why Leica and Hassy are still in the market, and it is called superior body ergonomics.

Edmund

BTW it's official, Greece has defaulted. That may remove a few hedgefund managers from the MF buyers roster.

[douglevy]

I'm not sure a digital MF is the solution for ANY type of moving subject. I think you need to take that out of the equation here. I have no experience with the Leica, so maybe that works? I don't know. But I do know that as soon as anything starts moving, I go from H5X to my D810 or D4.

[eronald]

I'm not sure a digital MF is the solution for ANY type of moving subject. I think you need to take that out of the equation here. I have no experience with the Leica, so maybe that works? I don't know. But I do know that as soon as anything starts moving, I go from H5X to my D810 or D4.

I agree.
The only camera I had which could track my 3 year old was a D4.


Edmund

[alexluuphoto]

I wouldn't buy either since the new a7r ii is coming out lol. Also if you go into digital medium format I would prefer the bigger sensor sizes like the p65+ then the crop sensor sonys. IF you're gonna go into crop sensors the Pentax 645z is the cheapest and gives the most out of all the companies. If you don't shoot out door flash the 1/125th sync is fast enough in a studio. Also another reason why I wouldnt buy those 2 systems is that they're not supported by capture one. I guess I could say that I am biased because I really prefer that program over lightroom and phocus. Nikon, Sony, and canon are all supported in capture one which is great. I feel like a strong raw conversion program is a must have and you lose that with the Pentax and Leica.

[eronald]

I wouldn't buy either since the new a7r ii is coming out lol. Also if you go into digital medium format I would prefer the bigger sensor sizes like the p65+ then the crop sensor sonys. IF you're gonna go into crop sensors the Pentax 645z is the cheapest and gives the most out of all the companies. If you don't shoot out door flash the 1/125th sync is fast enough in a studio. Also another reason why I wouldnt buy those 2 systems is that they're not supported by capture one. I guess I could say that I am biased because I really prefer that program over lightroom and phocus. Nikon, Sony, and canon are all supported in capture one which is great. I feel like a strong raw conversion program is a must have and you lose that with the Pentax and Leica.

I agree. Everybody needs a view camera and Capture One

Edmund

[Jim Kasson]

BTW it's official, Greece has defaulted. That may remove a few hedgefund managers from the MF buyers roster.

And add the ones who bet the other way.

Um, I believe the official term is "in arrears". I don't think most officials want to use the D-word at this point.

Jim

[Joe Towner]

If you're itching for a new toy, grab the 5DsR and give it a go with the 24-70 mark2 lens.  It'll give you a safe starting point for what a 50mp file is, gear you can flip with minimal loss of investment while you try out a few options, which can't be said for many medium format cameras.

The Hasselblad isn't weather sealed at all.  If that is high on your list, the best option is the 645Z, but I understand the Leica S to be close.

And read stuff like this to keep your interests...  https://captureintegration.com/10-reasons-to-test-drive-the-leica-s/

-Joe

[Neil Williams]

Thanks for all the great feedback up to now............Weather sealing is important to me as I live in Asia and it pisses down with rain a lot. I have been using Leica M gear for two years now so I am familiar with the Leica system, including lightroom, I hate Capture One.................Slooooooooooooooooooow
So right now I am going to stick with my gut feeling and get a new Leica S007 but saying that will try out the Hasselblad when I am in the UK in September visiting family and see it that bowls me over

[ErikKaffehr]

Hi Jim,

Thanks for putting things right… Bad thing is Greek dramas usually end in tragedy.

Best regards
Erik

And add the ones who bet the other way.

Um, I believe the official term is "in arrears". I don't think most officials want to use the D-word at this point.

Jim

[eronald]

And add the ones who bet the other way.

Um, I believe the official term is "in arrears". I don't think most officials want to use the D-word at this point.

Jim

Jim, not so sure, I think they're actually primary debt holders; thing is most of the debt seems held by the IMF, Germany and France anyway, and what do they care - it's cheaper to just write it all off fast, and stop this chaos in the middle of Europe. So all this moaning and back and forth and the really strange intrusive Obama phone calls to Europe asking them not to let a default happen -who wants to hear from the uncle in the far away country? - must be driven by some private creditors with very good presidential access, eg. the usual suspects Goldmann Sachs & friends. You will remember that Goldman Sachs donated $1M *officially* to the Obama campaign. It's interesting to see that corporations are now allowed unlimited political buy-in, although one might argue that politicians are so honest that they can never be bought, only rented.

Edmund

[mjrichardson]

Hi

Form factor and sensor are 2 different issues here, personally I find the S to be a perfect size to hand carry and use it everywhere, the H is a beast for walking around and street shots, for me it would be a no go, I'm in West Africa now with the S, 35, 70 and 180 and it's manageable, the H with 3 lenses would probably be too much for me, you might be different.

Once you know what you like from the ergonomics then picking the sensor is easy, either the dreadful CCD in the 006 as voidshitter points out, I'm amazed anyone can get a decent shot out of it or the saviour of humanity, CMOS, which will turn all your photographs in to world beating works of art. You can have either in the H or the S.

If it's rubbish weather then for me the S is the only choice, not a great photograph but a quick grab shot yesterday in torrential rainy season here in Mali with the 180 on the rubbish S 006, I wouldn't use the H in these conditions but the S is no problem.



Ultimately your personal preference will dictate what you can get the most from, test, try and enjoy!

Mat