Pages: [1]   Go Down

Author Topic: Matching Calibration with Monitors from Different Manufacturers  (Read 1210 times)

Chris Kern

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2204
    • Chris Kern's Eponymous Website
Matching Calibration with Monitors from Different Manufacturers
« on: October 24, 2024, 03:40:18 pm »

Now that Lightroom provides support for editing and exporting high dynamic range images in various formats, as well as files with gain maps that support both HDR and standard dynamic range versions, I've been experimenting with these formats on an Apple laptop with a built-in monitor that can display them.  I'm intrigued enough with the technique that I am inclined to attach an 1000-nit HDR monitor to the Apple desktop computer where I do most of my editing, where I currently use two old NEC wide-gamut monitors of different vintages.  I've always used a pair of NEC monitors on that computer and its predecessors, and after calibration the difference between the way they display colors is all but undetectable.

NEC (Sharp) seems to have abandoned the wide-gamut photographic market.  Assuming I replace one of my NECs with an HDR-capable monitor from another manufacturer that supports essentially the same color space, is it likely that proper calibration will provide a decent match color match for the current monitor?  Using an SDR profile, of course: I understand that won't be possible when the new monitor is using an HDR profile.  But I don't want to replace both of my current monitors—and if the colors were very different when I was editing in SDR on both screens, I suspect it would drive me crazy.

digitaldog

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 21645
  • Andrew Rodney
    • http://www.digitaldog.net/
Re: Matching Calibration with Monitors from Different Manufacturers
« Reply #1 on: October 24, 2024, 03:57:26 pm »

Well, with HDR displays (not output to print), what you see is unique to anyone viewing the images elsewhere. They may or may not have HDR displays and of course, they may or may not have any display anything like your display in terms of calibration. So, what's the goal here? HDR is kind of one-hand clapping; you see the HDR. Who else can do it? And if they can, its unlikely to match what you saw. A display that closely matches a print provides a print anyone in front of the print can view (within reason, the lighting,, of course,, plays a role). But it sure makes sharing your images as you wish them to appear easier to accomplish.
HDR is a can of worms in this respect.
Logged
http://www.digitaldog.net/
Author "Color Management for Photographers".

Chris Kern

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2204
    • Chris Kern's Eponymous Website
Re: Matching Calibration with Monitors from Different Manufacturers
« Reply #2 on: October 24, 2024, 04:39:21 pm »

. . . what you see is unique to anyone viewing the images elsewhere. They may or may not have HDR displays and of course, they may or may not have any display anything like your display in terms of calibration. So, what's the goal here? . . . HDR is a can of worms in this respect.

Yes, points taken.  In terms of application, I'm thinking of setting up an HDR kiosk in my living room to display a selection of my photographs, especially the ones that specifically benefit from an HDR treatment; obviously, not all images do.  As for display via the Internet, that is indeed a challenge at the moment.  That may change as the standards mature, HDR viewers become common, and more photo-sharing sites accept HDR file formats.  Google Chrome already does a decent job of displaying HDR images on various monitors and TV screens that support HDR, and ubiquitous browser support appears to be on the way.  On Apple products, at least, the viewing experience with Chrome seems to be quite uniform across different MacOS and iOS platforms.

For image sharing now, gain maps are the most practical solution.  I haven't always been satisfied with the way the SDR version of a particular image looks, but I suspect that reflects my limited experience with the technique.  (Actually, I just recently stumbled upon it when I noticed the option in Lightroom's export dialog while I was in the process of experimenting with different HDR-only files.)

However, I do plan to continue printing, and when I do I want to have two monitors that depict SDR colors similarly—at least sufficiently that I won't be obsessed with the mismatches.  (I don't have a way to quantify that requirement, but suffice it to say I'm not really that good at detecting slight color variations.)  So the gist of my inquiry is whether it is realistic to believe that two monitors from different manufacturers that support similar color spaces can be calibrated as closely as my two current NEC monitors can.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2024, 06:08:42 pm by Chris Kern »
Logged

Czornyj

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2050
    • zarzadzaniebarwa.pl
Re: Matching Calibration with Monitors from Different Manufacturers
« Reply #3 on: October 25, 2024, 06:18:39 am »

A decent HDR display with dimmable mini LED backlight or OLED is looking exactly like SDR, and displays HDR content locally increasing brightness where needed. Problem is there's not that much decent HDR 1000cd/m^2 displays at reasonable price - Retinas XDR in Macbooks Pro 14/16, iPad Pros and iPhones are mindblowing, but Pro Display XDR and most affordable Mini LED desktop monitors have too few dimming zones, and OLED still have problems to reach 1000cd/m^2 in practice.

I'd wait to see if Apple will release Studio Display XDR.

Right now I think I'd go 27GR95UM-B with 1560 dimming zones at a reasonable price (549$) if I had to get anything - PA32UCXR and UP3221Q have 2304/2000 dimming zones but, at cost of 2,5k$.

27M2U Pro, 32A6U, 27B1U7903 and 279P2MRX have 2304 dimming zones, and GM001S has quite impressive 5088 dimming zones at 2200cd/m^2 peak brightness but no idea what's color quality of these.
Logged
Marcin Kałuża | [URL=http://zarzadzaniebarwa

Chris Kern

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2204
    • Chris Kern's Eponymous Website
Re: Matching Calibration with Monitors from Different Manufacturers
« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2024, 09:50:16 am »

A decent HDR display with dimmable mini LED backlight or OLED is looking exactly like SDR. . . .

So in SDR mode (i.e., dimmed), assuming a corresponding color gamut, I gather you believe I should be able to achieve a good match for the appearance of the colors on my current NECs with proper calibration?  That seems plausible to me, but the only HDR display with which I have had extensive experience is the one built into my Apple MacBook Pro.

Quote
I'd wait to see if Apple will release Studio Display XDR.

I wouldn't be optimistic about Apple offering a standalone HDR display at a price below U.S $2500-3000 any time in the near future.

Quote
Right now I think I'd go 27GR95UM-B with 1560 dimming zones at a reasonable price (549$) if I had to get anything - PA32UCXR and UP3221Q have 2304/2000 dimming zones but, at cost of 2,5k$.

I haven't settled on a candidate monitor yet, but so far the Asus PA27UCX-K seems to have a good combination of features and price.  As far as I can tell, it has the same features as the PA32UCXR except for the smaller screen.  Thanks for the pointer to the LG 27-inch monitor; I wasn't aware of it before.

Czornyj

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2050
    • zarzadzaniebarwa.pl
Re: Matching Calibration with Monitors from Different Manufacturers
« Reply #5 on: October 25, 2024, 10:55:50 am »

So in SDR mode (i.e., dimmed), assuming a corresponding color gamut, I gather you believe I should be able to achieve a good match for the appearance of the colors on my current NECs with proper calibration?  That seems plausible to me, but the only HDR display with which I have had extensive experience is the one built into my Apple MacBook Pro.

I wouldn't be optimistic about Apple offering a standalone HDR display at a price below U.S $2500-3000 any time in the near future.

I haven't settled on a candidate monitor yet, but so far the Asus PA27UCX-K seems to have a good combination of features and price.  As far as I can tell, it has the same features as the PA32UCXR except for the smaller screen.  Thanks for the pointer to the LG 27-inch monitor; I wasn't aware of it before.

The one in Apple Macbook Pro M 14/16 is in a class of its own, but indeed Studio XDR probably won't be cheap (neither is Studio "SDR").

PA27UCX-K has 1152 dimming zones, so LG with 1560 zones, ATW polarizer and lower price might be a bit better choice. LG can be HW calibrated with LG Studio software and has W-LED PFS backlight similar as NEC PA271Q / PA311D, so should look similar, or identical after small wtpt tweaking in NEC MultiProfiler
Logged
Marcin Kałuża | [URL=http://zarzadzaniebarwa

Chris Kern

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2204
    • Chris Kern's Eponymous Website
Re: Matching Calibration with Monitors from Different Manufacturers
« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2024, 11:37:53 am »

PA27UCX-K has 1152 dimming zones, so LG with 1560 zones, ATW polarizer and lower price might be a bit better choice. LG can be HW calibrated with LG Studio software and has W-LED PFS backlight similar as NEC PA271Q / PA311D, so should look similar, or identical after small wtpt tweaking in NEC MultiProfiler

Thanks.  That's very useful information.
Pages: [1]   Go Up