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Author Topic: DTP70 + ColorPort + Argyll  (Read 1081 times)

jejes

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DTP70 + ColorPort + Argyll
« on: August 20, 2022, 03:43:54 am »

I have the change to buy a DTP70 to make my ICC profiles. I have read it's superb and far better than I1Pro2 that i have and use. I work with Argyll and i1Pro2. Is the workflow with ColorPort + DTP + Argyll difficult to work?
I have make a test, creating ti1 and loading into colorport, but i think it's not right, not the right color.

Could anyone explain me the workflow with Argyll. With I1Profiler it's easy, but i prefer Argyll for my printer ICC.

Thank You
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Rhossydd

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Re: DTP70 + ColorPort + Argyll
« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2022, 04:36:55 am »

I haven't used mine with Argyll, but I'd assume workflow won't be an issue for a supported instrument.

Your main concern might be that your system has a working driver for the DTP. IIRC there's only 32 bit drivers available.
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jejes

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Re: DTP70 + ColorPort + Argyll
« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2022, 03:57:48 pm »

Yes i would work with Win7 32 bits, but i would like to learn from someone. Could you explain me your workflow with I1Profiler
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Doug Gray

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Re: DTP70 + ColorPort + Argyll
« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2022, 10:06:36 pm »

I have the change to buy a DTP70 to make my ICC profiles. I have read it's superb and far better than I1Pro2 that i have and use. I work with Argyll and i1Pro2. Is the workflow with ColorPort + DTP + Argyll difficult to work?
I have make a test, creating ti1 and loading into colorport, but i think it's not right, not the right color.

Could anyone explain me the workflow with Argyll. With I1Profiler it's easy, but i prefer Argyll for my printer ICC.

Thank You

Why's that? I've used both I1Profiler and Argyll extensively to make ICC profiles from the same patches. Results are quite similar between the two. Main advantage is that Argyll is free. If you have a licensed i1Profiler why not just use that if you are more comfortable with it.
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jejes

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Re: DTP70 + ColorPort + Argyll
« Reply #4 on: August 21, 2022, 01:41:10 am »

I like more Argyll, that it's. And i find better results, maybe it's just for me. But the question it's not why to choose one or another, the question it's the workflow. Please i need help.
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jejes

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Re: DTP70 + ColorPort + Argyll
« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2022, 02:09:24 am »

I had an answer by Rob Wignell - I post here

I have a DTP70 and am very pleased with the profiles I get from it using ColorPort to drive it and Argyll to develop profiles.  I understand that it is possible to use the ColorPort output with i1Profiler, but I have never managed that.

I don't use Argyll to generate color patch sets, partly because I ended up with a tedious process of converting the Argyll patch set files so that they could be used as an input for ColorPort.

I now use a patch set generated by Doug Grey who regularly contributes to and comments on the Luminous Landscape forum.  For my Epson 3880 and my Epson 7880 I have found that a 957 set of patches that Doug developed works well for me.  In this 957 patch set, Doug has included a set of near neutral patches which he argues, and I agree, produces a very neutral tone in greyscale prints.

I have loaded the 957 patch set into ColorPort as both a 1 page and 2 page (A4) target.  The 1 page target has 6.5mm square individual patches and the 2 page target has 9.0mm square individual patches.  The colors have been randomised in ColorPort.  I can't distinguish between profiles made from one page or two.

I have not been able to find documentation on the DTP70, but I understand that it needs a 6mm high patch so it doesn't get influenced by the patch above or below.

With this setup my workflow is:

Print a target.
Wait 24 hours for target to stabilise.
Scan with DTP70.
Sometimes I do three scans and average the results using Argyll average function.
Convert Colorport output .txt file to .ti3 file using Argyll txt2ti3 function.
Convert .ti3 file to profile using Argyll colprof function.
Check result with Argyll profcheck function (I "pipe" the result into a text file and review the patches with DE >1.)
I check gamut with Argyl iccgamut and look for uneven shapes.

Comments:
I was initially worried about patches with DE readings greater than 1, but, as mentioned below, there are very few of them and, invariably, they are on dark colors where I guess I would never notice, even if I could.

The Argyll command, colprof, uses a reference profile as one of its input arguments.  I use AdobeRGB.icc but this year experimented with sRGB.icc and found no difference in the profiles produced.  Argyll allows a "shaping" profile and documents how you can produce a profile from a small patch set as the input argument for producing your profile with a larger parch set.  This approach doubles the time needed to produce a final profile.  I am not sure if it is a difference that makes a difference.  My eyes can't tell and I don't have the measuring equipment that could give a definitive answer.

I use Doug Grey's set of patches after he did some exhaustive work on very large patch sets to see if he could get a sense of the diminishing returns.  His conclusion seemed to be that if a printer behaves in a linear fashion then a relatively small patch set will be sufficient for it to model the full gamut that it can print.  Printers that have non linear behaviour need bigger patch sets to better map their behaviour.

My gamut volume numbers are lower than gamut volume numbers generated for the same paper and ink using i1Profiler.  I think, but don't know, that i1Profiler and Argyll use a different approach in calculating gamut.  In particular, it seems that i1Profiler extends the gamut volume measurement by showing profiles as producing an absolute black whereas my Argyll profiles never reach this low, even on the highest quality papers.

My typical average DE is around 0.3.  Typical DEMax is less than 2.0. Typical patches with DE>1 is around 1%.

When I first adventured down the rabbit hole of producing my own profiles, a retirement hobby that has extended my printing knowledge a lot, I was  concerned about how good (or not) my DEMax, DE average, and Gamut volume numbers were.

The best advice I have received from looking at this site and LULA is that the real test is if you like the results.

One concern I have is that I won't be able to run ColorPort forever.  It is no longer supported on my current Mac running macOS Monterey and have to keep an old MacBook Pro to keep it going.  This makes the workflow less straightforward as I need to copy the ColorPort output text file to my MacBook Pro to do the Argyll processing.  However, this is an infrequent task now that I have settled on a limited range of papers.

Good luck.

Rob Wignell
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Rhossydd

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Re: DTP70 + ColorPort + Argyll
« Reply #6 on: August 21, 2022, 05:17:04 am »

Yes i would work with Win7 32 bits, but i would like to learn from someone. Could you explain me your workflow with I1Profiler
Try searching back through the forum for DTP-70 you'll find a fair bit of comment on it.
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