Aperture RIP

[Mosccol]

re iPhoto to 'replace' Aperture:

It would be nice to have a true converging application (e.g. interesting when 'faces' became available on both). My issue w iPhoto is about its destructive editing and the fact it keeps multiple versions of the same picture. If Photos for Yosemite supports non destructive editing, then we may be on to something like Photos + round trips to Pixelmator.

[ButchM]

And besides, Apple gave a preview of Photos at WWDC, and it’s an iPhoto replacement, not an Aperture replacement.

To be fair, what was demonstrated at WWDC was a v1 beta that is still almost a year away from release so we have no way of knowing what it's full feature set will be ... or what current apps it will be capable of replacing.

I'm going to withhold judgement until I see what the new Photos app actually will offer ... not speculate based upon insufficient data.

[chrisgibbs]

Media Pro (formerly Expression Media/iView Media) by Phase One can catalog nearly every kind of digital media file that you can store on your computer. While I worked with Lightroom for 6 years and Aperture the past few ... I use Media Pro for my long-term Archive catalog. Been using it since it was iView way back in the day ...

Hi Butch,

Sincerely appreciate the advice!  I just had a nosey over at PhaseOne, I do like their pro app, I've tried it previously, but it has a built-in DAM and there's no mention of video assets stored within it.  Then there's the Express app (I presume no built-in DAM) but what about functionality, is it like iPhoto vs. Aperture?  Looks like Media Pro is just the ticket though, if it'll take various video formats too, plus audio, I'll be chuffed to bits.

Just got to contact PhaseOne and see if I can get another 60 day trial, I've had two for CaptureOne Pro, but didn't take it too seriously because it ignored my AVCD on the camera................and that's half of what I need!

Cheers,
Chris

[chrisgibbs]

Media Pro (formerly Expression Media/iView Media) by Phase One can catalog nearly every kind of digital media file that you can store on your computer. While I worked with Lightroom for 6 years and Aperture the past few ... I use Media Pro for my long-term Archive catalog. Been using it since it was iView way back in the day ...

I just tried an XAVC S file (the new Sony consumer Codec) in MediaPro, it appears but won't play back, that's a mayor hit for me.  But, in the latest LR it plays back fine, even though I can find no official reference that LR supports this Codec.  No joy on Audio files in LR though -- but they're fine in MediaPro.

Funny thing about LR, it's very intuitive, but I can see CaptureOne Pro is a far more capable RAW converter.  An issue with CaptureOne Pro, plug-ins, my NIK suite, especially SEP2 is used on just about every file! 

Chris

[john beardsworth]

What on earth makes you think C1 is a "far more capable raw converter"? It's certainly good, on a par with LR, and its tethering solution including C1 Pilot is the best.

[chrisgibbs]

What on earth makes you think C1 is a "far more capable raw converter"? It's certainly good, on a par with LR, and its tethering solution including C1 Pilot is the best.

Maybe a bad turn of phrase on my part.  LR has that ASDA vibe going on, I just want to get in and get out once the jobs done.  CaptureOne reminds me a little of Marks & Sparks, I'm more comfortable with its layout and decor, it inspires me to hang around a little longer and maybe try something new.  The B&W functionally certainly appeals.

For me, the interface in CaptureOne is what Aperture would've/should've become.  The only thing missing with CaptureOne is video integration, it's a multi-media world and we shoot video out of necessity.

So feel free to substitute "capable" for "comfortable, subtle, refined or inspiring" I could go on.........  I always thought LR was a better RAW converter to Aperture but the user experience wasn't.  As with all things photography/art there's that aesthetic component, even in our software experience!

[john beardsworth]

The B&W functionally [of C1] certainly appeals.

Yet LR has a huge advantage in that area in its Targeted Adjustment Tool. It's its Taste the Difference range. But at least, unlike Aperture (iirc), C1 has split toning.

John

[jjj]

Maybe a bad turn of phrase on my part.  LR has that ASDA vibe going on, I just want to get in and get out once the jobs done.  CaptureOne reminds me a little of Marks & Sparks, I'm more comfortable with its layout and decor, it inspires me to hang around a little longer and maybe try something new.

Well if we are going to use shopping metaphors, I always found C1 a bit like a badly laid out store where even though you could rearrange the fixtures and fittings to suit yourself, it was still tricky to get around to where you wanted. 

[chrisgibbs]

Yes, like I said from the off, "Lightroom is intuitive"........

John's point about the targeted adjustment tool was a good one, after watching the Adobe tutorial I thought of a dozen reasons that'd make my day easier, and there are no doubt more!

CaptureOne does appear to be the tool of choice amongst the high end fashion & commercial shooters though, mind you that's why they run with digital assistants and the like, its a professional environment front to back!  It'll be interesting to see what the established editorial shooters revert to from Aperture.

Have you got any LR tips like John's?

Chris 

[BobShaw]

That's a shame about Apple not going to upgrade Aperture. I have Aperture, Lightroom, Capture One and Phocus and in my opinion Aperture is by far the versatile catalogue program. As far as I know it is the only one where you can put the catalogue on a server for multiple machines.

Unfortunately Apple has pretty much wound down it's support for the higher end users in favour of consumer apps, starting with the Xservers a few years ago.
They are wiping away the people that have supported Apple for over 30 years.

As for putting your photos on the cloud, are they mad? I have 2TB of photos. In most countries where the Internet may not be as good as at Apple headquarters I could never upload, backup or even afford usage charges to use the cloud. A restore would take months. Some people actually need a programme running on serious computer and not an app.

I guess they just see the future in apps and iPhones. That could change as quickly as it went their way in the first place.

You can send feedback to here
http://www.apple.com/feedback/aperture.html

[Hywel]

Photos in the Cloud? That's plain ludicrous for commercial photographers.

I have around 16 TB of raw images. I only have a bandwidth for uploads of 1 Mbit per second. It would take over four years, 24 hours a day, for me to upload that.

And... I don't WANT to upload that, even if I could. Those images are my business, and they do not belong on a third party's server. I guess the phrase "commercial in confidence" only means anything to Apple, Google, et al. if it is THEIR commercial secrets that are to be protected?

Sigh.

Cheers, Hywel.

[Robert Roaldi]

They only say that they are ceasing further development, but they don't say that they are ending support for existing Aperture users, not yet anyway. I sent a query into Apple support asking if they intend to continue supporting new RAW formats. I haven't had an answer yet but it hasn't been that long and they're probably swamped.

I don't normally buy newly released cameras but I bought an Oly E-M10 and there's no RAW support for it yet in Aperture. I understand corporate secrecy, but it seems to me that they should at least state whether they plan to extend RAW support to existing Aperture users for new cameras. I guess they're worried that if they come out and say they won't that lots of pros and serious amateurs will buy something else, but by not saying anything, they only manage to annoy those very same people and encourage them to move away from Apple anyway. If they're decided their future is tablet consumer amateur use only, fine, that's their prerogative, they don't owe me anything, but it would be decent to let me know. If they don't, I will assume the worst.

Funny how the web has tended to favour monopoly (or near monopoly) instead of making more variety available. As these threads show, the only alternative seems to be Lightroom, which at least for v. 5 is still available for purchase, not rental. No one knows how long that will last, especially after Aperture is gone as a viable choice.

[john beardsworth]

As these threads show, the only alternative seems to be Lightroom, which at least for v. 5 is still available for purchase, not rental. No one knows how long that will last, especially after Aperture is gone as a viable choice.

“Future versions of Lightroom will be made available via traditional perpetual licenses indefinitely.”  Tom Hogarty, LR product manager.

[sandymc]

They only say that they are ceasing further development, but they don't say that they are ending support for existing Aperture users, not yet anyway. I sent a query into Apple support asking if they intend to continue supporting new RAW formats. I haven't had an answer yet but it hasn't been that long and they're probably swamped.

Apple have already stated that they will be continuing to update raw support - in the Apple world, raw support is part of the operating system, not individual Apple apps such as Aperture. However, how quickly new raw formats will be supported, and to what extent less popular cameras will be supported is an open question.  Also, Aperture will not be updated beyond Yosemite, so in effect raw support for Aperture will almost certainly end when Yosemite's successor comes out.

Sandy

[john beardsworth]

Anyone care to speculate about why Apple chose to make this statement, rather than maintaining their usual silence about Aperture 4, and why now?

[David Mantripp]

DID Apple make a statement, or is it all based on the rumour posted on The Loop ?  I can't see any statement from Apple anywhere. Least of all on the Aperture pages at their web site.

[john beardsworth]

DID Apple make a statement, or is it all based on the rumour posted on The Loop ?

Well, other reputable sites also report being contacted by an Apple PR, and it's not been denied.

So back to my question, why make any statement and why make it now?

[ButchM]

Anyone care to speculate about why Apple chose to make this statement, rather than maintaining their usual silence about Aperture 4, and why now?

My guess is, the new Photos app is to be a part of the OS. Since Yosemite is being openly beta tested, if they would include Photos as part of that testing phase, Apple would no longer be able to keep their intentions mum.

Purely a guess, mind you.

[luxborealis]

re iPhoto to 'replace' Aperture:

My issue w iPhoto is about its destructive editing and the fact it keeps multiple versions of the same picture.

My understanding of iPhoto is that it is NON-DESTRUCTIVE becasue it never edits your original. You can revert back to that original at any time (Photos > Revert to Original).

That being said, iPhoto is no replacement for Aperture or Lightroom. Hopefully Photos will be powerful enough in the right areas. if it's anything like the weird and positively stupid and schizophrenic Photos-iPhoto dichotomy on iPad, then we're in for trouble. Hopefully, sanity will prevail.

[David Mantripp]

Well, other reputable sites also report being contacted by an Apple PR, and it's not been denied.

So back to my question, why make any statement and why make it now?

I suppose one could put a positive spin on it and say that they're actually trying to prevent losing customers.  But if so, it's a pretty inept way to go about it. Then again, Apple has gone for so long without communicating in any other way than through major PR events, that it is quite possible they have nobody with any idea of how to organise a grass roots type of campaign.