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Author Topic: New Zeiss lens - 25mm f2  (Read 12360 times)

Alan Smallbone

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New Zeiss lens - 25mm f2
« on: October 27, 2011, 12:43:32 pm »

New Zeiss lens announced today, the 25mm f2, they are still offering the 25mm f2.8 but the new f2 lens is supposed to be sharper and have almost no distortion, or so they have said in their announcement.

http://lenses.zeiss.com/photo/en_DE/products/slr/distagont225.usage.html

Alan

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Rajan Parrikar

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Re: New Zeiss lens - 25mm f2
« Reply #1 on: October 27, 2011, 01:02:13 pm »

Looks like this would be a fine lens for shooting the northern lights.

BernardLanguillier

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Re: New Zeiss lens - 25mm f2
« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2011, 10:06:31 pm »

Isn't it funny how a small company like Zeiss is able to draw circles around Canon and Nikon when it comes to prime lenses design?

Cheers,
Bernard

DaveCurtis

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Re: New Zeiss lens - 25mm f2
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2011, 03:00:47 am »

The lens looks a stunner going by the MTF.

I have the 21ZE so Im not sure if I will get this one. Too close in focal length.

I remember several years ago quietly thinking that photographers who used Zeiss and Leica were snobs.

But after I bought my first Zeiss the 21mm ZE that all changed. I now own 4 ZE lenses. Just amazing!
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paul_jones

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Re: New Zeiss lens - 25mm f2
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2011, 09:54:22 pm »

Isn't it funny how a small company like Zeiss is able to draw circles around Canon and Nikon when it comes to prime lenses design?

Cheers,
Bernard


funny you say that... i have tested the zeiss ze 50mm and 85mm (with an adaptor) up against the ef 50mm 1.2 and 85mm f1.2, both side by side - focused by live view, helped by my most anal techy assistant.
we found the ef lenses are decent amount sharper from f1.4 through to f2.8 (the only area i tend to shoot at). it was quite obvious.
i also tested what i thought was the nicest looking "cinematic" blur (the kind i see with the fast cookes when i work along side TVCs) and the ef 85 f1.2 was way nicer and beautiful compared with the ze 85 f1.4 (both tested at 1.4).

i was really disappointed as i hear nice things about zeiss all the time. i also would love the quality metal construction, and brand of lens on my canons- makes me feel more like an artist  :D.
but i just haven't been able to see what all the fuss is about when i actually test this stuff. even with my new contax p65 setup, the 80mm f2 looks nice, but i am quite disappointed with my zeiss 110mm f2. sometimes i feel there is a hell of a lot of crap information out there, and people have been a little brain washed.
don't get me wrong, i like the zeiss lenses better than the fuji lenses that my H had, and happy i swapped systems. but on a smaller camera, some of the canon lenses are really impressive to me.

the only way you can know what does what is to buy the stuff and use it.

paul

« Last Edit: October 28, 2011, 09:58:21 pm by paul_jones »
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HarperPhotos

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Re: New Zeiss lens - 25mm f2
« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2011, 10:11:45 pm »

Hi Paul,

Totally agree with you concerning the myth of the almighty Zeiss lenses. I to have done tests with Zeiss lenses and compared them to my new Nikon 35mm f1.4, 50mm f1.4 and 85mm f1.4 G lenses and was disappointed with the Zeiss lenses. Years ago I have a Yashica and Rollie twin lens cameras and the Yashica always produced superior images. Or maybe us Kiwi’s look at thing differently. I think Mr Zeiss should be commended in marketing the Zeiss myth.

Cheers

Simon (Go the All Blacks)
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Simon Harper
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Rajan Parrikar

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Re: New Zeiss lens - 25mm f2
« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2011, 12:08:22 am »

Lloyd Chambers has the initial impressions -

http://diglloyd.com/blog/2011/20111028_3-Zeiss25f2.html

NashvilleMike

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Re: New Zeiss lens - 25mm f2
« Reply #7 on: October 29, 2011, 12:59:22 am »

Two thoughts here:

a) I think saying that Zeiss lenses automatically are better than Nikon/Canon primes is a bit of a stretch. I could understand this feeling if one were to compare the Zeiss ZF lineup, say, to the older Nikon primes designed back in the film era, but when you start looking at the latest Nikon "G" primes such as the 24/1.4G, 35/1.4G, 60/2.8G, and 85/1.4G, there is no way I could agree with the statement that the Zeiss are better.  Now, different - in terms of rendering and drawing style - yes, absolutely - but better, no. If anything, the latest Nikon G primes more than adequately compete with the Zeiss, and in a few cases are actually distinctly better; I'd take the 24/1.4G and the 85/1.4G quite easily over the current Zeiss equivalents without question. With some of the others, it's more subjective rendering differences. I would consider it an insult to Nikon lens designers (like the talented Haruo Sato) to say that his work automatically is disqualified from the discussion of great lenses simply because the brand name doesn't start with a Z.

That being said - I think we should look at these differences as being a positive thing. Nikon rendering and Zeiss rendering is different, and once you look beyond the usual parameters of test chart performance, one can see the "signature" or decisions that their respective lens designers made while they were balancing the many trade-offs inherent in all lens design. When comparing the best from both lineups, I don't see it so much as which is better in an absolute sense, but rather as which paintbrush or tool might best be suited to the task, or, perhaps, as an artistic decision as opposed to a technical ("this one resolves x lp/mm and thus it must be better period") decision.

(And for the Canon shooters out there, I could see a valid argument that their latest 100 L macro can easily compete with the Zeiss, as could their L series II 24/1.4 - it's not just a Nikon thing)


b) Within the context of this discussion: Even though I am far from being a Zeiss fanatic, I actually have interest in the 25/2 because I happen to love the 24mm (roughly) focal length, and the more paintbrushes, so to speak, I have at my disposal at this focal length, the happier I will be. I don't like the Zeiss 25/2.8 that much, but this 25/2 looks to be quite a bit better, and I may very well be in line to get one - not to replace or "beat" my Nikkor 24/1.4G at all, but simply to augment it - celebrating the differences, nothing more, nothing less.

-m
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: New Zeiss lens - 25mm f2
« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2011, 08:31:27 am »

My comment was a bit tongue in cheek, I agree that both Canon and Nikon are producing excellent lenses and that some of them are superior to the Zeiss equivalent in terms of measurable performance. I do also own a copy of the nikkor 24mm f1.4G and it is indeed an amazing lens, except for some slight focus issues on distant subjects.

Now, my personnal feeling is that some of the Zeiss lenses, starting with the 100mm f2.0 macro have something very special to them in terms of rendition. I happen to own one as well as the Nikkor 105 f2.8 VR that measure as well as any other macro less out there in that focal range, but the rendering of the Zeiss is just more pleasing to my eyes.

I feel that rendition is becoming the most important characteristic of a lens nowadays since they are all excellent performers along the measurable performance axis.

Cheers,
Bernard

DaveCurtis

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Re: New Zeiss lens - 25mm f2
« Reply #9 on: October 29, 2011, 05:55:11 pm »

Im sure no one is saying that Zeiss is automatically better than Canon/Nikon.

From my perspective I prefer the Zeiss rendering over my Canons. And technically my Zeiss 21mm, 35mm, 50mm MP and 100mm MP are all superb.

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NashvilleMike

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Re: New Zeiss lens - 25mm f2
« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2011, 07:11:38 pm »

Thanks for the clarification.

Just to clarify my point a bit; I believe some of the latest Nikon G's not only outperform the Zeiss equivalent in terms of measurement, but also in terms of subjective rendering.  With their best lenses, I appreciate their sense of balance in terms of the various aspects of image quality; I do feel there is a sense of subtle artistry with their best designs that goes beyond just the test chart. Of course, once we start discussing anything subjective, it's all opinion anyway, so this will always be a personal view for each of us. The point I'd like to make is that I think some folks think Nikon is only making lenses that are measurably good when in fact there are some of us (although perhaps not in this very heavily Sony/Canon dominated site, LOL) who do appreciate the finer aspects of their designs (of their best lenses) as much as anything Zeiss or Leica has done.

Interestingly, the one lens you bring up - the 105/2.8G VR, is in my view one of the few "misses" Nikon has come out with in the past several years - I never liked this lens for it's technical performance nor for it's rendering and long ago sold it, and there is no doubt I'd prefer the 100/2 Zeiss over it as well. I'm actually waiting to see if the occasional rumor that the Nikon 105/2 is getting updated comes true - that would be a lens that might be very interesting to me.

-m
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: New Zeiss lens - 25mm f2
« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2011, 10:51:28 pm »

Just to clarify my point a bit; I believe some of the latest Nikon G's not only outperform the Zeiss equivalent in terms of measurement, but also in terms of subjective rendering.  With their best lenses, I appreciate their sense of balance in terms of the various aspects of image quality; I do feel there is a sense of subtle artistry with their best designs that goes beyond just the test chart. Of course, once we start discussing anything subjective, it's all opinion anyway, so this will always be a personal view for each of us. The point I'd like to make is that I think some folks think Nikon is only making lenses that are measurably good when in fact there are some of us (although perhaps not in this very heavily Sony/Canon dominated site, LOL) who do appreciate the finer aspects of their designs (of their best lenses) as much as anything Zeiss or Leica has done.

Interestingly, the one lens you bring up - the 105/2.8G VR, is in my view one of the few "misses" Nikon has come out with in the past several years - I never liked this lens for it's technical performance nor for it's rendering and long ago sold it, and there is no doubt I'd prefer the 100/2 Zeiss over it as well. I'm actually waiting to see if the occasional rumor that the Nikon 105/2 is getting updated comes true - that would be a lens that might be very interesting to me.

I am afraid I am going to have to keep agreeing with you here. :)

Cheers,
Bernard

joneil

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Re: New Zeiss lens - 25mm f2
« Reply #12 on: October 30, 2011, 10:36:46 am »

   A few thoughts, in no specific order here, as somebody who uses a Zeiss ML lens and some really nice Nikon glass too;

1) My Zeiss lens (85mm) has a "look" to it I find hard to define, but I like.  the closest I can compare too, is I remember years ago on a large format list that guys said that if you took two, 210mm lenses, one Japanese, one German, and if all other stats were the same - such as they where both F5.6, not an F5.6 vs an F9 - that the glass in the two lenses, while equally sharp, had a different effect on a colour film.  one might be more saturated, one more contrasty.  This observation is completely subjective, so take it with the proverbial grain of salt.

2) I think there is a missing market for good, high quality, manual focus lenses, and I think Zeiss, and even Samyang, are filling that gap.  That 8mm Samyang fisheye is a phenominal lens for the price, but am I breaking some sort of taboo mentioning Samyang and Zeiss in the same sentence?  :D

3) I still do some astro-photography, and for years we have all noticed that stars are one of the harshest tests of any optical system, film or digital, is getting sharp, pinpoint stars, which is  extremely difficult on any zoom lens, any size, and brand, especially when compared to a good, fixed focal length lens.  for example, I use one of those Nikkor 24-70 f2.8 zooms, and as lenses and especially zooms go, it's one of the best lenses I have ever used and I think ever made.  But for a sharp, pinpoint star image, my good old 50mm F1.4 Nikkor still produces sharper images than my zoom.   We also found that slight telephotos - such as those ranging form 85mm to 105mm, generally speaking, all brands, were the sharpest and most distortion free, all though there were exceptions for both Canon & Nikkor with some of thier big telephotos
     I wonder then, just thinking out loud here, when people mention how much sharper their Zeiss is, are they comparing a fixed focal length to a zoom of similar quality, and somehow picking up on those sublte differences?


    Bottom line for me was this.  I looked at the Nikkor 85mmF1.4, read several reports that it was just as sharp or sharper then the Zeiss, but I went Zeiss anyhow.  Why?  Because I wanted manual focus and even though you can turn off the auto focus, I find some of these AF lenses are difficult to manually focus; because the Zeiss was cheaper than the Nikkor;  and because the Zeiss does have a different "look" to it on the final image.  I also looked at the Samyang 85mm, but I have found in many cases, the best place to put your money in photography is your lens first, and everything else second. 

    for the record, if I had the money, I would pick up a few more Zeiss lenses, but that's just me.  I wonder too if the choice of a lens reflects what kind of photographer you are.  For exmaple, inteh good old "film days", my favourite cameras were the Nikon FM and FM2, not a F4 or F5 or F6.  Even today, i keep my FM2 in good shape.  :)



   
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