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Author Topic: Nikon D4s - less is... less?  (Read 2994 times)

Fine_Art

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Nikon D4s - less is... less?
« on: May 07, 2014, 11:25:15 am »

DPR has added a few pages to it's preview of the D4s covering dynamic range and image quality. The D/R seems about the same as the other cameras. It picks up a bit more shadow detail. Compared to other manufacturers is seems shifted to the darks.

On image definition their side by side
http://www.dpreview.com/previews/nikon-d4s/6
shows greater contrast than the D800 at much lower resolution (looks like about 1/2 the size). Compared to the D610 it is just less definition. The D610 looks better all around. So, cranking up the ISO, the only area where it would have an advantage, 6400 for example, the noise is only slightly lower than the low of the 610. A good noise package would make short work of both.

SO what exactly is the $6,000 camera supposed to bring to the table?
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Petrus

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Re: Nikon D4s - less is... less?
« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2014, 11:30:10 am »

SO what exactly is the $6,000 camera supposed to bring to the table?

Basically the same things as the $6000 D4: speed, robustness, ergonomics, fast AF, generally the things pro action/nature/news photographers need…

With slight improvements here and there. Slight.
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DennisWilliams

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Re: Nikon D4s - less is... less?
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2014, 03:28:02 pm »

Why do photographers seemingly resent  incremental upgrades? For the people already using a D4 it may be a non issue- they're already good to go-  but for folks needing a camera today  or for shooters  using multiple bodies  replaced yearly the improvements can only be a plus.

Considering  all the posts I read  demanding new or next,  I just don't see any logic to the hostility  when a camera gets fine tuned a bit.   Would folks really prefer Nikon to keep manufacturing the D4 as is  for a couple more years when they already have some   improvements  available, however slight?
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MarkL

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Re: Nikon D4s - less is... less?
« Reply #3 on: May 08, 2014, 08:09:58 am »

Why do photographers seemingly resent  incremental upgrades? For the people already using a D4 it may be a non issue- they're already good to go-  but for folks needing a camera today  or for shooters  using multiple bodies  replaced yearly the improvements can only be a plus.

Considering  all the posts I read  demanding new or next,  I just don't see any logic to the hostility  when a camera gets fine tuned a bit.   Would folks really prefer Nikon to keep manufacturing the D4 as is  for a couple more years when they already have some   improvements  available, however slight?

It means your $6000 camera just lost a whole load of value on the used market after a short time just because a camera with minimal extra quality/features arrives.
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michael

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Re: Nikon D4s - less is... less?
« Reply #4 on: May 08, 2014, 09:37:04 am »

One of the realities that has emerged out of the digital camera market is that image quality has just about reached asymptote. Meaning, the differences are no longer that significant in real world shooting.

People should stop looking for the holy grail of image quality and realize that almost all current generation sensors are pretty similar in performance. Real world performance, not lab tests.

Therefore the things to consider are camera features and handling, and what a particular photographer's specific needs might be.

Format differences come down to enlargability and cropability.

The assumptions of the past 15 years have changed. It's just that some photographers expectations haven't. The days of noticeably better sensor performance every couple of years are over.

Michael
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ErikKaffehr

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Re: Nikon D4s - less is... less?
« Reply #5 on: May 09, 2014, 12:34:44 am »

Hi,

Very good high ISO performance, robust construction, excellent AF, high frame rate, relative low resolution making for relatively limited file size which may be helpful for sports shooters. All that stuff important for photographers shooting sports and events.

Best regards
Erik

DPR has added a few pages to it's preview of the D4s covering dynamic range and image quality. The D/R seems about the same as the other cameras. It picks up a bit more shadow detail. Compared to other manufacturers is seems shifted to the darks.

On image definition their side by side
http://www.dpreview.com/previews/nikon-d4s/6
shows greater contrast than the D800 at much lower resolution (looks like about 1/2 the size). Compared to the D610 it is just less definition. The D610 looks better all around. So, cranking up the ISO, the only area where it would have an advantage, 6400 for example, the noise is only slightly lower than the low of the 610. A good noise package would make short work of both.

SO what exactly is the $6,000 camera supposed to bring to the table?
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Erik Kaffehr
 

Ellis Vener

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Re: Nikon D4s - less is... less?
« Reply #6 on: May 10, 2014, 12:11:56 pm »

"It means your $6000 camera just lost a whole load of value on the used market after a short time just because a camera with minimal extra quality/features arrives."

Tha tdepends on how you define "minimal".

Some examples from my real world experience with the D4s and the D4:

- If you shoot long action sequences you will definitely be glad that the D4s buffer is substantially larger than the one in the D4, which was already much larger than the D3s's.

- If you need to shoot with an absolutely silent camera the Silent mode at any frame rate advancement (Single, Cl (up to 12 fps) and Ch (up to 24 fps) is amazing - but you can only shoot JPEG Fine and the full frame  resolution is binned down to 1,920 pixels on the long side of the frame ( not cropped, interpolated down). Admittedly the Live View Silent mode is also on the D4.

- When you have to shoot at ultra high ISO's, while the top two h4 and H3 ( 409,600 and 204,800 ISO equivalents respectively) are really usable  but performance at Hi 2 and Hi 1 ( 102,400 and 51,200 ISO equivalents) are much better than on earlier cameras including the D4.


If you shoot wildlife, sports or any kind of action the D4s is a great camera.

If you shoot more static subjects like landscapes and portraits then a D800 is easily a better camera.
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kholt

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Re: Nikon D4s - less is... less?
« Reply #7 on: May 10, 2014, 10:19:57 pm »

I remember back when you could put any sensor you wanted in any 35mm camera you owned.  Kodachrome, Extachrome, Fuji Velvia, Tri-X, etc.

What differentiated cameras back then was build quality, AF speed (if they had AF), ergonomics, shutter speed, etc.

Seems like with the current state of digital sensor technology history is repeating itself.  Or maybe more accurately, we are returning to historical norms.

So perhaps the question you are asking has the same answer as back when people used to ask the same thing about the Nikon F5.  Sensor technology has not typically throughout the history of photography been as big a differentiator as it was during the early years of digital.  The historical way to improve the "sensor" was to go to a larger format.


Keith
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Ellis Vener

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Re: Nikon D4s - less is... less?
« Reply #8 on: May 10, 2014, 10:26:11 pm »

I remember back when you could put any sensor you wanted in any 35mm camera you owned.  Kodachrome, Extachrome, Fuji Velvia, Tri-X, etc.

And I remember those days too. And of lugging pounds of film through airports and job sites and then paying labs multiple thousands of dollars per year to process it and then using a machine to caption the slide mounts with fragments of what we know call IPTC metadata.

What differentiated cameras back then was build quality, AF speed (if they had AF), ergonomics, shutter speed, etc.

Nothing has changed about that. In fact all of those characteristics are better now.

So perhaps you are right.
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Bernard ODonovan

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Re: Nikon D4s - less is... less?
« Reply #9 on: May 12, 2014, 02:40:48 pm »

A N Other sensor factor wrote:

"The current product portfolio spans a wide range of traditional image sensors from entry level VGA to 24 Mpixels and will soon offer products with 100’s of millions of pixels."

Things gonna get disci  ;D
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