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Author Topic: HP sample, Baryte Satin Art, Z3200  (Read 2097 times)

Bruce Watson

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HP sample, Baryte Satin Art, Z3200
« on: October 19, 2008, 12:25:19 pm »

HP sent me some sample prints on three different substrates, all printed on the new Z3200. The most interesting to me is the B&W print on Baryte Satin Art. A really lovely paper, this. I've had it up on my "proofing wall" for a couple of days now just to see if my feelings for it change over time.

This morning by chance I caught the light just right. For a couple of minutes a day just after dawn this wall catches a glancing blow of direct sunlight. That is, the light is almost parallel to the plane of the print. And on the Baryte Satin Art paper I could see an interesting banding in this light. Thin lighter stripes in the black background, spaced about 1.8 cm apart, all the way across the print. I didn't see this in "normal" lighting, but only in this severe cross lighting.

Just being curious I touched the surface -- ran my finger along the stripe to see if I could feel anything. Which I couldn't. But just as interestingly the stripe rubbed out from my fairly light touch. Gone. All pure black again.

But... Now under more normal lighting I can see the rub marks from my fingers as dulling the sheen. Big wide stripes which are pretty ugly. Not something I'd ever want to show to a customer for example. Of course I realize that touching the surface of the print is generally a no-no. Still, this is pretty light treatment. I expected the paper to be more scuff-proof than this.

So here's what I'm wondering: Is this kind of thing "normal" for the glossy-ish papers with the HP printers? Is this what's commonly called a "pizza wheel" mark? Are my expectations unreasonably high?

I'm wondering because I don't have an HP printer but I'm leaning in that direction. So I don't have any direct experience with the HP Z series printers. I'm interesting in the thoughts of those that have the experience that I lack so I can learn all I can before I commit.
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Bruce Watson
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rdonson

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HP sample, Baryte Satin Art, Z3200
« Reply #1 on: October 19, 2008, 02:46:02 pm »

Bruce,

It sounds like a problem with the GE.  Its a fragile coating at best but the way you describe it sounds like it wasn't applied properly to begin with.
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Ron

deanwork

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HP sample, Baryte Satin Art, Z3200
« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2008, 03:37:17 pm »

Not in my experience. I bought my 44" Z3100 last January and to this day I have had none of the roller marks or pizza wheel scratching marks that were described in earlier units that were bought before mine.

My experiece with the fiber gloss media and baryta fiber gloss media with this printer and Vivera inkset, with the gloss enhancer has been very positive and awesome with the HP RC ProSatin. Only one of the papers I tested I would describe as unuable with this machine, which was the Harmon high gloss fiber that had extreme gloss differential problems. I've had my best results with Crane Silver Rag for black and white, and the Innova Satin, or Innova Ultrasmooth Gloss, and Ilford Gallerie Gold for color along with Silver Rag. Looking forward to the new HP Satin Art.

The presence of gloss differential on all the above papers I've tried with black and white output, except for Silver Rag was a nussance however. This showed up in very light areas with very little ink laid down contrasted beside heavier ink areas, such as in black areas adjacent to these light areas. A couple of quick sprays of Premier Art spray and they were smoothed out, but I'm not into that, thus the reliance on Silver Rag with black and white on this Z3100.

The one thing I have NOT experimented with and plan to when I have time is laying down more Gloss E. than the media preset for these types of papers is giving me. That may solve all of it, even with the Harmon. It could be a subtle endeavor. I'm not into a lot of experimenting these days.

Finally I feel this printer does such a good job with these fiber gloss papers, if you get the combination right, that they are the closest thing to silver prints that I've produced in my studio to date. And the dmax on the Z is outstanding. I use an rgb workflow with a very slight warming up of the print color, with adjustment layers and srgb color space, which is very uniform across the tonal range, on the non oba Silver Rag for my best results. It is modeled on darkroom prints I used to make on Ilford Ilfobrom Gallerie papers developed in Ilford Bromophen paper developer. There are some I can't tell the difference from the silver prints and the print color is identical.


I have not used the new Hahnemuhle Baryta on the Z. Is anyone using it? Jim Doyle suggests that it is very close to the Baryta that HP is just about to release.

John





So here's what I'm wondering: Is this kind of thing "normal" for the glossy-ish papers with the HP printers? Is this what's commonly called a "pizza wheel" mark? Are my expectations unreasonably high?

I'm wondering because I don't have an HP printer but I'm leaning in that direction. So I don't have any direct experience with the HP Z series printers. I'm interesting in the thoughts of those that have the experience that I lack so I can learn all I can before I commit.
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Bruce Watson

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HP sample, Baryte Satin Art, Z3200
« Reply #3 on: October 20, 2008, 01:06:34 pm »

Interesting John. And encouraging.

I found that whatever it was, it "buffs out." I took a scanner wipe I had laying out and lightly buffed the surface of the print. All my finger marks went away along with the "roller marks" or whatever was causing this, resulting in a flawless surface. The wipe did pick up a tiny bit of black ink though.

I'm actually thinking it was probably paper dust on a set of rollers. They are after all probably churning through samples 24/7 with a couple of machines.
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Bruce Watson
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